School Sets - how did this happen?

[Cancook]

Hopefully someone will be able to help here.
My DC has been assigned sets for this year (8) for English and Maths. Even though they have a very high score in their report and are naturally good at maths they've been put in a lower set - and with English - always highest at primary in tests - put in a stupidly low set.
In SATS they exceeded expectation.

Sorry if I come across as showing off - not my intention at all. I am just completely perplexed - have asked to speak with teachers and wonder if anyone has any experience of this? I feel they have been let down and will be completely bored - which might result in giving up on it!
Thanks x

I think you are right to speak with the teachers. I'd approach this along the lines of "I've been surprised by the mismatch between the placement in sets and the impression I had gained from the school report. Can you explain what I'm missing?"

Hopefully the answers will be along the lines of "they've got lots of kids good at maths, the top set weren't stretched at all last year and all got 100% but don't worry his class will be doing loads too". Or maybe the prompt to compare his report will make someone realise there has been an admin error.

Hope you can speak to someone sensible without too much delay and get reassurance of some sort.

Hi Pythonesque,
Thanks very much for the advice. I will take it.
What I am mainly concerned about is DC ending up under achieving long term if not stretched.
Thanks again :)

How is your son's personality generally? My DD is predicted a GCSE 8 in English and is in Set 3 - this is because her teachers know she is happiest being top of a set rather than at the bottom (she's gone into a lower Maths set this year for the same reason). Because the teachers know this there's no worries about their expectations being too low for her.

Seems a good idea to ask the teachers about the reasons behind the decision and then see how it goes. But it does seem to vary with the school - in DD's school they seem to be always moving sets - other posters on Mumsnet it seems much more fixed and movement is more unusual.

What’s your dc’s take on it?

I remember a mum storming in to ask why little Johnny was in set 2 for maths when he got 96% and level 5 for his maths sats to be told the children in set one got above 96% and also level 6 (in the olden days!)

My own son is at a superselective and was moved down a set at science because although his exam results were higher than in the higher set he worked at a slower pace. The strategy worked as he just got 998 for his three sciences.

Has he actually had lessons yet? IME what the timetable says and what happens in reality may be two entirely separate things ...

You mention primary, but not Y7, is this his first year of secondary?

Teachers don’t generally put bright, high achieving pupils into stupidly low sets so there could have been a timetable error or setting error, or you could have misunderstood how the setting labelling works, or maybe they start in mixed ability groups.
You’ll just have to wait to see what the teachers say.

Why don't parents trust the teachers?

Because they are human and neither they are the school systems are infallible!

It could be set 3 out of 12 - or set 3 out of 6 which would seems a mismatch on the face of it.

Sunflower because sometimes mistakes are made? And because sometimes there's a very good reason for something, but it hasn't been explained well. When parents understand what's going on, they are in a much better position to be an effective part of the partnership that leads to a great education.

Are you sure that the groups are actually set by ability? We number (not my department’s idea!) the sets in each year group despite them being mixed ability and always have parents freak out.

Are you sure they are in sets for everything from the start?
I'm not trying to be patronising but every year I get complaints from parents about sets in year groups and subjects that aren't set but they still seem to have decided their child is in a low ability set by week 2.

Equally, it will depend on the cohort. At my last school over 60% of the cohort were significantly above standard at KS2.
At my current school there isn't that much difference between set 1-3 At GCSE. All were taught challenging material and all groups got a good number of 7s 8s and 9s.
I've also taught some supposed middle sets that out performed top sets on multiple occasions.

Have a chat and see what they say but I'd avoid any assertions that they are obviously in a stupidly low set because they're better than other students.

HPFA That's really interesting. Thank you. Maes a lot of sense. Generally a very laid back character. I will hear more soon.

+BertandRussel* Pretty surprised also. Not a cocky child at all but know they are pretty capable.

ShalomJackie That's great news .. in the long run!

RedSkyLastNight yes and was bored as has already covered the areas. :)

noblegiraffe Ah yes... pretty good last year. Excellent grade for maths.

Sunflower321 I'd love to but my DC a terrible experience in the past which has made us quite wary.. and I mean really terrible.

RandomMess Absolutely!

AChickenCalledKorma Bang on. Communication is totally key!

GiantPandaAttacks I believe so, unfortunately.

MaisyPops Not patronising :). Thank you - that's really useful to know.

Thanks All... sorry for my typo issues!

“Why can’t parents trust teachers”

Because teachers don’t always get it right and sometimes don’t always do things in the best interest of the child. When I was in school I was placed in the middle sets for most subjects (set 3). I asked if I could move up a set for English because the class was terribly disruptive and I was achieving the grades compatible with the set above. They refused, which made things very difficult and meant I had to self teach as the teacher was busy with the misbehaving children. I received A* and As in my GCSE after being repeatedly told I could “achieve a B grade if I worked hard enough” (this happened across many subjects). If I’m honest, it felt like they didn’t want me to do well because they were too confident in their own expectations of me.

Angharad07... and it's posts like this that are the reason I have my concerns. Thanks for your input. So good to hear your grades were amazing. That's not easy when you're being told otherwise.

I asked if I could move up a set for English because the class was terribly disruptive and I was achieving the grades compatible with the set above.
That's not always enough to move up. For someone to move up, someone else has to move down.
It's all well and good people saying I want to move up/I want my child to move up but for that to happen someone has to move down.

I say that having got good A/A* / 7-9 results with middle ability classes.

The issue in your class was the teacher's classroom management, not the set.

@MaryPops On the contrary, my class was the biggest and worst behaved out of all the sets and the teachers would frequently exclaim that we were the worst set they had. It was quite tiring having to listen to this being the type of student to sit quietly and behave. There was plenty of space in the set above but they needed some kids to set a precedent of behaviour so they could make attempts at regaining some sort of control- much to my detriment and their advantage.

And thank you @cancook! 😊