Son just been offered place at grammar

[gramadilema]

I know this is maybe a bit of a luxury problem but we are on the horns of a dilemma and I’d love some mumsnet input .
DS started comprehensive (2nd choice) this week. Got a call today from grammar where he was on waiting list. Great, but he’s enjoying the comprehensive after 3 days there. He’s enjoyed his lessons and is feeling positive. He also feels he’ll get into top sets and will be challenged. The grammar will mean a one hour journey and that is the main drawback. The comp is 20 minutes away. We have no car and if trains aren’t running to schedule we’ll be stuck.
Arguments in favour of grammar are a proven track record, popular head, good attainment at A level ( average score B+ to comp’s C).
would it be silly not to take up the grammar? I have to get back to them tomorrow.

[FabulousTomatoes]

But not it 🙄

[LoniceraJaponica]

"An hour's journey with 20 minutes on a bike that has to be taken on the train and no car for occasional lifts if necessary is not fine"

Our trains won't accept bikes during peak travel times, so it is worth checking. Also, by KS4/KS5 DD had so much to carry that she wouldn't have been able to take everything to school on a bike.

[Chipotlejars]

Yes fair enough Fabulous tomatoes - if it were my child I'd still be making the decision based on academic performance and attainment and further opportunities, whichever type of school, state or grammar, were involved. I don't think travel should be part of the equation. Also agree with pps about "the learning ethos" too and whether it is seen as cool to study, as in my experience that makes a huge difference around the ages of 14 or 15 yrs with boys in particular who can go off the rails a bit if their peers are mucking about.

[Chipotlejars]

Never said the alternative was a sink school, those were your words.

[BertrandRussell]

“I don't think travel should be part of the equation.”

That’s just silly. What if the travel means a child can never play in a match or be in a play or go to a party? School is more than academics.

[HPFA]

Travel is not necessarily an issue - DD has an hour's journey but there's a school bus leaving from virtually outside our house.

Even then it's sometimes a nuisance and she did actually want to go to that school. If OP's son doesn't want to go he could become quite resentful of a difficult journey.

[Chipotlejars]

Yes certainly school is more than academics but travel difficulties can usually be overcome by the pooling of resources or other solutions when you get to know others travelling the same route. I am saying that imho academics should always be the main criteria on which to base this sort of decision.

I know this can happen in reality because I benefited from a car pool (return journey only when trains and buses less frequent) during years first to third of secondary (by fourth year we were all happily independent). Two sets of parents in the pool didn't have a car but paid petrol money instead.

[BertrandRussell]

I think choosing a school on the expectation that there will be someone local who can fit the double bass in their car, or whose child will be playing the same after school matches or going to the same parties is just daft

[Iamagreyhoundhearmeroar]

An hour’s travel time doesn’t preclude any of those things, Bertrand??
If it did there’d be kids all over London living like reclusive hermits

[BertrandRussell]

It does if 20 minutes of the travelling time is on a bike which you have to take on the train. My dd's journey to school is about an hour, involvinba bike at one end and a walk at the other. But if he has loads of stuff or has to stay after the last direct train I can give him a lift. The OP doesn't have a car.

[HPFA]

It sounds like your son has an amazing opportunity to go to one of the best state schools in the country

OP hasn't said what the school is so not sure how anyone would know it's one of the best schools in the country.

[BertrandRussell]

....and he's at an excellent school he likes and which has done well by his older brother already...

[Orchiddingme]

I have one child in a superselective and one in a comp- the biggest difference between them is not the pupils as the comp has a big top set, or the teaching when it's done, or class sizes, it's teacher retention.

My dd in the comp has way more staff turnover, no permanent French teacher, cobbled together classes with supplies giving out worksheets. It's a good school in every other way but this will naturally lower results over time. I'm still happy with it though.

Traveling an hour either way is something they do learn to cope with, I would be a little concerned about you not having a car, you may have to have a taxi fund for emergencies/going to parties or social events if it's going to be difficult for your child to get back to the area out of school hours.

[tubularfells]

Not enough time to read through all the messages but... DH went to a grammar (next town but 30 minute bus journey), hated it and got 2 O'levels. His DB failed the 11+, went to the local (walking distance) comp, had a great time with loads of local friends and came out with 10 O'levels. Other DB went to the same grammar and came out with 4 O'levels.

[Tinty]

@gramadilema

There was a thread on here a couple of years ago about twins, one got into superselective grammar the other didn't. He went to a very good comp which they actually moved to be nearer to. He was offered a place at a grammar 2 weeks after he started the comp. It was after a lot of deliberating turned down, because the Dtwin2 felt happy at the comp and settled. Only 1 month later it all went to pot and the OP then had to try her hardest to get the Dtwin2 back on the waiting list for the grammar. He eventually got a place and apparently it was happy ever after.

I would definitely take the grammar school place. You can go back to the comp (probably), you may not get a 2nd chance on the Grammar place.

[Tinty]

Actually I remember now the OP with the Dtwins actually had to go to appeal to get the place at the comp as well as move house.

[gramadilema]

Thanks to everyone for your viewpoints and sharing your experience . We let DS sleep on it and in the morning he said he’d like to go to the grammar, in his words because of the opportunities it offers. Also, slight curveball, because it has lockers and the comp has none, and he was struggling to carry everything around all day. I’ve given him lots of praise for dealing with the situation so maturely. He wants to get in touch with primary school friends who did not go to the comp after being on waiting lists for other schools and I’ve encouraged him to do that.
Just spent £££s on a second uniform and PE kit so I hope to goodness that’s it now.
As an aside, I am mindful of the wider social justice angle of this choice. However as a family we have come through various significant challenges and setbacks since the kids were born and DS has this positive opportunity which I want him to take. The travel is a real issue and there will be a taxi fund for social activities.

[Frazzled2207]

Wow. Well everyone's happy so that's great news. I don't think he will regret it. Best of luck to him.

[Penguinsnpandas]

Glad you've decided and hope it goes well.

[ChocolateWombat]

Oh glad it is resolved, with you all in agreement.
I hope he has a fab start - will that be next Monday? Many of them won't even spot he's just arrived as they won't know everyone by far yet.

And incidentally, I was very interested in the comment posted recently about the turnover of staff at Comps. I too am very aware of how high it is in many places - lots of schools seem to have barely any teachers older than 40 or barely anyone who has been there for more than 2 or 3 years. Additionally, lots do seem to need to fill timetables with non-specialist teachers and to rely on supply staff and teaching supervisors. Unfortunatley this is a widespread problem and even in very leafy areas, schools often find they get few if any applications for some jobs - it is even harder in the less leafy areas and in schools with lower ratings. These problems are less evident in the Grammars, where teachers tend to stay longer and there are more subject specialists. It's just one factor, but it is an increasing problem and likely to get worse, with the recruitment and retention problems in teaching - it may hit Grammars too, but likely later.

Anyway, very best wishes to Op and her DS and I hope they can enjoy the weekend, now this dilemma,nwhich wasn't even on the horizon last weekend, is resolved......just shows how a lot can change in a week!

[gramadilema]

Thanks chocolate. I’ve been touched at some of the very kind and open hearted posts on this thread.
DH had mentioned the staff turnover being an issue in schools at the moment and maybe less pronounced in grammars, I think a friend of his who is a teacher had flagged this up, and it was one of the things we discussed with DS.

[KnotsInMay]

Good luck to him, and best wishes for a quick settling in

I have to laugh at lockers as a deciding factor, he clearly took everything into account

[Chipotlejars]

Great that all has been settled happily op! Hope your ds enjoys it and he settles in well. The travel may well be a challenge in the beginning but where there's a will there's a way. Good luck to him!

[FrayedHem]

Best of luck to him, I hope it all works out. Are folding bikes permitted on rush hour trains? No idea how much they cost though.