GCSE option choices

[AlexaShutUp]

DD will soon be making her option choices, and she is really struggling as she desperately wants to do more subjects than she is permitted to choose. We've had conflicting advice from various sources and I just don't know what to believe any more.

She is very bright and a good all-rounder. She isn't yet sure what she wants to do when she is older - she has recently expressed an interest in civil engineering, but also likes the idea of careers in law, marketing, teaching or diplomacy, among many others! Her main priority at this stage is to keep her options as open as possible.

She is really struggling with the decision whether to do combined (double) or separate (triple) sciences. She enjoys science but is really reluctant to give up some of the other options, which she loves too, and she doesn't know whether she might be "wasting" one of her choices on triple science when she could do something else instead that she would otherwise have to give up altogether. On the other hand, if she does decide to go down the scientific route later on, she doesn't want to find that she may have damaged her chances.

She is aware that there would be some catching up to do if she subsequently chose to do science A-levels, and that isn't a major source of concern. She isn't afraid of hard work. What we really want to know is whether it will actually make any difference to her when it comes to university applications, if she did decide that engineering was what she wanted to do. Would they look negatively at her application if she only had double science? She has been very clear that she definitely isn't interested in medicine, just in case that makes any difference, though she hasn't ruled out something like biochemistry/medical research.

If it's relevant, she would probably be looking at "top" universities and is predicted top grades across the board. The other subjects would all be good, solid "academic" options with the exception of drama that she just wants to do for fun!

Please advise! Any thoughts from university admissions tutors would be particularly helpful, but all comments/experiences are welcome. Thanks very much.

Some schools don't offer triple science so I don't imagine that university admission tutors will look down on anyone with double. I am a university admissions tutor though not for engineering or indeed a science subject.

Whether or not it's an issue for potential science A levels I would have thought is more of a concern. One thing to ask the school is out of sixth formers taking science what's the average yearly percentage of kids taking a science a level who took double science and what percentage took triple? If she's in the majority with double science then it's less of an issue than if she's one of only a few who took double. The teaching will be aimed at the majority.

At least that's what my science teacher sister told dd when she had the same dilemma. Dd took double science in the end and is currently doing biology a level, she hasn't found it an issue. She's in year 13 and said most kids in her class had only done double and I would say it's a very academic school.

Thanks Nico, that's very helpful. None of the schools around here have sixth forms (that's a whole other thread!), so all of the kids tend to go on to colleges for A-levels. It's a good idea to check their entry requirements for science a-levels, and also what the majority of kids go in with. Though as I say, she is prepared for the fact that she would potentially have to work hard to catch up.

Any views from science teachers also very welcome!

Triple science is very hard and it doesn’t matter what you choose for gcse as long as you get the grades so make sure she picks what’s easier. History is interesting but you have to write slot of essays and geography is more case studies and abit like science in a way . Geography can be boring but easier. My child wants to be a phsyciatrist but took dual science as triple science was hard and took up an option . She is mire than happy to study the rest of one of the sciences which she only needs for a level . She isn’t too good at science either so dual was the right one for her so she was able to get more higher grade GCSEs in things she was good at

How many options does she have and what are the subjects she can choose from?

She has four option choices on top of the core compulsory ones. There are lots of subjects that she can choose from, and I'm afraid I can't remember all of them, but she would definitely choose French, History and Drama. She is just stuck with the last choice - hovering between triple science, geography or Spanish. In an ideal world, she really doesn't want to quit any of them, but obviously, choices have to be made.

I do take the point that has been made about doing subjects where she will get good grades, but I think she is genuinely capable of doing very well in any of them. Spanish would probably be the least work, as she seems to find languages much easier than most people do. However, I don't think that should necessarily be the deciding factor.

Check with your local sixth form colleges. However, at ours as long as you had double science at a B grade you could do any of the sciences at A level, I’m sure if she got an A (or 7 as it is now!) at double science she’d be accepted anywhere. So I’d just double check with say 2 local sixth forms and then make your choice. When it comes to universities it’s all about the grades they get at A Level.

My daughter had a similar dilemma. She did triple science and gave up Spanish, or the grounds that she'd had 3 years of Spanish and it would be easy to pick that up outside school in later life if she wanted to.

@MotherDearest123: if your daughter isn't too good at science, is psychiatry the right career for her? Psychiatrists are doctors.

Due to a monumental fuck up by staff when Ds1 was in year 9, he is now limited to doing double science rather than triple. They were meant to be fast tracked if they excelled at science. They tried to push them in year 10 but the gap was too big.

So Ds1 is in year 11 (we discussed the issue with the head of science at school when they told us at the end of year 10 as Ds2 is in year 8 and is in STEM and excels in science too and we didn't want a repeat) and they have said it will not affect any science choices in the future.

Ds1 is applying to do physics A level at an outstanding sixth form, they have said the double science isn't an issue as they would prefer a higher grade in a double than a lower grade in a a triple.

In November mocks, Ds1 got a 7 in biology as it is his weakest science, and a 9 in both physics and chemistry.

Looking further ahead universities look at how a candidate learns not just what they already know.

Ds2 is about to take his option choices and he is an all rounder so every subject is a high grade, but as with Ds1 we advised him to look at what he likes as he will be doing that for the next 3 years.

Ds2 was told he could do history and geography but knowing how much statistical data and dates are needed just for history we told him it would be a heavy work load.

Her three options (Geo, Spanish and Triple Sci) are all strong choices.
I would wonder if she would want to study 2 languages at GCSE?

I am a lecturer in a science subject at a top university. For GCSEs we just count the a*s, I probably wouldn't even notice double vs triple science.

A long time ago at my own school, triple science wasn't actually a great idea as there was only one set taking it so mixed ability whereas for double the to set focused on the a* material more.

But we would be looking for a/a* in the relevant subject at a level so she may need to work a bit harder coming from double science (like, get the textbook they use for the separate science and work through in the summer before 6 th form)

Not what you asked I know but has she thought of joining a local drama group and not doing it at school? If she enjoys the acting element instead of doing it as a gcse then she could take geography which apparently is one of the most useful subjects for covering lots of bases

I was going to say the same as Bionic. That’s what my dd is doing. And she istill does all of the school plays as well, even though she doesn’t do drama as a subject.

At my dd’s school, the dc were advised as to whether they should do double or triple science, based on what the teachers thought they were capable of.

You've got to really want to do triple science to do well at it IYSWIM. It's a lot of hours of science with core + option so if she's not got her heart set on a scientific career I would say leave off and do double- top grades t double should get her into any science Al level if she has excellent maths in particular to go with it. I did triple myself and have taught all of it, it's brilliant if you really love science but it's not for everyone.

Let her do drama- every kid needs a break and it'll teach her confidence and other useful skills as well as getting her a qualification. I'd be wary of doing Spanish and French GCSE but only because I did French at school but also spoke Spanish through family and I sometimes got myself in a middle as words are similar but not the same in many cases! Plenty of people manage speaking several languages though so more likely me just being a plonker and French did end up being my best GCSE.

Might also be worth finding out the proportion of pupils who do double vs triple at her school. In some schools, they strongly encourage triple, and only those who struggle with science end up doing double, which can make for a challenging learning environment in those classes, and a student who would otherwise get As might not be able to as easily. In other schools, double or triple is up to the student, and uses up an option block, so it tends to be more mixed ability or setted in all the double classes, as there are many good students in them. Or if the school chooses the small number who are allowed to take triple and does it in the same number of periods as double, it can be very hard and is suitable for those who really want to do science and can work very fast through the material, whereas if the triple takes up an option and has more time allocated to it, then a pupil who enjoys science but wants a slightly slower pace might be fine. So lots of things to find out about how it operates at individual schools.

And as someone else said, certainly find out about the sixth form intake and the split between double and triple, as that will affect the level of teaching for the A-levels.

Does she like group work? Drama has more than some, and it can be off-putting for some students, depending on how groups are chosen, and how easy it is to arrange to meet up.

Sometimes the creative subjects can be more subjective and harder to determine what will get the top grades, which can be a problem if she is aiming for the top universities that need entirely A-stars and As. But it could be a fun one if it's something she really enjoys.

Has she looked in depth at the curriculum for all the ones she is interested in? Worth finding out the board and the paper, and then looking up the specification online, to find out what is covered, how it's assessed, and so on. A pupil who thinks drama is all about acting, for example, might be surprised. Or the history courses vary hugely in content. It might give her a better feel for what is actually involved - you could also look at revision guides in the bookstore and get a sense that way.

Wow, lots of good advice and insights here. Thanks to all who have commented, I really appreciate the input.

A couple of people have questioned the wisdom of doing two languages at GCSE. Is that because of concerns about getting confused between the two or other there other reasons why it might not be a good idea? I'm not really worried about her getting confused - my whole family seems to have a natural facility for languages that dd appears to have inherited - I did three languages at GCSE myself and never had a problem with mixing them. Her dad is also multilingual so she gets it from both sides.

Her science teacher has recommended separate sciences on the basis of her ability and enthusiasm for the subject. I will try to find out what proportion of the cohort does combined and what proportion does separate. She does enjoy science, and has particularly enjoyed this year because it has been a bit more challenging - she sometimes got bored in year 7/8 when they kept going over old ground that they had covered previously.

She already does drama outside of school as well as school productions etc. She also does a lot of dance. Dropping drama as an option and keeping it as a hobby is a fair suggestion but she is absolutely wedded to the idea of taking it at GCSE as well - she said that she wants one "fun" option in her timetable. She likes groupwork and would enjoy the theoretical aspects of the GCSE course as much as the practical elements. She has quite a lot of friends in year 10/11 who are currently doing the course, so I think she has a pretty good idea of what it will entail. Same with most of the other subjects, I think - she has talked to older friends about most of the subject choices she is considering.

Ultimately, it will be her decision, of course, but she is looking to me for guidance and I just don't know what to advise! The general consensus on this thread seems to be that the triple science wouldn't be essential though, so that's helpful to know!

And there's one interesting extra observation-geography has barely got a mention but she has flair for languages and science, you could be down to two choices just from that OP 😀

Thanks Heyha, I think you're right, Spanish and triple science are probably the front runners at the moment.

She really likes geography and her teacher has been campaigning to get her to take it alongside history. She is tempted, but she enjoys the human geography topics more than the physical side of the subject, and she spotted a topic on rivers in the syllabus which made her a bit less enthusiastic. She still hasn't ruled it out though!

Bumping for the afternoon crowd in case anyone else has any thoughts on the pros and cons of triple science?

Definitely check the requirements to do science a levels for the colleges, in my DD school they require you to have done all three sciences at GCSE to study a science at a level.

Regarding geography, I know your DD has a preference for human geo(as does my DD) and might be a little put off by the physical topics, however I'd tell her about what you actually do in each topic to reassure her; for example, in the Rivers and glaciers topic you do some human case studies on how countries deal with the economic opportunities and challenges of these natural processes. So even though it is a physical topic, there are human geography elements scattered throughout it so the whole course is definitely more human than physical in my DD's experience.

Thanks Taco, that's really interesting re geography, I will tell dd.

Will definitely check local requirements for a-level science. Have looked at a couple of local options today, and it looks like combined science would be ok, but I will check the others just in case.

I was going to start exactly the same thread but I found a lot of useful advice reading this. I hadn’t considered that the double science class might attract less academic students to the extent that it might become a mixed ability class. Hopefully there would be three sets at least?

My DD is also an all rounder with no desire for a science based career. She also does a lot of drama outside school hours. The question I was going to ask was about the fact that our school has changed from gcse drama to a BTEC. I’m concerned that BTEC drama with double science wouldn’t look good. She’s predicted top grades across the board. Doesn’t much like physics. Is choosing French, history and geography. Has to choose between gcse art and BTEC drama. Any thoughts? And sorry to hijack!

Interesting, Meesh, sounds like our dds are quite similar! No idea about BTEC drama, but have heard that art is exceptionally time consuming and dd is good but quite slow, so she has ruled that one out as an option.

I'm guessing that the BTEC course is a lot more practical than the GCSE, which I've heard has a lot of theory.

They sound incredibly similar. She’s interested in careers in law or psychology. She’s always been interested in arts/crafts but I wouldn’t say she developed a flair until this academic year, and her flair is quite narrow (fine pens and pencils, intricate detail). I wondered if she was suited to architecture but, despite being predicted an 8/9 grade in maths, she has no interest in studying this beyond GCSE.

My concern is that her ability in art is related to whatever she’s interested in at the time (currently Riverdale) rather being a wider interest. Her teacher thinks she’s amazing and has held her work up as an example, which has boosted her confidence and led to her considering art GCSE. She’s much more suited to drama....but it’s a BTEC!