GCSE Options and EBacc

[Swimmum1206]

DS is currently choosing his GCSE options. We received the curriculum booklet today and the EBacc is mentioned.

I’ve heard of it before, but don’t know any details. DS had an assembly today and they were told it is important for entry into Oxbridge or the RG universities.

All I know about it, is they have to do a humanity, language and science to get it. DS is still undecided about doing a language.

Can anyone give me any more information about the EBacc or how essential it is for university entrance. As DS said, surely the universities would look more favourably at 9 high GCSE grades rather than several high grades and a few lower grades just because he had to do the EBacc?

And for my dd who is currently studying English Lit, RS/Philosophy & Dance her non ebacc GCSE of RS where she gained a Grade 9 was much better foe her personally than if she'd taken history just because its an ebacc subject.

DD is currently choosing her options. Here is the info school have given us about Ebacc. Not compulsory, just determines how you fill out your Options form!

Would second the no one cares. Daughter did it 3 years ago and once subjects cover never been mentioned since I thought at least you’d get a certificate but not even that.

Nobody but the high school cares.

When DD chose she felt pressure to do the Ebacc but Spanish was having her in tears every week. She’s like me and simply doesn’t absorb languages well (I can do a little sign language though so I think it’s visual learning more than audible for me).

So she decided to drop the language because years of tears over a subject you find too hard and don’t enjoy is not worth it.

Of course a MFL is a beautiful skill and gift if you can manage it, but don’t think not having it will cause no end of trouble. It really won’t.

@piggywaspushed - what a levels were students barred from due to lack of humanities gcse? My DD doesn’t want to take either geography or history (but will take MFL). I’d imagined it wouldn’t matter for university purposes but hadn’t considered the impact on a levels

inkythis is not true from school to school, but certainly worth checking as the year 11s I teach were - quite rightly- up in arms!

The reason subjects are doing this is so they get students at A level with skills of enquiry, empathy and analysis of people's behaviour. I guess we feel if they showed no interest in people at GCSE ,they aren't really the 'normal student' for certain A Levels. At my school, they require a hums GCSE for RS , sociology (although that has flex) , business, law, economics, and Classical Civilisation iirc (as well as history and geography, but they need the GCSE in that anyway). Normally, you'd expect students who want to do these would have done GCSE RS, history, business or geography - but not all of them have!

I'd imagine that essay heavy subjects such as philosophy, Classical Civilisation, government & politics etc type A levels are precluded if you don's have a humanity GCSE. But when I say humanity I include RS, Classics, etc whereas the ebacc doesn't count those. DD did RS GCSE as I said and she was told by several different 6th forms/colleges that if she wanted to take up history or govt & politics at A level she could despite of her lack of history/geography GCSE becasue she had RS.

her non Ebacc GCSE of RS : this is certainly where Ebacc all becomes really silly... Latin ran a successful campaign to be included , even though it is a minority subject. Music and RS tried and failed.

Dd did both music & RS. She wanted to do Geography but it clashed with French in one column and Music in another.

Dd1 school wanted them to do eBacc but she really didn't want to do a language so after lots research I realised there'd be no impact on her future if she didn't do it! She didn't do the language and did history and geography instead!

Thanks piggy, I’ll have to have another chat with her about it. I wouldn’t want her to rule herself out of anything at this stage. Her gcse choices are pretty balanced - triple science, maths, eng Lang & lit, german, art and drama so she will resist as it will be one of her enjoyable options (art or drama) that has to go. I wish her school would let them take 10 so she could take one as an addition.

Is RS Religious Studies? They call it RE at DD’s school and is compulsory for her as it is a faith school.

DD is doing 10 and she is taking both History and Geography and Spanish so she actually does fulfil the Ebacc criteria, not that it had any bearing on her decision. Her choices are very Humanities heavy but she loves essay writing and isn’t the least bit artsy so this is what she wanted.

RS is a GCSE : Religious Studies. Some call it philosophy and ethics.

It is no longer compulsory in my school they all do some RS lessons but unexamined) : it went into GCSE options.

inky , I'd suggest you check with the school. They might have entry criteria on their website too.

wish her school would let them take 10 so she could take one as an addition.

Don't wish that - taking too many GCSEs is just an added pressure on children.

My hunch is that the EBACC looks good for schools in league tables. DD has been put on the pathway to do it (11 subjects) - personally I think that's too many for her (as she won't bother with revision)

It's not that it 'looks good' new : schools are actually performance measured on the % of students entered for EBacc and the % gaining 'good grades'. Some schools jump through this hoop more biddably than others but it is all pre ordained by DfE (thanks to Gove) and also Ofsted , under the guise of their new focus of curriculum breadth and the advancement of the cultural capital agenda.

11 subjects is a LOT!

Thanks for clarifying @Piggywaspushed. It makes sense.

I agree that 11 subject is a lot. I think nine would be plenty for all but the super bright! But what do I know

New: you probably already know this, but in case you don't: doing the EBacc doesn't necessarily mean doing 11 subjects. It's only 7 (or 8 if you do separate sciences).

But you need to do 8 for Progress 8 (where the results of your best 8 GCSE’s are ranked). Some academic 6th forms will ask for a certain number of points from your best 8 for entry onto their A level courses alongside specific grades in certain subjects (although others may only ask for 5/6).

For Progress & Attainment 8 you need:

1. English or English Lit (double weighted if both are taken)
2. Maths (double weighted)

3-5. Any 3 from the following : Sciences (combined or separate), Computer Science, History, Geography, Language 6-8 Any 3 remaining subjects including extras from the list above (can include the other English)

There isn't a single university which requires a language GCSE. DD's outstanding secondary school had around 20% doing the eBacc. My DD did debit, but only got a 6 for Spanish. Luckily all of her other grades were higher, but it would actually have been better for her Oxbridge application to have taken something else instead guaranteeing her a higher grade.

Yes, 8 are needed for Progress 8 and I imagine most children who don't have SEN will do at least 8.

11 GCSEs aren't needed for anything!

It's not just the utilitarian argument of what you need for the next step, or the one after.

It's also about not narrowing the curriculum too much too young, what you see as a rounded education and how much importance you attach to education being rounded anyhow.

I think it is good that schools strongly encourage DC to take a broader range of subjects.