How many GCSE subjects to take?

[trudylady12]

My DD is Year 9 now. I am wondering how many GCSE subjects do most students take nowadays? Is there a norm for it?

Thank you!

I'm mulling this over at present because I'm considering 11+ options for dd. I looked at a private school yesterday, which seemed fantastic and the results have gone up and up from what was considered quite average. Only on talking to the Head afterwards did she mention that girls can only take 9 GCSEs. Apparently so they can have the full breadth of education! I got rather heated and said that in my opinion limiting capable girls to 9 GCSEs is forcing them to drop subjects that give them a wider view of the world and therefore a broader education.

Much as the head boasts about the school not caring about exam results and league tables but the 'whole girl' (she did manage to whisper in her talk that they're in top 20 schools of course!), I can't help but think that 9 GCSEs means that the school can focus the girls to achieve higher results overall, which thereby boosts the school's league table position.

@Piggywaspushed, Eng Lang may be dull but you can't get a job or into uni without it. Try doing teacher training without it.
English lit is cultural, so is History, but you don't have to do History so why should you have to do Eng Lit, makes no sense. Never said anything about the "preserve of the educational elite" your phraseology not mine, but for an educational elite that wants to do three sciences, two MFLs and music, they are being blocked by the dunderheaded notion that ALL must do Eng Lit.
Anecdotal I know, but I hated Eng Lit, King Henry IV part one and the Alchemist's part of the Canterbury Tales, FFS!!! Failed it but did well in Eng Lang. Then went on to teach French A level in the days when the students had to do 4 books, so I have nothing against Literature per se, I love it and am a voracious reader of both fiction and non-fiction but Eng Lit seems to me to be so static. The English teachers in my school taught exactly the same books over and over and over agian and the kids hated them, they told me so. Probably not the teachers' fault. Probably more to do with the exam boards. THEY need a kick up the arse to find books the kids can relate to! (I'm just putting my helmet on here!)

9 is standard in my DCs' school. 10 for those who do Further Maths.

Well, you need to blame Gove for the current English syllabuses.

But, actually, you are wrong. may unis now request a 4 or above 'in English, for which. English Lit is perfectly acceptable.

I agree that Language is essential but don't think 2 years (or three) of exclusive study of comprehension skills would be a fruitful use of anyone's time.

No one is being blocked by doing Eng Lit ! It's not an option; in almost all schools it is subsumed into English as par of the core.

I do know about the teacher training. But I know teachers without a GCSE in English (or for that matter maths) . Because they have passed the skills test.

By the way, Stanley, you'll never guess what I do for a living?

Ds is at a state selective school. Everyone is meant to take 11 gcses. Ds is doing 10 as he has an SEN. He has mentioned one student in his year that has dropped down to just 6. I would be more than happy for Ds to drop another one but all is grades are fine at the moment so that would be unlikely.

Mine took 11 plus further maths last year. They included art and DT so lots of coursework.

Norm is 10.Plus further maths for more able mathematicians, and/or Latin as a twilight

@Piggywaspushed, you are playing games with us but I have to assume you are a teacher and probably an English teacher.
Well, as you said, Eng lit is seen as the equivalent as Eng lang but you DO have to have one or the other for almost anything, so I am not wrong, not that I care much!
And yes you can do teacher training without Eng Land or Lit GCSE, my ex-wife for instance who was French, never had it. but she did have an equivalence. But most teachers who went through the English education system have to have one or the other.
Eng lit is not an option in most schools, true. It is subsumed into the general teaching of English, true. But as you said yourself, if a student only needed to pass Eng Lang, they wouldn't have to spend hours in classroooms to pass it. They could then spend the spare time doing other GCSEs.
Tell us all, what was your degree in Pedantry or Hair Splitting?

I think 9 is a very sensible number and many private schools led the way in having their students do a sensible number.

Stanley - you are starting to sound rather deranged.

Sez you! I'll go back and put my white waistcoat on with the long sleeves!

If you say so.

My degree is clearly in being mansplained to!

Most people on her know I am an English teacher. I really enjoyed having English Lit and English explained to me!

So you are aware, the GCSE in Eng Lang is not 'counted' for league tables unless students have also been entered for Lit. Something to do with buckets.

I would also argue that students ought to be reading literary works for as long as possible : not only is it enlightening and culturally enriching, it's a very important aspect of education.

Most schools do Eng Lit for all and still manage to squeeze in a ridiculous amount of other subjects. the reduction of this to a narrow range is not to do with Eng Lit : it has more to do with EBacc, League tables, and options pathways. In a school like mine, students can genuinely do whatever they want. We recently reduced form 5 extra choices to 4, but they still get plenty of variety, and many do all three sciences, a creative subject, a humanity , a soc sci subject. Many do languages but the decline in this is, again, nothing to do with English lit!

You had a particularly dull selection of Lit choices at school, by the way. I can't believe that was GCSE, so am assuming O Level? It's a long time since Henry IV and, indeed, Chaucer , have been on any spec.

Stanley I thought you said (on another thread) you were leaving MN?

I did 12, I only left school a few years ago:

English Lit
English Language
Maths
Statistics (top set students only)
Duel award science (top set did triple)
RS (also compulsory)
French (compulsory for top set English for some strange reason, although it could also be a option choice)
Geography
History
Food Technology
Music (Btec, not GCSE)

My younger brother, who is currently in year 11 at the same school is doing 8, as funnily enough this system of potentially 13 GCSE’s was considered too difficult. This is at a state school in a deprived area too......

I AM leaving, too much "womansplaining" going on, but then I'm deranged remember, so you cannot be sure of anything I'll do!

Might even sneak back as a woman!

Baby But when you did GCSEs there were still CAs (and coursework?) in place which meant far fewer end exams. And possibly you did your GCSEs when exams themselves were modular and not terminal? It makes a massive difference.

Oh dear, back again, cannot resist! I never did GCSE, heaven forfend! I did O levels. even taught them at the beginning of my career before the "national curriculum" stepped in and forced all children to do an MFL, which was fun!
So what are we going for girls. breadth or depth?

And can some bright person explain to me, as I am a thick and stupid male, what the difference is between English literature, History, and any other form of "culture"? They are all forms of culture are they not?
Art Appreciation, Music, Ballet the list of forms of cultures is pretty long surely?
Must admit, having been retired a while now I never knew that league tables took that angle as regards Eng Lit. Being an MFL teacher I would not have needed to know this, so didn't. Anyway, the less said about league tables the better.

@Piggywaspushed, I am pleased to see that you understand why I hated Eng Lit. But it doesn't stop me and DW going to see Shakespeare lots and lots, as well as much other theatre. Just saw a version of "Taste of Honey" in Bath and then "Prism" in Chichester, which was really good, thoroughly recommend the latter if you haven't seen it yet.

Oldest Ds took his GCSEs in 2016, youngest Ds takes his next year and it does seem quite different now with the new exams.

9 GCSE’s allows most young people to study a wide range of subjects but still have time for outside interests without the pressure of too many subjects.

There are lots of men on mumsnet. Thankfully most of them don’t patronise other posters.

"The new exams" Hmmmm! Seem a lot more like the old O levels to me.
If I ever wanted a laugh I'd give my L:ower Sixth, or year 12 as we like to call them now, an O level French paper to do. Once they got over the shock I would then tell them that they would have had to have done it without a dictionary, at 16.

I always kept the smelling salts to hand in that lesson!

Stanley girls

Honestly? Really? Are you trying to be patronising?

O levels were only taken by the most academically able. The rest either left school aged 14 or took CSE’s.

Ever since someone whose name will not be mentioned said I was "mansplaining" I have given up trying to be less than gallant. But if you would rather "Ladies" or "Women" or "people of any gender at all but as this is MN I am assuming the majority of you will be of the female variety".

Or "people with no sense of humour who cannot tell when their leg is being pulled"