School not going well - what options should I be looking at?

[SoTiredNeedHoliday]

We're in the start of the GCSE phase and i had always thought A levels would be a no brainer and then possibly university or maybe a college course.....
However what if things are not looking that way?

School is not 'fun' for them and they are not achieving the grades (despite complete family support and excellent support at school) it's like they just don't want to be there in a classroom.

What options should I be considering and looking into?

IF it turns out A levels are not the best way to go I want to be prepared with some positive options to move forward with.

No idea on career goal as yet but we are talking about it.

It is a bit early to be thinking about it yet, but either vocational courses such as BTEC, usually at FE college but some sixth forms seem to do them, or an apprenticeship. The school should start to have assemblies / careers evenings / citizenship lessons in year 10 to introduce options.

My DD is doing A levels but not really wanting to do anything very academic after that, but she has had a job in a cafe for a year now, which I think has given her a great insight into the world of work and running a small business, so I'd always encourage young people to work if they can, though it can be difficult until they're 16.

If A levels aren't suitable, then you do a vocational BTEC/NVQ or an Apprenticeship.

There is a wide range of BTECs (DD1 did Travel&Tourism), but not all colleges will offer all of them so you will need to look around. Worth travelling for the right one. DD1 had 1 hour's travel door to door and DD2 (y10, looking at Animal Care) will have similar at a different location.

Some BTEC/NVQs are very sector specific, e.g. Childcare, DD's T&T ones covered some very specific Travel ones, but also generic stuff like customer service and marketing.

They vary quite a lot in the written v practical so ask clear questions.

You can do a Level 3 with around 5 GCSE passes inc Eng&Maths. Otherwise you can take an extra year, start at Level 2 and progress from there, hopefully picking up Eng & Maths en route.

If you do well enough you can still go on to university but more likely to a related vocational course rather than say History or Biology.

Apprenticeships you learn on the ground and are paid a minimal wage (£3.xx in the first year). The youngster will be too young to drive so you need to factor in transport. They will expect a level of maturity as it will be a work place. They work in parallel towards a BTEC/NVQ It will either be day release weekly to college or they should allow time for doing assignments but some will be better than others at doing this.

Hope this helps.

Other BTECs / vocational courses include (not exhaustive list):
Computing, Business, Uniformed Public Services, Outdoor Pursuits, Health & Social Care, Hospitality&Catering, Applied Science, Bricklaying, Plumbing, Beauty

Often college courses are compressed into 3 days so the young person can have a related part time job more easily.

Extended Diploma = 3 A level equivalent (so full time)
Diploma = 2 A level equivalent
Subsidiary Diploma / Certificate = 1/1.5 A levels

Places offering A levels often offer a small range of BTECs so you can mix and match, but if too much classroom is out that wouldn't be suitable probably.

@SoTiredNeedHoliday thanks for starting this, as I’ve been thinking along the same lines. Ds is year 9 and in theory academically able (at a grammar school) but other things hold him back - ADHD, immaturity and inability to study for long/revise etc. I’m beginning to wonder whether A Levels would be right for him, although he could change in the next 2 years.

Ds has expressed interest in policing. He’s also very interested in sport and fitness so I’ve been looking into the BTEC in Sport (I like to be well prepared! Plus I’ve got a dd in year 11 so already in the zone!).

I think if they’re not sure of a particular trade there are some more general BTECs that can lead onto a lot of different uni courses or straight into work eg computing, business, engineering, applied science, sport, health and social care. Students who are borderline at GCSE ie getting 4/5/6 seem to do much better on these courses than in A Levels.

Thanks everyone! This is really helpful.

Where is the best place to look at finding out about BTEC's and all that are available... then I can look at which suits and then narrow it down to where they are offered.

What about apprenticeships? Where do I search for these?

crazycrofter policing is something that I think might be of interest to our Ds too, I looked online and they have to be 18 to join so I imagine BTEC from 16 -18 might be a good option.

Its such a minefield working through all this! Thanks for your help.

www.compare-school-performance.service.gov.uk/
This will help you find all the colleges near to you, and you can go on to their websites to see what they offer.

qualifications.pearson.com/en/about-us/qualification-brands/btec.html
This tells you more about BTECs and lists of what sort of thing is available.

www.gov.uk/apply-apprenticeship
This gives apprenticeships, but it seems to me that schools are often directly approached by employers too - (at least ours is).

Does your school have a careers person? You could send your DS to see him/her if you thought that might be helpful.

To put another angle on this you have said

School is not 'fun' for them

School isn't meant to be fun, it is a place to learn. How much of everyone's day to day job is actual fun? Ds hated PE but obviously had to do it until he left school, but still got outstanding in his effort grade for it on his report, just because he didn't like it didn't mean he didn't give it his best.

There are huge apprenticeship fairs that take place locally, have a google for one near to you and we have had stuff through our door offering places at technical colleges from our local council. School also did a careers evening where they have local universities plus apprenticeship recruiters so the children could talk to them about it.

Your son will still need maths and English GCSE passes and hopefully as many subjects as they can pass. As I have always said to my children, GCSEs are a game, you might not like it but learn the rules, learn what gets you "points" and come out as close to the top of the leader board as you can. That way you have more opportunities open to you.

I always recommend apprenticeships. If you can find one that interests him they are excellent options

Thanks TeenPlusTwenties that is all really useful. Yes, I agree a visit to the school career advisor might be really helpful. We have a career book that we are working through but perhaps speaking to someone more 'official' might be a good thing to do. thanks!

TreeSwayer you are completely right it doesn't have to be fun, but for some children, if it is not 'engaging' or 'directly related to life' or 'fun' it is very difficult to give it their best. That is where we are at and it is very foreign to me as, for myself the motivation to achieve as high a grade as possible was all I needed but I now understand that for some people that simply isn't enough. That's where I am at the moment with Ds, he is a very able student (top 10% of potential ability) but school just isn't an easy setting (dyslexic, adhd and 'traditional school' is just a really hard slog). I wish for us it was as simple as targeting to get the best result as possible. I hope very much he ends up in a job that he loves and wants to go to work each day (as I ended up) it would be terrible to have to drag yourself to work everyday. That's why i'm trying to find the best way for him to achieve the best results that he can and A levels just might not be the best route.

It's so great to have this site for us to gain help and advice! Thanks.

Do you have any UTC's near you? They are technical colleges and might be better.

I doubt you'll get a totally fun experience at any educational institution though, I do think that's a little unrealistic. If your DS has a tendency to turn off when he doesn't like things, that is likely to happen anywhere so you may just be moving the problem rather than tackling it, unfortunately.

many thanks Christmascroissant perhaps 'fun' isn't the right word. Engaging and related to the real world is probably a better way fo describing it.
For instance, geography is great as he often needs to gather fieldwork notes and samples and data then use the information he has gathered for a related project or essay, this is the type of work that he does well. He has physically gathered information and is then using that date. Whereas maths algebra - he can't see where he'll use that for example so it becomes a real challenge to do it enough to be able to be really good at it. (Algebra is a tough one .....other than it being a very important basis for further maths.... like I did at school, but Ds won't be doing 'further maths', but he does have to pass maths GCSE!)

Any advice on how to tackle that problem most welcome.... thought I have searched high and low and done a million different things but none seem effective!

Is your DS in year 9 or 10? IME students tend to have a lot of growing up to do during those years (yr9 is particularly difficult) and can be totally unrecognisable by the end of year 11. But I think it is hugely important that you reinforce the message that school isn't meant to be fun and don't make excuses for him. When he can't see the point (a common complaint) just tell him the truth - the point is to pass gcse maths and therefore have options in the future.

For practical suggestions, I'd leave him be tbh. Don't be hovering in the background ready with a list of alternatives for him. Let him come up with a plan of what to do next if he hates studying in school. A bit of responsibility can do wonders for their self-esteem imo.

I often tell students that I do a job a love. But I had the freedom to do that because I worked flipping hard at school and uni. Qualifications and grades aren't everything, but they keep your options open for whatever choices you want later in life.

Very true SpideHunter thanks!

@sotiredneedholiday our sons sound quite similar, especially re the ADHD. Ds scored very highly in the numeracy ability tests in year 7 but has consistently been bumping along in the bottom maths set as he just doesn’t see the point of maths. He’s always questioning when he would need it in real life. Whereas something like anatomy or nutrition fascinates him as it relates directly to something he’s into - fitness.

We’ve talked about jumping through hoops etc but he can be quite stubborn - he says he’ll be a bin man!

Crazycrofter they sound very similar indeed!!!!!
If you find something that triggers him to engage and understand "its a 2-year examination process where everyone has to do it if they like it or not and it matters what the results are as it determines what options you have going forward" then please share!

I dothink there is an element of feeling scared that he is almost finished with school but we've talked through that and like your son I get similar responses to the bin man comment.....

@SoTiredNeedHoliday does your ds give up easily too? We find that a good result in a test can give a very temporary boost to morale but he’s then so easily disheartened by any setback.

At the moment I’m trying to work out a way to actually help him study and revise as long periods reading just don’t work. Hence why I’m wondering if a course which is less exam based might be good, once we’ve got through the GCSEs - which is feeling very daunting!

I suppose one good thing about them being naturally bright is that I think they should be able to manage passes (ie 4/5) even without huge amounts of effort??? At least I’m hoping so! Although I’m not sure what it takes to get a 4 in Maths/English? Obviously 4/5 at GCSE for a top 10% ability child is an under achievement but at least they’d still have options...

It must be a lot harder if you have a child who struggles academically and doesn’t want to work.

that is all very true Crazycrofter I can't work out how to get the revision sorted it all feels "overwhelming" to him so it takes longer to start the study than the study lasts

One thing our Ds does which I have heard others say, it appears that he doesn't put in full effort to save himself from feeling failure IE he can always tell himself he would have done better if he tried with 100% effort. I think for us getting a 4/5 with his current attitude is all we can hope for I'm just worried that he won't get that even unless we can manage the revision and attitude!

It is a very difficult age to have so much pressure with all the hormones etc and now with social media always looking like everyone is out having fun ALL THE TIME!

Does anyone know where I can get study guides fro the combined science GCSE?

Also the Maths GCSE?

CGP produce lots of guides / workbooks etc
e.g. www.cgpbooks.co.uk/all-products/complete-revision-practice?sort=best_selling&quantity=36&page=1&view=grid&currentFilter=KeyStage_59&filter_key%20stage=KeyStage_59

You need to check which exam boards the school is using for each subject. I would also check that your school isn't offering some, though. A lot do and usually at a discount, as they can buy in bulk.

Has your DS had a look at the BBC Bitesize website? It doesn't suit everyone, but is a good resource.

CGP do a combined science revision guide.
There is also one for Maths. For maths though you can't beat doing questions.

Both of these come in either Foundation or Higher. I currently have the higher for both but think DD2 will end up doing Foundation for science (topped at 5-5).

For DD2 (y10) we sit down with a timer for 20 minute sessions. When the timer goes off we stop for a break. We try to have an objective for each set of sessions. e.g. Today we are doing 2x20min maths (objective to get through topics for a test she has coming up) and 2x20 RE (objective make a mind map on one of the themes).

Just 'revise Chemistry' is too nebulous. 'Learn rules for solubility of salts' is much more tangible.

For DD1 when it got to final GCSEs we stuck coloured dots on revision cards. No dots = didn't know, 1 dot = knew roughly, 2 dots = knew well. And then we counted dots to know she was progressing.

We are liking Seneca online stuff too. Not using it for maths, but using it so far for Science, RE and Food.

If it helps @SoTiredNeedHoliday, the predicted grades given at the start of GCSE courses aren't that accurate at the start of Y10 when they have only just started the course. It's perfectly possible for grades to go up 3-4 grades between now and the end of Y11 particularly in subjects that they like!
The most important thing is to make sure they are on track for grades 4/5 in English and Maths and then likely A level subjects.
For vocational options, my understanding is that BTECs are being replaced by T levels from Autumn 2020.

re T Levels.
Not all areas are moving, and not all providers are moving immediately.
See www.gov.uk/government/publications/introduction-of-t-levels/introduction-of-t-levels
(These are passing me by as the area DD2 is looking at isn't being offered to start until 2023, whereas she'll be starting 2021).

There's a good website called mygcsescience which was revision videos, multi choice questions and exam style Qs on all the content. If you can get the school to organise parent paid subscriptions you get a massive discount