Denied Education for wearing a face mask

[Sumh]

I’m on the NHS extremely vulnerable shielding category. My 12 year old daughter is attending state secondary school. She is being denied to enter her classroom because she chooses to wear a plain cloth face mask. She has been left outside the class on her own with little provided worksheets to work on her own but no directed teaching.

The DfE ‘guidance’ on face coverings in education August 26 to schools highlights it’s just a ‘guidance’ and not mandatory, that it is not necessary/recommended/ to wear face mask because it may hinder communication by wearing face masks in education,

“ On the basis of current evidence, in light of the mitigating measures education settings are taking, and the negative impact on communication, face coverings will not generally be necessary in the classroom even where social distancing is not possible. There is greater use of the system of controls for minimising risk, including through keeping in small and consistent groups or bubbles, and greater scope for physical distancing by staff within classrooms. Face coverings can have a negative impact on learning and teaching and so their use in the classroom should be avoided.”

but then fines of not wearing face masks in other settings are doubling, retail business staff now have to wear face masks, a legislation is in place enforcing wearing of face mask above the age of 11 in certain settings and plus the booth were cabinet ministers stand and give press briefing has 3 pictures, one is a face mask. All of this is an implied message to the public of how important it is to wear a face mask.

With all this message including WHOs recommendation that all 12 years plus should wear face mask, is it right that a U.K. state school should be denying a child from her right to education on a not mandatory guidance for simply taking extra precaution?

Both myself and my daughter do not go out without wearing a face mask which we have been doing so since March 2020 and she herself strongly agrees to wear one in school at all times for my safety. Having spoken to the senior managers and informing them of my NHS letter of previously shielding the school are still refusing, replying to me “it could open a floodgate!” but are they not digging a hole for them by denying a child education!

This guidance states for example when if it is mandatory to wear a face mask in school like corridors and communal areas but a child refuses to wear a face mask, then no one should be excluded from education for not wearing a face mask.

My child wants to wear one for hers and my safety without affecting anyone else’s liberty and yet she is being excluded from education.

Your thoughts will be appreciated.

I am shocked at the school's insistence that she remove her mask.

Can I suggest you post this in legal and tag @prh47bridge, @admission and @PatriciaHolm

These posters often assist parents with admission queries and might be able to help point you in the right direction here.

Personally, unless the school has a very good reason why she should not be wearing a mask, such as her own refusal to behave in class, they are being unreasonable. The suggestion that is might affect the behaviour of other children in the class or that it might lead to other children wearing masks is illogical.

I don't live in the UK and our school is totally reasonable and accommodating of the needs of individuals so I want to say I am so sorry you and your daughter are in this situation and for the lack of compassion on this thread. She is not putting anyone at risk by her behaviour and is not being disruptive to the class.

FWIW, my daughter wears hers while walking around but takes it off when she is at her desk.

How has all this been communicated because I find the premise that they wont let her odd unless it has been done in a way that has caused disruption.

Your belief that they should acknowledge they are helping your circumstances - well no that is a personal thing they shouldnt be doing

Also you seem to have a daughter who is highly anxious (and carries multiple masks both medical and cloth) that makes me think this wasnt handled the best at the beginning.

But above all OP even though your daughter should be allowed to calmly wear a mask please do tell her she is never going to be responsible for your health

Thanks to all for your thoughts, for or against.

I’m replying with my response soon. I’m glad to see there is solidarity out there!

Schools own admission is my daughter is loving, caring and well behaved.

Those of us who know anything about masks, we carry and change/dispose often to make sure it’s effective as intended.

We also know that when it’s cold it’s advisable to wear a coat when outside and most do.

Thank you

I’m glad to see there is solidarity out there!

What does this mean, OP?

Many of us are surprised at the school's approach & wonder about their rationale.

Very few posters, from my reading, however, support your approach & have tried to point out to you rage your understanding of science & risk on this matter is flawed.

And some of us are really shocked that you've allowed your daughter to be so frightened that she might unwittingly cause you to become ill, without correcting that & reassuring her.

• that, not rage

There is growing evidence that masks DO protect the wearer in that they reduce the viral load considerably. And growing evidence that aerosol transmission is far more prevalent than previously thought.

I agree with you OP, those children with vulnerable people in the house should be able to wear a mask if they wish.

I haven’t read the whole thread so apologies if I am repeating what has been said elsewhere. The majority of infections that are occurring are in social settings (which includes schools). The NHS staff in my area are being advised to wear N95 masks (Assuming not in a Covid Ward) at all times unless socially distanced or outside. This type of mask will protect your DC. They were available at Lloyds Chemist and on line. Not sure now. My DS wears this type of mask at all times at school.

The current government guidance is technically in breach of health and safety guidance Given now what we know of the disease and a school refusing to allow a child to wear a mask who subsequently becomes ill would find it difficult to defend that behaviour to the HSE.

Thanks, it’s all about taking common sense safety precautions. My daughter had pricey one time use disposable N95 masks in her bag and would use them only in classrooms. On route and outside the classroom as she is now is wearing cheaper 3ply disposable or cotton cloth masks.

Face masks do give some protection to the wearer. Those saying they don't simply believed the early days spin when they were trying to stop the public buying up the available stock

www.ox.ac.uk/news/2020-07-08-oxford-covid-19-study-face-masks-and-coverings-work-act-now

Oh FGS.

Listen to the science.

She just needs to wear it around you.

@Bloomburger the irony is that she almost certainly isn't wearing a mask when she is around her mother, surely? So the precaution that would have a bigger effect, isn't being undertaken anyway despite all of OP's alleged concern.

Why do you think OP's dd isn't wearing one around OP?

My ds has weak immune system. I always wear mask around him when I am ill. From way before covid, so I don't pass it on to him.

Oh FGS.

Listen to the science.

You mean this science?
"The study found: Cloth face coverings are effective in protecting the wearer and those around them."

Or just the science that you want to believe?

Science on face masks providing viral inhalation protection and from spreading outwards existed before East Asian 2003 SARS outbreak but then much more studies was done at that time and after by scientist in these countries, hence why they managed to control it then virus and this one swiftly. They shot fast shooting cameras and using many other techniques to see what happens when aerosol virus floated around a face mask on a dummy and tested on patches behind a basic disposable mask for sign of virus. Their findings was that the virus was almost non existence on these patches. We were reading these science in February/March whilst U.K. officials was stating science was weak on face masks. Is as if science outside U.K. was not science. We took common sense approach by choosing to be safe than sorry. It’s a nuisance but a hopefully a temporary nuisance. To date only 7 people have died of coronavirus in Taiwan, because they started to wear masks before even the government told them to. Whilst a very small amount of virus did go through due to longer wearing of a mask, the persons immune system was in stronger position to fight it off and eliminated it any further spread. This is now being agreed by scientists in U.K. and Chicago that low viral load intake almost works like a vaccine. Even if science didn’t exist, we realised that if you have to use a tissue when sneezing with force and it catches your stuff then surely a tissue will catch any floating stuff which is not being forced in. If we were all educated of it’s importance from the outset then we could have handled any outbreaks easier. There wouldn’t of been necessary for any lockdown and huge impact to the economy. Face mask is a nuisance but a cheap and common sense tool for everyone’s safety, primarily for our elders and those who are medically vulnerable.

I agree with EarringsandLipstick your reactions to all of this is odd.

What are you trying to say with this - mask use in Taiwan is a factor, just one and it did have other measures (things which also wouldnt work here look at the uptake of the app)

I am shocked at the school's insistence that she remove her mask.

so am I.

However, there is a lot of ignorance on this thread. Disposable and non surgical masks, do NOT protect the wearer, but those around them. The only masks that protect the wearer are called respirators not face masks.

Teachers made a huge deal about going back when no one was wearing masks, now some teachers don’t Want to teach a pupil who is ultimately protecting them?

How odd.

@Coughpatrol

I don’t think it’s the teachers not wanting the children to wear masks, probably a decision made by the powers above, teachers then being made to enforce the rule they don’t agree with. Happens all the time!

Utterly shocked at how many misinformed posters there are on this thread! You know the 'science' changes as more evidence is collected, right? Some of you are bleating out the same crap from 6-7 months ago when this all kicked off!

OP, I am appalled by your dd's schools approach. I'd certainly be asking governors (if you've already complained directly to head etc) to reconsider. Tbh, I'd consider the media too and I am not one to suggest that usually.

I'm a secondary teacher and also clinically vulnerable. Masks are not worn here even in corridors. But the schools approach here is to allow those that want to, to wear them. I wear one often, including teaching if I have a large group. Students wear them too, maybe about 10% of them. I've noticed this increasing. All the students have been very mature about masks whether they wear them or not and some have even made it clear they think me wearing one is sensible and wish other staff would too. In fact, they know I'm vulnerable and some even put in on just for my lessons (which has made me realise how much I love my job and school).

As well as her mask, I'd also be requesting she is potentially seated at the back of the room and preferably near an open window (if they exist!). We have had requests like this and everyone has been supportive

This is now being agreed by scientists in U.K. and Chicago that low viral load intake almost works like a vaccine.

🤔🤔🤔

Really?

Where's the evidence of this? I personally consider it quite irresponsible that you are asserting that this is 'almost like a vaccine'. I don't think you understand how a vaccine works, tbh.

Daily Mail:

Could face masks be a crude 'vaccine' against Covid-19? Scientists claim infections caused by smaller viral loads passing through a covering could build up immunity

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8713625/amp/Could-face-masks-build-IMMUNITY-Covid-19-Scientists-theorise.html

its not 100% effective though , Google the smoke tests to see how well masks really work lol

@EarringsandLipstick

This is now being agreed by scientists in U.K. and Chicago that low viral load intake almost works like a vaccine.

🤔🤔🤔

Really?

Where's the evidence of this? I personally consider it quite irresponsible that you are asserting that this is 'almost like a vaccine'. I don't think you understand how a vaccine works, tbh.

There are vaccines and vaccines.

It is true that recent research has suggested consistent/widespread mask wearing could have as much or more impact on the spread/impact of the virus as the expected vaccine will.

@bg21

its not 100% effective though , Google the smoke tests to see how well masks really work lol

That smoke test is just rubbish, it doesn't prove anything, that's not what they are intended to stop.

The video only 'proves' something if you don't understand how and why masks work in the first place.

Too many people are taken in by conspiracy videos like that.

At least mask would stop people touching their faces.