ABOUT TO FAIL A’LEVELS!- What next?

[Fabricanta]

DS is at an Indy and in upper sixth form. To give some background, he is bright and capable but as lady as sin. He coaster through GCSEs and managed 6A’s 3B’s and C all by the skin of his teeth. Started A’levels and inspite of so many warning. At home and school has continued in the same fashion, hardly any revision, never opens a book just does a few revision questions.

End of last term exams he got a woeful BCE. He decided to retake them and has just told me yesterday, that the E subject is now worst does that mean a U? The other two remain unchanged. Now this is where it gets really weird. Shocked I asked what school have said about his predicted grades and his reply was the head of the failed subject said they will predict him a B in that subject but he’ll have a hell of a lot of work to do. DS doesn’t seem bothered by this.

My feeling is they are managing him out aren’t they? How the hell can they predict a B for somebody who has failed that subject. He basically hasn’t even got enough grades to do a prediction, he is short one A’level and if he couldn’t get the E up to a decent B during the 8weeks of summer how on earth is he going to do it now?

So what are his options? Take him out immediately?isnt it late to join a BTEC course? Let him complete his current journey but then enrol him somewhere to retake? Can he do a foundation yr at a good uni? Just to add, he is an August born, I don’t know wether that will affect funding for further education.

I have not slept all night, very sick with runs and sweating that suddenly came after news arrived, so please be gentle.

Sorry about the spelling and punctuation typos but hope you get the gist.

Could he re-do the lower sixth? DS has just gone into L6 at an indy and 1 or two boys have stayed down the year?

What does your DS plan to do? Does he want to go to uni? If not, does he really need A levels - would he better off re-starting with BTECs or something?

It doesn’t sound like he’s interested. Is there any point in enrolling him elsewhere to retake if he isn’t interested in the first place? Also university is harder than A level so if he isn’t interested in studying now is there any point in wasting money on university?

He could start again on a BTEC which would mean being a year behind but it’s much easier and there’s more support to achieve highly. Or he could quit and get an apprenticeship if studying isn’t for him.

My son bombed in his A levels-di 2 years- didnt do AS as an independent. Then went to local college and did a 2 year btec and got the 2nd highest grade. 5 unconditional offers.

You will need to fund a BTEC- loans available- if he has a full level 3- but not if he doesn't.

It isn't too late to enrol on a BTEC but you need to be quick.

Has he actually taken any external exams of just internal ones?

B/C grades at the end of Y12 are not in themselves a problem.

The E/U is more of a concern. What subject is it? Is it exam technique or does he not know the material?

Find a bloody good sixth form college and enrol him. Either he is failing or the school are, and you are paying for the privilege!

BTEC is piss easy. It’s coursework based and they basically give you the answers because they only get money for you if you pass. Students are constantly monitored, it’s not all riding on one exam at the end of the year like A levels are. Switch him to a BTEC now before it’s too late.

Seeline - I don’t think they allow repeats at his school, also it would be too expensive there. Yes he wants to go to uni.

Big blue - he need some something to wake him whilst also ensuring he can go to uni, he does want to go.

Whitefriars - that’s interesting. Did you dc complete both yrs of A’levels before then enrolling on the BTEC? I don’t think ds’s can leave now anyway as we haven’t given notice.

He hasn’t taken any external exams yet, his school don’t do As’s just internal exams. I don’t know wether it is beneficial for him to sit A’levels a time all at this point, would it be better to give notice now and then withdraw him at the end of this term?

The E/U is in Maths.

With decent GCSEs then doing a BTEC will not hamper university admission. Look on the websites of the unis that he fancies for the courses that he wants to do for their admission criteria . Almost all except BTECS but the better ones also look at GCSE attainment and want As or Bs in XX subject and a good range overall.

Another way is to to A levels and then do a part 1 year BTEC. My son could have gone to Uni at the end of the 1st part of his BTEC but chose to finish and do both years. This was because he already had 2 full a levels just weaker grades and the 1st year of BTEC gave him enough UCAS points, however that would have limited his choice substantially.

Or tutor privately for a different A level as well as the 3 he is doing at school?

Can he do a foundation yr at a good uni?

AAB-BBB for Science foundation at most RGs, usually with limitations to stop people using it as a back door. Foundation years progress to the first year, so you just need to pass it, and there is justifiable nervousness about the lure of that for people gaming the system. So for science and engineering you need BBB or better but maths is often excluded, to stop people from starting the a levels for STEM and then ducking into a foundation year if the going gets rough.

As these are courses that normally require an A at A level maths, students from the foundation year need to be able to essentially do a level maths in a year, or risk failing the first year. Given sixth forms are staffed by trained teachers and foundation years are university style, and even for strong 18 year old students that change of pace can come as a shock, I doubt this is a reAlistic pathway for your son.

The main appeal of selective university foundation courses in STEM is for strong students who have picked the wrong A levels and want to change their mind, but would have done well in the right a levels had they done them at 16.

Ok. Maths A level in really hard. My son dropped his at the end of the 1st year- had got A etc. The old GCSE maths did not really prepare well for A level.The drop out rate is high for maths.

What does he want to study? Computer science?

I’m wondering if he completes his A’levels and then enrols Ona BTEC, how will he account for that time on his uni applications? Will it count against him if he does this or goes for a retake? Is he in a stronger position application wise I feel he leaves now before any external exams or it doesn’t matter?

Whitefriars - Yes. CS.

A student with BTECs who has an E/U in maths will, with a high probability, fail the first year of a STEM degree where the majority of the students have A level maths. With approaching the same probability they will drop out by Easter. This is why we changed the entry requirements of our degree so that even for students doing BTEC we require actual A level maths or equivalent. This is a very common requirement.

People will now cite examples of students without a level maths who got a double starred first in maths from trinity, or something. Yes, there are counter examples, and we reckoned about 20% of our BTEC students graduated (although often it turned out they had, say, an A at AS maths and a reason why they didn’t complete A level). But in general, if the subject requires a level maths, even if you can get admission without it you are taking a massive risk.

Keneft - thanks for that. You make some very good points.

Whitefriars - that’s interesting. Did you dc complete both yrs of A’levels before then enrolling on the BTEC? I don’t think ds’s can leave now anyway as we haven’t given notice.

He can leave, you will just have to pay! He did do both years, did 4 a levels in 1st year but dropped maths in upper 6th. Passed 2 with C and D and failed the 3rd.

Went to local college to do a BTEC in computing. It was an old style BTEC- just finished this summer. As he was under 19 the 1st year was funded. For the 2nd year- which was technically a new qualification- a top up he wasn't funded as he already had 2 full A levels. We argued that wasn't made clear and had they entered him on a 2 year course to begin with it would have been funded- so we and about 5 other didn't have to pay in the end.

He thinks he got a DD D but he hasn't actually been to pick it up! Ut may have dropped to a D*DD when they moderated - but whatever that is great. He got unconditional offers based on the 1st 2 a levels and the 1st year of BTEC.

Please ignore BigBlueBubble - I have never read such an inaccurate post in all my uears on MN.

BTEC is not piss easy, not all cpursework and schools/colleges do not get paid as suggested.

Op - I'll post in more detail later if you need further advice re BTECs

If he wants to do a degree in a STEM subject, he needs to find the motivation to start working on his Maths now, and bring his grade up.

Whitefriars - can I ask what is he going to study now since he dropped Maths? I imagine it’s no longer CS? His profile sounds a bit similar to DS.

Ha ha Mumsnet dropped the s. he got a D D* D

There are a number of different computer science type courses through- some were very clear that they required very high level of maths.

What does he want to do after graduating?

KeneftYakimoski that is very interesting.

In the end my DS did not accept the most academic uni offers as he was worried about his maths- although he could have continued at A level- he chose to drop as he didnt feel good enough but he did have Thai Scholars in his class which I think undermined him a bit!

Another issue to bear in mind is passing exams.

Assume, for the sake of argument, that BTEC is comparable to A Level but is just assessed differnently (which is in my view roughly true). The main reason people start a level and end up doing BTEC is that they cannot succeed in a level exams, but can in the continuous assessment structure of BTEC. If they use that BTEC to get entry to a traditional university then in may of the first year they are going to need to take and pass exams which probably make up between fifty and eighty percent of the assssment. You might argue that we should assess differently, and I might agree with you. But the facts on the ground are that the sort of universities for which the most common admission qualification is three a levels will have exams that students need to pass, and students who can’t take and pass high-stakes exams in a period of a few weeks will fail the first year. This is not a moral judgement, just a fact.

The funny thing is he actually doesnt mind exams, it’s course work he hates. But in this case he has ended up not revising either and flunked everything.

There are maths units within BTEC which if they get a distinction in can then open up a foundation year place? Or we got the impression that some unis were prepared to test his maths and make an offer based on that? And not all RG require maths a level for CS.

I don't want to out him as the course that he is going to do is quite small- but it worked for him and he is happy with the outcome.

It may well be that a college will let him redo A level maths with a BTEC and in a class where he is likely to be higher performing that may help?

I have one who I think won't realise Uni is not for him until he's actually fully failed A-levels.
Please come back in 11 months & tell us how he did, what happened?