What happens to Kids in denial about their likely GCSEs

[alardi]

I think this is a common problem on MN. Boys who think they can just breeze thru GCSEs & A-levels. DS has poor self-discipline & I reckon he's going to get a shock at GCSE results. I can't change him.

So... have you had a kid like this? And what did you & the kid do after poor GCSEs arrived ... struggle with A-levels for a while anyway -- but then how to continue if A-levels are a fail? Hastily find an apprenticeship? I just want to be prepared for possible ways to go forward.

What happened to NVQs? They seem like a possible path, but I don't understand how one gets on the courses for them.

Well some schools won’t have you back to do A levels with poor gcse grades as some MN posters have found out. BTec is the way forward in that scenario and E grade A levels are not much use anyway. Always choose a course you can succeed in. That may not be A levels. If could be an apprenticeship.

Btecs are sometimes offered at schools, 6th form colleges or Colleges of Further Education. They can lead to degrees or higher level NVQs. They are an alternative route and suit many young people.

Hi alardi
My son has just gone into yr11 and I feel the same way about him.
He’s dyslexic which doesn’t help, disorganised and lacks motivation but is irritatingly cocky with it - is forever telling me how much harder GCSEs are than the O’levels I did back in the 80s
He does the homework and revision etc but it’s a token effort, certainly never over and above the expected, just the bare minimum. Predicted grades are ok but not stellar - 4 to 7s but he’s a ‘high’ 3 in English so really needs to knuckle down.
Dp’s son failed 2 of his 10 GCSEs this year, one of them in a subject he hoped to take at A’level. He’d achieved mainly 4s and 5s so was also limited to what he could continue with at A’level This then had a knock on effect on prospective study at Uni. After an honest chat about realistic options he’s now doing a BTEC extended diploma equivalent to 3 A’levels in a subject he enjoys. It was v much a last minute thing and not because he’d had careers guidance and a plan B !! So with this in mind I’m hoping my own Ds will be visiting several 6th forms etc and not just focussing on A’levels - we’ll look at btechs too as way into uni

Alarming - what the school predicting / what grades is he getting for class work/ tests if school are not making predictions?

DS has just started year 12, so essentially year 11 finished two weeks ago today when he got his GCSE results. It seems like a lifetime ago, not just 12 months, that I was mother to a DC starting year 11. My advice would be to not panic yet. Panic if he doesn't do much work for the mocks, and doesn't work out from having done the mocks that he has approx 5 months worth of hard work ahead of him from mid-Jan to. Mid-June.
It is leaving it nail bitingly close to be so relaxed at this point, but a lot of DC are like that. however much fewer are after the mocks, and almost no one is by Easter.

Sorry alardi not alarming. (Autocorrect)

Genuine Question: if you have a kid who lacks self-discipline and motivation, is disorganized etc., what is the up-side of them going to university?

Don't BTECs involve tonnes & tonnes of home-study, lots of self-organisation and time management? Seems like it. Or is a BTEC almost all experiential learning, turn up like a job & can forget about it when you go home each day? The last is what DS is likely to need. The only homework DS does easily is assigned math problems.

I'm not panicking, but I would like PlanB so that I'm ready even if DS isn't.

BTECs involve assignments but they are way more structured than the work needed for A levels.
Plus after 'failing' at GCSEs it might buck his ideas up!

I would go round a variety of 6th form options (A levels, BTECs, and apprentice-providers (often same as BTEC colleges)) and see the entry requirements for each and what is available. For your DS seeing the second choice options may be enough to get him to buck up his ideas sooner rather than later.

There is funding for 3 years in 6th form education, so they can start something, drop out after a year and 'restart' something else if it becomes necessary.

Even apprenticeships require some level of written assignments. Some are done with day release to college, others with (supposedly) some study time given on the job. But still require work 'out of hours'.

Should I start a separate thread to try to understand BTECs better?

How creative is the BTEC work, & how self-directed? Does "structured" mean things like short essays or just single sentences? Is this Applied Science example typical? A science experiment is very regimented to plan, so perhaps would suit.

I’m hoping there will be a sudden boost of maturity to make him sit up and realise how important it all is ! He was actually quite surprised by the difficulty of some of his end of yr 10 exams - hopefully that fear will provide an impulse to take things more seriously

I only finally learnt to organise myself in school when I realised I might fail instead, I was already 14yo, too. I went from near-failure to high achiever within 4-5m. I'd love DS to do that, but I think he's got a different personality.

My son was predicted 6-8 but ended up with lower.

Luckily he got a 6 in maths and 5 in English. The possibility of retakes was the only incentive he had to work on English. (He's doing A-level maths) He missed his plan A school and subject choices but his English and Maths grades were good enough to have options.

In y12 he started 1 BTEC level 3 (equivalent to A level) and 2 A levels. I was worried about the BTEC as he didn't do well on his gcse coursework but he has Distinctions in his y12 modules 😱

OP, have a look at the Which Guide's information on BTECs -
"Quick Guide to BTECs - Which? University".

I think A levels seem to be on the radar much more than other qualifications. That’s a shame as many young people find their niche with BTecs.

If he cannot/will not write more than a few sentences, how bright is he? Being chatty, switched on and engaging isn’t the same as being academic. It also means he hasn’t matured sufficiently to understand what is required. There is no doubt in my mind that this happens at differing ages. No decent qualification will be acquired with a few sentences.

There are loads of descriptors of what a BTec entails. Get the local college prospectus or even go and have a look round. I cannot see the point of flogging away with the academic route (A levels) when little will come if it other than unhappiness.

Thanks for replies.

Are BTECs taught in a very structured way, do the pupils practice a lot in lessons exactly the same procedures as what they have do for course work (I'm looking at Applied Science L3 BTEC, esp).

DS is good at exams, but hopeless at revising. Having to systematically review, remember & regurgitate a huge amount of information is disaster. He hasn't figure this out, which doesn't help, he may not plan realistically and then we'll have to scramble with last minute decisions (I hate last minute decisions).

One of my closest friends flunked her GCSEs (wouldn't study), mooched around doing A-levels and BTECs for a few years and then landed in the workplace.

Out of our circle of friends she is by far the most successful through hard work.

We've spoken about it a few times and she felt she had to prove herself so always pushed harder. Eventually taking herself back to study and earning undergraduate and postgraduate degrees and professional qualifications while working full time.

Education isn't for everyone, and for her the shock of real life was effective.

If he's interested in the science sector then consider taking him to public events and open days to show him what is available. By opening students' eyes to careers out in the wider world they find areas which excite them and this can encourage them to work a little harder for the results they need. If your child is not motivated at school it would be good for him to meet students and organisations directly involved in the science sector and see what opportunities there are to start a science career at all entry levels.

British Science Festival - in Hull this year, 11-14 Sept. Free event.

New Scientist Live Show - Excel, London 20 - 23 Sept - pay event.

Imperial College, London - Science Festival - April 2019 - big event and everything free, you just need to register.

Big Bang Fair - 13-16 March 2019 - Birmingham NEC - free event, just register in October 2018 - careers advice for all levels, especially apprentices.

If you search 'BTEC Support Thread' you will find 2 threads, the number 2 of which explains BTECs quite a bit at the start.

basically there are a number of assignments per unit. You can get Pass, merit or Distinction per unit. If you miss reaching one of the Merit criteria for a unit you can only get a Pass. They pull out the stops to make sure you pass everything, but the Merits and Distinctions require higher level thinking skills (analysing and evaluating). For each unit you get a set number of marks depending on whether you get P, M or D. To end up with overall grade of MMM (3 Cs at A level) you need ~2/3rds to have been at M and the rest P. To get DDD you need 2/3rds at D and the rest M. And for the top grade D D D* you need pretty much straight distinctions.

Some things are assessed practically, and some written. There will also be exams these days, but a smallish %.

My ds did really badly in his mocks and that was the jolt he needed to get his arse in gear and knuckle down. He got really good GSCE results this summer I was super proud!
He’s not doing a levels now he’s doing the international Baccalaureate careers pathway which is an alternative to a levels - is there any schools in your area that offer this?

Really doesn't sound like BTEC is experiential learning or enough hand-holding so it won't be suitable, either. Maybe I can strike up a convo with the careers counsellor at DS school about most suitable paths for bright kids who can't revise well because DS is in denial he won't have that conversation. Then at least one of us will have a string of ideas what DS can do next, if he bombs GCSEs or drops out of A-levels. Thanks 4 replies.

There is nothing he can do if he can't be bothered to try himself.

BTECs have a reasonable amount of hand holding, but if someone won't put the effort in they won't succeed.