Appealing on anxiety grounds - advice please!

[Pebblecat33]

My daughter has just missed out on her first choice secondary school. The second choice is also a great school so the issue isn’t the school itself. The issue is that all of her close friends and even her wider circle have all been placed at the preferred school and she is devastated as she feels completely cut off.

My daughter has been having anxiety type issues for the last year. We have been mostly managing these at home and thought she was getting better but this has been a massive set back. She has been referred for tests and counselling by our GP and is seeing a counsellor at school.

We are just getting our heads around the appeals process and whether or not we even stand a chance. Any advice please?

Some facts -

We are currently 8th on the waiting list
Oversubscription is distance only, we are 4.3metres outside (!)
The late submission deadline is Friday 13th March, this could move us up or down the list
We live in the north-west corner of a housing estate, in the north-west corner of a community, in the north-west corner of the town! The school in question is more or less centrally located so the catchment area has geographically cut us off from most of the community. North and west of us is pretty much fields and farms.

Any hope?

There is hope, although much will depend on what evidence you can submit from health care professionals. The panel will be looking for a statement that says clearly that in the health care professional’s opinion your DD is suffering from anxiety and will be helped by staying with her friends. Otherwise, statements from parents saying that their child wants to attend the same school is their friends carry little weight.

What else is there about the school - curriculum, clubs, pastoral care, whatever - that makes it a better fit for your DD?

Thanks for responding

I’m planning on asking the GP for a letter covering what’s in her notes for the last year but it’s tricky as most of the stuff we handled at home privately. We’ve only taken her to the doctors when it’s got really bad, so that’s a few appointments last summer (although at the time we initially thought she had a heart problem as her anxiety manifests itself as chest pains, loss of appetite, etc) and then again this last week.

I’m not sure if a letter from her primary school might help as they’ve commented many times on how shy she is, how her confidence is poor, and how important her friends are to her.

The school itself has had a legacy of good investment and has fantastic facilities, especially for computer science, media, robotics etc. The school she’s been placed at is more “up and coming” so isn’t in a position to offer those things at present. This is definitely her area of interest, but would that even carry weight? I’ve read loads of stuff online about appeals and they all advise to stay away from comparing schools on that basis. It’s a minefield!

This does sound tricky, because you’re in effect arguing that your daughter has a social/medical need for a place at this school and, for that, the panel will expect to see evidence from appropriate professionals. A letter from the primary school will probably (depending on the panel’s view) carry less weight, not least because headteachers are usually discouraged from weighing in to appeals. The issue here is keeping primary school friends together is not part of the admissions arrangements or oversubscription criteria so you need to present evidence of why it’s necessary and appropriate in your daughter’s case.

And yes, it is certainly worth identifying aspects of the preferred school - like the media and robotics provision - that match your daughter’s interests (especially if you can back that up by mentioning that she’s already involved in similar after school clubs or whatever).

Thanks, I’m starting to feel quite defeated by all this but we have to press and appeal, at the very least so that know we tried.

My current strategy (have been mulling this over all day) is to appeal on 4 aspects, I know some of these might carry little weight/be ignored but hopefully together they might just tip the balance.

1. the anxiety issues, backed up by a letter from the GP and her teacher/school counsellor (if they are able to help). I’ve also considered witness statements from other parents, might not help but I don’t see the harm

2. personal safety. There have been a few issues around the area lately with gangs, bike robberies, anti-social behaviour. We feel that travelling to/from school in a group is far safer than travelling alone, even it’s only for a few weeks it only takes one incident to put her in danger. Plus her anxiety impacts her ability to make decisions when it comes to road safety, etc. (We haven’t got any evidence of this but how could we?). I know most appeals don’t care about this stuff which I actually find quite odd but again I don’t see the harm

3. she has a keen interest in computer sciences and robotics which this school offers as both part of the curriculum and as an enrichment activity. This is not available at allocated school

4. the “crow flies” approach whilst seemingly fair and impartial is flawed as it doesn’t take into account the actual geography of the area. This years catchment area severs the top north west corner of our estate, from the area of the town that we live in. Isolating my child from her community (difficult to explain without a photograph but north and the west of our little corner is just fields basically). Again a long shot but might be worth a try.

How does that sound? Is there anything that is likely to do more harm than good?

The good news is that it sounds as if you have an excellent chance via waiting lists.

For the appeal, her interest in computer science and robotics is strong as long as you can demonstrate her activity hand involvement. Does she do her own stuff at home? Go to a club? What!

Ditto her anxiety. The thing here is that you need evidence not just that she suffers/ has suffered anxiety but that being with her friends has helped her to manage it.

The personal safety approach seems weak in appeal terms. Zillions of Yr7s start schools where they travel alone before they get to know people and many schools are in areas where phones get nicked etc.

The admissions process is based on upholding the published admissions criteria. They can’t start changing their own rules within an admissions year and ignore their distance policy. It would set a precedent that could cause no end of difficult. You might allude to it being unfortunate that the policy has left her in an a different position to her close friends in support of the anxiety case, but I can’t see it as the way to win on its own merits.

Definitely worth appealing but the anxiety grounds on itself without a medical diagnosis is weak. I work with children and I rarely meet any that wouldn't feel upset/ worried/ anxious about going to a different school from their friends. It's a normal emotion to have in these circumstances and I would re-frame it as such.

As a parent I too would be upset if I was in your position but given that it is unlikely that your appeal will be upheld (ime) I would try and support her to look at the positives and speak to the new school early on. They often have good transition plans and some schools offer activities over the summer where she could meet new friends. They may also set her up with a buddy to help in those early days.

Good luck and I hope it goes well. You probably have a better chance through the waiting list as people usually drop off it.

I would focus on the anxiety and computer science/robotics points. I can understand your concern about personal safety, but the LEA is likely to take the line that the allocated school is an acceptable school, suitable to provide an education, and (presumably) the police are aware of local crime issues. Besides, you need to frame your arguments for the preferred school, not against the allocated school, so by all means mention this but don’t make it your main argument. Likewise, don’t dwell on the point about “as the crow flies” because that’s part of the admission arrangements and the panel can’t set it aside for one child. Mention it if you wish, but again don’t make it your main argument.

You could always make an appointment now with the GP if her anxiety isn’t bad at present, explaining all the issues and worries so it’s documented. Then if you need further appointments as her anxiety is getting worse be sure to take her back so that it is documented.

Thanks all

I still don’t understand why an appeal wouldn’t consider a child’s safety on their route to/from school as important but if that’s the way it is, that’s the way it is!

With regards to her anxiety, we first saw a GP ( we don’t actually have a consistent one as our local practise is unfortunately regularly staffed by locums!) last summer. At the time she had completely shut down, was pale, uncommunicative and was complaining that her heart was racing. Given that there are cardiac issues in the family and she denied that she was stressed/upset about anything they referred her for multiple tests and to a cardiologist. The tests came back clear but we had to wait 4 months for the cardiac referral. During the wait we got her to keep a diary of the heart stuff and she slowly started to improve. It was only when she improved that she finally opened up about the causes behind everything and we realised that it was anxiety. We cancelled the cardiologist as we no longer deemed it necessary and life moved on.

Since then we have kept a close watch for any similar symptoms or anything that might be worrying her. Other than the odd panic attack she’s been fine. Well she was until all this happened!

Following the school news she has slipped back into the same issues as last year. She’s constantly tearful, not sleeping and withdrawn. We saw a GP again a few days ago and went over the history. She’s been referred for tests again just to rule stuff out but this time they’ve also made a referral to CAMHS. Primary school has been fab and she’s started seeing the in school councillor as well

Of course the appeal panel will want every child to be safe, but what you would be saying (in effect) is that no child should be expected to go to the allocated school because it’s in a high crime area. The reason that won’t get you very far at appeal is because it’s an argument against the allocated school and you need to be making arguments in favour of the preferred school. In addition, it’s not clear that this applies to your child any more than it does to other children, including the hundreds already attending the school. So, mention this if you feel strongly about it but don’t make it the main plank of your appeal.

Is there a medical criterion in the admissions policy?

You need the Doctor to specify the problem, it's effects, name the school and why. This should have been included originally if it applied and fell within the criterion and was such a serious issue.

Yes, if the school has an admissions category for social and medical need (and not all schools do) it needs to be applied for at the time. Supporting evidence would be needed, in which medical professionals stated that in their opinion the child needs to attend this particular school. But parents can still use the appeal to highlight those needs as part of the picture of why the child will be disadvantaged if they don’t attend the school. In some appeals I’ve chaired, the LEA has agreed to take the evidence of medical/social need back to the MedSoc panel, who will decide whether the child should be placed in that category. If they do, the child will be placed in the (in our LEA) higher category on the waiting list, so even if they don’t win the appeal they still have a better chance of getting a place via the waiting list.

Actually that wasn’t what I was saying, sorry for any misunderstanding.

My point is that walking to school with a group of children she knows is much safer than being on our own. The area she’ll be walking through will be of the same danger level no matter which school she goes to so this isn’t an argument against the school it’s an argument for being with her friends

There is no medical criteria on the admission policy in our area, most schools are simply the standard looked after criteria, followed by distance.

There is no argument for being safer with her friends as she would be safe if you took her to school. The fact that you may work would not be seen as a valid reason why you couldn’t accompany her.

In that case, yes, you can roll it up in the point about needing to be with her friends because of the issues around anxiety and confidence, which brings you back to the need for supporting evidence from health care professionals.

MyDCAreMarvel - Unless there’s clear evidence that the child cannot do it, the panel will expect that any Y7 child will be travelling to school independently, as the vast majority do.

Whilst others have focused on the obvious things that are around what is different about the school from others I think you also need to do a bit of checking of the distance from school to your home. As a "as crow flies" distance the ability to measure to a very high level of accuracy (certainly less than 1 metre) cannot be effectively challenged. However given you are only apparently 4.3 metres outside the last offered place, it is worth checking on one of the sites on the internet that can do these measurements that the distance quoted does seem reasonable. If so then forget that for the appeal.
The other thing to check is what the school admission criteria says about how the distance is measured. Most will say that it is from the "seed point" on the school building to the "seed point" on your home, which cannot be challenged, but if it says something else, especially at the school end, that might bear further investigation. I have certainly sat on panels where there has been statements like "to the gate on the school" when there has been more than one gate of the school. Just worth a check.

Unless there’s clear evidence that the child cannot do it, the panel will expect that any Y7 child will be travelling to school independently, as the vast majority do.
@PanelChair yes I know, however if the op says her daughter cannot travel independently for anxiety reasons then it will be her not her dd’s friends that will be expected to accompany her.

How exactly do I accompany my daughter to school when I have to get her younger brother to school at the same time on the opposite direction?

As I said it’s quite evident that appeals panels don't give two hoots about children’s safety on their route to school. We will mention it as it is a concern but it won’t be the main basis of our appeal.

Just to clarify further. We are not appealing out of snobbery or wanting to get our child into the best school in the area. The preferred and allocated school are both rated outstanding, both have excellent process and systems in place to deal with transitions from primary to secondary, both are oversubscribed. Distance wise, the allocated is actually 5 minutes closer (walking) than the preferred!

This is all about her anxiety and her inability to cope without her friends, neither of which are recent developments.

As anyone got any advice about how best to get this across?

If you felt you needed to do that you would have to make alternative arrangements for your ds. Be that breakfast club, dropping at friend to take him, or a childminder. Unfortunately logistics are unlikely to be enough on their own.

Appeal panels do care about a great many things, but they have to work within the terms of the school admission and appeals codes. They have to balance the interests of the child against the interests of the children already at the school.

You can certainly mention that part of your child’s anxiety is that she needs to be with her friends on the journey to school as well as during the school day. But as LIZS says, logistics of getting children to school - especially getting two children to two schools - don’t carry weight at appeal and the panel would expect you to use (say) a breakfast club if it came to it.

Isn't that what I said? I feel I need to explain further...

Our appeal is primarily based on her anxiety. This is driven by all sorts of things, roads, heights, she worries about her grandparents, she worries about dropping a few marks on a test. She’s worried about making friends as she struggles to do this on her own, but when her friends are around she finds it easier as they give her confidence. She worries about what other people think about her. When she worries she doesn’t sleep, I find her in tears first thing in the morning, or late at night, she loses interest in everything, she gets panicky and shaky, says that her heart is beating too fast, etc.

She tells me and she’s told the counsellor at school that she doesn’t trust anyone except a few friends and her family. I have no idea where this has come from.

Last summer she became so withdrawn
, pale, had chest pains, that the GP referred her to a cardiologist. She denied that she was worried or stressed about anything, dispute her friends telling us about things that had happened at school. When we asked her about the things they had raised she denied everything and so we went for a medical diagnosis. Over the few weeks/months after that she started to recover and then we discovered the truth. She wouldn’t tell us at the time as she was as scared of being in trouble.

The whole thing scared us to be honest, we’ve done a lot of work with her since on the importance of opening up and not internalising her stresses. She still does though, and we rely on the reports her friends give to their parents, who report to us to ensure that we don’t have a similar situation again.

I’m worried about losing the link, as well as how she will cope day to day, yes eventually she will make friends but she hat damage is this all going to do to her in the meantime?

You’ve explained it well. I hope I’ve explained how appeals work and what panels can and can’t consider, as they are working within the parameters of the admission and appeals codes, so that you can frame your appeal in the most effective way. I wish you luck.