Y9- interest in work

[Aramox]

I have a y9 who professes to hate all school work, interested in nothing. It was much the same before lockdown. He does the work (usually with netflix in the background), but is just not engaged, and won’t look at any education-related stuff otherwise or find interests himself. He’s at a grammar where he is under-achieving there, has ten gcse choices but no interest in any of them. Is this familiar to other parents of 14 year olds? I read other posters whose kids do extra revision, read around the subject. Normal? Might things perk up?

One of ours really disengaged from several school subjects a bit later on (year 10), but fortunately she came to the realisation for herself that if she put the effort in, as she was actually quite clever she could still do well in her GCSEs . And did, including an A* in the subject the the teacher had told us she had blown all chance of. Her siblings had issues of their own during the same school year, but in neither case (fortunately) did this impact too much on their interest in school subjects, or academic achievement..

So yes, a turnaround is possible (unless you had to have him tutored up to the eyeballs to shoehorn him into the grammar, presumably he is actually academically very able). But... Has his current lack of interest been ongoing from the outset at secondary? Does he show (that dreadfully overused word) passion for anything else? Or did he used to be interested - in any subject or activity - and that has gone away? I would be concerned that there might be something more going on than just the KS3 / 4 syllabus failing to engage him.

@Aramox, yes, very familiar! Nearly 14 year old ds here, also at a grammar. Does the bare minimum, in bottom sets at school but not struggling. He gets what he considers to be reasonable marks in the context of his sets with very little effort. But he is also ADHD, so doesn't find concentrating easy.

I really don't think extra revision/reading around the subject is at all normal though! I also have a year 11 dd who's likely to get all 8/9s with maybe one or two 7s this summer. She worked hard for exams and put full effort into assessments. She wasn't hugely interested in any of the content though to be honest, and would never have done extra work by herself or read around.

I don't think GCSEs are that interesting to be honest - partly because in some subjects where the content is interesting (eg History) they have to rush through it because the syllabus is so huge. Also, there's a big focus on exam technique, how to get the marks, rather than interest in the content matter.

Also - in the case of my dd, I'm not sure she's academically-orientated, despite being very able. She's a people person. She said to me the other day that she can't imagine doing a three year degree in an academic subject so she wants to do something vocational like occupational therapy. I think that's fine!

Ds can get very interested in topics - he had to watch some videos about capital punishment for RS and said he found them 'compelling' but on the whole I imagine him doing something more active and less studious in the future.

So - it may just be to do with the GCSEs/school set up, which is boring. Or it may be that your ds isn't an academic type. Or it may just be that he's a lazy, immature, year 9 boy like mine! I wouldn't worry too much....

No passions, unless star wars counts, which does concern me. Screened for adhd last year, no sign of it. I think the school teaching is underwhelming too. How do you get teens interested in stuff! Especially now, but he’s happily hermetic at the best of times.

They don't have to enjoy school work or the subject matter - it's not compulsory. He may just have a different sort of personality, different interests. Star Wars is fine!

Is he engaging with friends online? For me that's one of the huge benefits of gaming and in many ways I'd rather my ds spent more time in lockdown chatting to friends, rather than with his nose in his books isolated all day!

In terms of school work, he just needs to achieve well enough to do what he wants to do next, so I think that's the key. Thinking ahead, working out what job/career would interest him. My ds is thinking of army/police so he does at least need a certain number of GCSEs and ideally he needs to be able to progress to do A Levels or BTEC. That's the motivation we're using at the moment. Plus praise for good marks!

OP I had one of those too. He did okay in his GCSEs but not at the same level as most of his cohort (although they had a bit of a blip in his year group and about 25 didn't do well enough to stay on). He stepped up to the mark with his A Levels (although still didn't entirely reach his potential). I think boys can be lazy and later to understand the implications of not putting in full effort. Maybe also this 'learning to the specification' suits some better than others. He may do much better when he gets to the sixth form and can pursue subjects he's interested in.

I am not sure that's a helpful response - I think you have to bide your time and hope they will come round to it themselves.

Some families do seem to be better at keeping their DC on a high-achieving pathway than others though. If you find the secret let me know!

Some families do seem to be better at keeping their DC on a high-achieving pathway than others though. If you find the secret let me know!

For some, it's obviously Wanting lots of money is good. So you have got to go for the kind of job which gives you lots of money (note, I'm not using the term, 'in which you earn lots of money', although I'm sure many people do actually earn it...). So you need to go to the right university, because those kind of jobs want the right university first, before any actual personal skills you may have. So you have to have the grades for the right university...

(Hence a fifth of the year group at certain boys' schools all apparently having a burning desire to study Economics at a very limited range of universities. I did Economics at A level and as part of my degree and yes, found some aspects fascinating, bit almost certainly not the aspects relevant to the ind of job where these days, where I studied would be the main thing getting me an interview).

@MarchingFrogs that is an excellent dangling carrot if you have DC who want to have lots of money. DS is not bothered at all!

Some children naturally want to please and some don’t. Some are motivated by money, some aren’t. Some are very competitive, some aren’t etc etc.

It takes all types. Not everyone needs to be a high academic achiever and often high academic achievers don’t go on to earn lots of money anyway. As inferred above, sometimes high academic achievers have very few social skills.

It’s all about balance. And kids finding their own intrinsic motivation for what is important to them.

Mine’s very reluctant to imagine the future at all. Being in a bunch of aspirational high-achievers has done the exact opposite of what I hoped.

Then possibly the best you can hope for, for now, is making him see that good GCSE grades (which he is capable of) are really a stepping stone to getting to decide which of his subjects he gets to not have to do at A level, rather than have that decision forced upon him?

Do you / he think any of the new 'T level' courses would suit him better than just A levels? Although I'm not sure whether those are being introduced this year, after all; there doesn't seem to have been any mention of them for some time.

If he’s picked his GCSEs he must have some loose idea of what would potentially interest him at A level. I would discuss A levels with him, indentfiy what grades he would need to get in which subjects to be accepted into the A levels he might want to do. I sat my year 8 down who also goes to a grammar and was playing way too much electronics and doing the bare minimum - and said right - these are the A levels you are thinking of doing. If you want to stay at your grammar you need an 8 in x and x subjects for GCSE - if you don’t get an 8 in these it’s not the end of the world because you can still do these A levels at the community college but that will mean 3hrs of travel a day on a bus and waiting around at bus stops. He also had to be aware that some of his friends might stay on the grammar but if he didn’t get the grades he won’t be able to. I reiterated to him that not doing well in his GCSEs is not the end of the world as there are always ways around things - ie going to different schools doing an extra entry year at uni etc - but if he wants to give himself as many options and choices after GCSEs he needs to study extra in X and X.
And so far it is working. Rather than saying he needs to do more in general, we are focusing on what he needs to do well in to get into the A levels he wants at the school he wants. It’s less daunting than just doing better in general plus he can see the motivation for it.

Completely agree with ittakes you need to tell him what his options will be when he finishes his GCSEs, ie what grades he will need to stay on at the grammar school (all 6's for my local one) certain subjects require higher grades, ie 7 for further maths.

What the alternative looks like - what other colleges are local, how will he get there.

This is the best thing about my son's school, they constantly ram this home, the better you do the more options you have. We turn that into currency. What does he like? Star wars, so feed into that. There is a star wars hotel opening in Florida in Disney World, does he know how expensive it is to fly to Florida, stay there, vist Disney's Hollywood Studios for the whole star wars Galaxy's Edge experience? How would he fund that? Doesn't he want to be able to afford the computer games he plays, the consoles? Does he want to be able to drive when he is older or just catch the bus? Does he want his own house, to be able to eat what he likes? I assume he is currently taking all these things that you provide for granted such as clean clothes, a warm house, food in the fridge.

Yes GCSEs may not rock his world but they are a means to an end. Ds2 is in year 9 but he knows how much things cost because we have told him. When we bought a sofa, or when we go on holiday, or bought a new car, all these things he knows cost money. He knows what a morgage lender will lend to someone, he knows the cost of housing around here. Maybe start with those things, and the reality that whatever job he gets won't necessarily blow his socks off on a day to day basis.

Oh I tell him all this! Have talked about choices and careers for years. GcSe choices he made practically blindfold. Literally won’t talk about this stuff with parents. But focusing effort on key subjects is a good idea. He’s very defensive.

@Aramox you may just have to wait it out, hard as it is to do so. I think he may realise himself at some point that he needs to put in more work.

DS got 'the shock' with his GCSE grades which made him buck up his ideas in the sixth form. He worked considerably harder, got very good parent evening 'reports' (not previously the case I can assure you!) and generally was an entirely different student to the one he'd been earlier in his grammar school career. And he did considerably better overall (points wise) in his A-Levels than some of his hitherto much more high achieving cohort friends.

OP, would there be any merit in considering looking at alternative state school options? Grammar schools aren't for everyone and I do think being a 'bottom one' (even if it is down to laziness rather than a lack of intelligence) can be soul-destroying? I do also think that grammars are more often than not most suited to self-motivated learners. If you've got a DC who needs to be encouraged to achieve their potential, a good comprehensive will probably be more invested in helping them to do so. That has been my observation based on DS's experience and those of friends whose DC went to outstanding (but non-selective) secondaries.

@NewModelArmyMayhem18 I’v suggested it but he’s refused that too. And our local comprehensive is lacklustre and druggy, which is why he’s at the grammar. Thanks for these helpful thoughts.