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Secondary education

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Original poster

Do Russell Group Unis not count GCSE Maths if taken early?

53 replies

basilbrush · 29/12/2019 11:41

Does anyone have experience of their DC successfully getting a place at a good uni when they took their GCSE Maths early?

DS school (state) would like to put him in for GCSE Maths and Numeracy this summer at end of Year 9. They moved him up to take classes with the Year 11s in Sept and he got 9 / A* in the mocks before Christmas.

Plan was for him then to do AS in Year 10. We were reluctant at first but then saw how much happier he was with the harder work.

However, recently lots of people have been telling us we could seriously jepordise his future as top unis discount any GCSEs taken early. And as this is Maths he won't have a core subject needed to apply.

The school are not sure themselves and don't have much experience in this sort of thing.

Can anyone advise?

Many thanks!

OP posts:
Panicmode1 · 30/12/2019 12:08

Yes, am reassured that he's not having any maths gaps, so he should be ok. My worry was that many universities don't count Further Maths as an A Level, but want you to have it if your school offers it, so I was worried that he would be disadvantaged taking Maths and FM, but the school and others have reassured me that as long as he does Physics, Maths, Further Maths, and one other, he should be ok when doing university applications.....

MarchingFrogs · 30/12/2019 13:19

Does the school enter anyone (at least the top sets) for the various Maths Challenges?

Even if not, nothing to stop individuals working through the stuff on the UKMT website - or look at enrich etc?
nrich.maths.org/secondary
www.ukmt.org.uk/search-api-res/papers%202018

Ginfordinner · 30/12/2019 13:27

My worry was that many universities don't count Further Maths as an A Level

It depends on what the student wants to do at university. Engineering courses do. And I expect maths courses do as well.

Medical schools definitely don't count maths and FM as two subjects. They are happy to accept maths and FM as long as there are two other subjects alongside - preferably chemistry and biology.

Panicmode1 · 30/12/2019 13:39

Thank you @ginfordinner. V helpful. He's probably looking at engineering or maths do he should be OK.

Ginfordinner · 30/12/2019 14:01

I would just look at A level requirements on university websites before A level options just to be sure.

HugoSpritz · 30/12/2019 14:06

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Original poster
basilbrush · 30/12/2019 14:20

HugoSpritz - what's PreU?

OP posts:
Piggywaspushed · 30/12/2019 14:25

pre Us are being scrapped hugo !

justdoityourself · 30/12/2019 14:41

My DS took his gcse maths a year early and it had no effect on him getting into a top uni, I see no reason why it would?

ALLMYSmellySocks · 30/12/2019 18:06

I definitely agree with sideways stretch. An able mathematician who is aiming for a top maths degree will soob6 be just as bored doing a-level as gcse. Also the mainstream syllabus won't offer much preparation for uni admission interviews. The one advantage of taking a few subjects early is of the student has an offer based on Step papers they'll want to focus on that (as step is actually hard!) without a levels getting on the way).

ALLMYSmellySocks · 30/12/2019 18:09

I also agree with PP uni's don't like it when students have had to retake subjects, taking early is very different. Of course double check with admissions.

BubblesBuddy · 31/12/2019 09:33

If a school cannot stretch the width of learning for gifted mathematicians, they don’t see them very often. Is this the best school for him? What calibration are the teachers?

My local grammar does have a few extra bright mathematicians and they do all sorts of stretching activities whilst staying on track for taking the exams at “normal” times. The students don’t get bored (Cambridge maths grads). They have the experience to broaden the curriculum within school. So ask what your school can do to broaden his learning.

Original poster
basilbrush · 31/12/2019 10:16

Hi BubblesBuddy - no grammar schools here, we live in Wales.

Rural area, nearest private school 50 miles away and we couldn't afford it anyway (I did contact them about scholarships but max fee reduction is 25% which is not much help!!)

Have been discussing with DH though and we have decided to go ahead and shell out for some lessons with a tutor to stretch him. Only trouble is they all have at least a 6 month waiting list. One lady I contacted said she didn't tutor 'gifted' pupils as it was too much work Confused

OP posts:
Piggywaspushed · 31/12/2019 10:20

OP, it might be worth having a chat with some maths teachers on here : @noblegiraffe springs to mind. Not sure if that tagging will work!

MagicalThinking · 31/12/2019 10:25

Just because he is going to sit GCSE Maths at the end of Y10, it shouldn't mean that he has to spend the whole of Y10 doing GCSE content. If he is already capable of getting a 9 then this seems like a wasted year. He could study more advanced topics during the year and just do past papers in the lead up to the exam. Everything builds on previous work in maths so it will just make the exam seem easier to him.

Even if you just stick to the curriculum content there is lots to keep him entertained - there are GCSE equivalent Further Maths and Statistics qualifications available. Then A level maths. For A level Further Maths, most exam boards have options. Edexcel, for example, offer further pure 1 + 2, further statistics 1 + 2, further mechanics 1 + 2 and decision 1 + 2. You would normally only take two of these optional modules but there is nothing to stop you studying all of them. Then there is STEP etc.

zzzzzzzx · 31/12/2019 10:29

I don't think the GCSE is the problem either, it's the A level. My eldest applied for Law at Birmingham and Nottingham and some others. Nottingham were not going to take into account her early A level (so would have to still get AAA) but Birmingham said they'd reduce her offer from AAA to AAC to reflect it. No one would fully take it into account and offer AA. It meant she has to take up another A level (fast tracking it) in year 13 so that she still sat 3 A levels in one sitting. We had no idea until some point in year 13 that her A in A level Maths didn't count and wouldn't have sat it early if we'd known..

However, my nephew did 4 A levels over 4 years (because he realised for his degree choice he needed to add in Chemistry) and for his Biology degree at Uni of Bath (and all the others he applied to like UCL) this was fine. I think for many degrees it isn't a problem but it is for the most competitive courses. Engineering may be one of those but I doubt Comp Sci or Physics are. It may only be Law and Medicine but the unis will soon tell you.

MagicalThinking · 31/12/2019 10:31

OP you could look for an online tutor maybe? Perhaps someone who is a current maths student.

Original poster
basilbrush · 31/12/2019 10:34

Thanks, MagicalThinking, this is useful.

At the moment, they want him to do GCSE at the end of Year 9 this summer and then AS in Year 10 and 'then A-level and FM'. They hadn't really elaborated any further on this last bit so that's why I've been increasingly concerned about the timing and Uni applications etc.

He got a comfortable A* / 9 in Mock before Xmas (95% I think) but as you say they could just give him different work for the rest of this year and next year and then he could sit GCSE at end of Year 10.

I think I will have to go in for a chat with them and suggest some of these stretching activities.

OP posts:
Original poster
basilbrush · 31/12/2019 10:37

zzzzzzzx - thanks, X post, this is also v useful info!

OP posts:
zzzzzzzx · 31/12/2019 10:51

It doesn't make a huge amount of difference but reading my post back I realised I said my nephew sat his A levels over 4 years when I meant 3!

Namenic · 31/12/2019 10:55

In terms of sideways stretching, maybe look at past papers of maths challenges and scholarship papers of various schools available online. Not necessarily to get him to pass it, but just as puzzles/challenges (though you might have to do the questions yourself or get a tutor to get the answers). I think the NRICH website has some challenges. Royal institution Christmas lectures (on iPlayer) was on numbers/algorithms this year.

Potential plus Website is quite useful and has links to ‘masterclasses’ that occur at weekends (though usually in London).

Lots of coding challenges exist online too. Good luck!

thirdfiddle · 31/12/2019 11:08

When he sits GCSE is really by the by at this point. A quick flick through the textbook and sit the exam, done. He could start A level work in the meantime, or perhaps better get involved in Olympiad style maths. Has he got involved in NMC or anything so far? Have a look at the NMT mentoring programme too, I think that has actual content he could be working through in maths lessons.

Pretty sure they wouldn't ignore it in terms of "hasn't got GCSE core subject so reject" but more in terms of "candidate has eight 9 grade GCSEs". The level playing field being how many they took in year 11 not how many hobby GCSEs they took over the years. If he's that bright unlikely to be an issue.

Techway · 31/12/2019 16:19

@basilbrush, how far does your ds get with the UKMT challenges as these are good prep for MAT/STEP?

thirdfiddle · 31/12/2019 16:29

(oh perhaps I mean UKMT mentoring - muddling my acronyms...)