Question about the new Further Maths A level

[AtiaoftheJulii]

Edexcel if that makes any difference.

So, as I understand it, with the old A levels you could do maths, further maths, and then you could do extra modules and end up with additional further maths AS or A level as well.

With the new versions, it seems to be only maths and FM that's available. Ds's 6th form college get them to choose two out of further stats 1, further mechanics 1, and decision 1 for their FM options. In an ideal world, he'd choose to do further pure 1 and 2 over any of the applied options, and he's wondering at the moment whether he could do an extra paper or two. Obviously he can just study the maths, no one can stop him, lol, but is there any way of getting any credit for the extra work?

I don’t think so. The MEI spec (which used to do the additional A-level) just now says that candidates who do extra papers will just get the result from the best combination of papers.

Teaching Edexcel AS FM. Students sutvpaper 1, the compulsory core, then paper 2, the choice of 2 from pure, decision, stats and mechanics. I know there are always exceptions that surprise me, but I can't see how he could sit an extra half of a paper 2, or how that would be credited. If he wants to broaden/deepen his maths he can take part in competitions like the maths challenge. He could also self study the further pure options (there may be material to support this route, look for FMSP website) and perhaps show his school he can achieve in these subjects: there might be a way for him to study different options to other students, but very dependent on how able he is and how supportive the school is

Students sutvpaper 1, the compulsory core, then paper 2, the choice of 2 from pure, decision, stats and mechanics. I know there are always exceptions that surprise me, but I can't see how he could sit an extra half of a paper 2, or how that would be credited.

I was talking about the full A level, so papers 3 and 4. Various combinations of further pure 1&2, further stats 1&2, further mechanics 1&2, or decision 1&2 can be done.

(He's doing stats and mechanics for his AS next month, but obviously that won't count towards next year's A level.)

If he wants to broaden/deepen his maths he can take part in competitions like the maths challenge.

Yes, he's had some good results in the Olympiads over the years Hence wanting to do more maths!

if a student does extra module it is for their own benefit, they are not allowed to take the exam.

The MEI spec (which used to do the additional A-level) just now says that candidates who do extra papers will just get the result from the best combination of papers.

Ah, thanks noble - we can check what Edexcel says - if they're the same, then at least that way if he wants he could do some extra pure and it wouldn't disadvantage him.

Oh, is that what Edexcel says GHGN?

Seems a bit of a shame for those who might have done 15 or 18 units previously.

I did all the training and launch events with Edexcel and I asked this question myself because I always had a couple of students doing extra modules every year with the old spec. If my memory is working on a Saturday night then that is what was said.

Do you have a plan for this year's couple of y12 keen kids then? Or do you think the new spec will be challenging/time-consuming enough?

I don't know for sure, but I think if he's thinking about cambridge going as far as he can with mechanics would make life easier in his first year.

He really wants to do computing, but also doesn't really want to stop doing maths. Told me today that it upsets him to think that there's maths he's not going to get to learn! He might be interested in Cambridge for computer science, but STEP puts him off there for maths or CS+maths. Although actually maybe STEP would be a good way to stretch himself further.

Get him to look at STEP. My son is interested and I have been looking at the questions. STEP I is much harder than A level, but very interesting.

I have never been a big fan of doing the Additional FM. All the students I knew that set out to do 18 ended up with 15 modules. I did 14 when I did my A Level by self studying D1 and D2 as it was easy for me. I attempted two extra Mechanics modules but gave up in the end because it was such a slog. There is a lot of Physics/Mechanics if one plans to do Maths at Cambridge so yes Physics and Mechanics are recommended.

I just moved school and in this one, I don’t think I will have anyone doing extra modules at least for the first sitting. I teach them MAT, AEA and STEP 1 in year 12. If anyone wants to go for Cambridge Maths then we will do STEP 2 and 3 in year 13. That is the current plan. It might well change in the future depending on what the papers will look like in the summer. I thought it won’t be much more difficult but the Specimen papers did make me feel concerned.

GHGN,

You teach STEP? My son's college does not, it has to be self taught. Are you in a state school?

Btw if he likes computing and is that good at Maths, has he tried any of the IOI style problems? It can keep him busy for hours and I am certainly talking from experience.

Thanks, that's all helpful and interesting

TheFrendo I used to be but private schools pay more so I sold my soul and went with the money :)

I don’t teach it explicitly but throwing in a lot of STEP and MAT problems as extension will keep my students busy so I can do puzzles for fun in the meantime. On a serious note, any decent teacher can do the same because STEP 1 and MAT papers come with details solutions. The teacher only need to give it to the student and let them get on with it. If the student gets stuck then give them a hint. It is not that difficult to do, just a little bit of effort.

No, I doubt he has looked at IOI stuff at all - i just had to do a quick Google to find out what it was! I will definitely show him that, thanks again. He's done some Project Euler problems previously.

IOI is the International Olympiad in Informatic, the equivalent of the International Maths Olympiad. There is a UK Olympiad I think, similar to the BMOs.

GHGN,

Thanks.

I can help my son, but the STEP questions are hard compared to Maths or FM A level, and I feel a little bit fear when looking at STEP II & III. Keep calm and carry on.

Would your able Y12s be able to complete 4 STEP I question?

2 can do it easily. A few more could if they must do the exam and practise properly. Some of them are taking the AEA paper in a few weeks so to speak. However, you need to take into account that I teach in a selective school that historically tends to be in the top 30-50 in the country for A Level results. They receive every little help they can get in a class of 5 to maximum 8 students.

Thanks. I am interested in the comparison. The class size is the same (only 8 doing FM out of 220 cohort). All got 9s at GCSE. The A level teaching appears good and my son has very good results. The lack of push for STEP worries me.

If only 8 out of 220 doing FM, assuming that 220 in the lower sixth then it is not a very popular subject. Therefore, it is quite common for teachers not having to deal with STEP on a regular basis. My last school had around 120 doing Maths and 30-40 doing FM in a cohort of 200. It was quite normal to have anything from 6 to 10 students per year requiring STEP plus a lot more requiring support for other entrance exams. In my current one, although we have quite a few Oxbridge offers every year, very few are for STEM subjects and Maths offers are almost non-existent. Because of this, only a few of us are equipped to deal with this level of Maths if a student comes and asks a question. The teachers in your son’s school might be able to do it but if they don’t do it regularly, they will forget things or feel less confident when dealing with it.

As a starting point, drfrostmaths website is a good place to start with, especially the materials for his Zeta club. It is a bit too much in some aspects but overall it is very good. The madasmaths website is the next place to visit, especially the harder a level paper that he made and the booklets for each topic. After that the booklets by Stephen Siklos will set you on the way to do STEP papers. I am not sure if the STEP correspondence course is still running or not but it is another place to go to.

with the old A levels you could do maths, further maths, and then you could do extra modules and end up with additional further maths AS or A level as well.
Not sure this is true. DS did the old A levels and did a number of extra FM modules that were not on the curriculum at college. Self taught and sat the exams. They were simply put into the pool of module grades and the best ones used for the Maths and FM A levels. They didn't add up the unused ones to make another AS.

It was the OCR MEI syllabus who gave an extra AS/A-level for 15 or 18 modules taken. if you did the normal OCR syllabus (or other exam boards) you didn’t get extra qualifications as far as I’m aware.

I think only Edexcel and MEI had up to 18 modules. None other exam boards had 18 so it did not exist. If you google Edexcel Additional Further Maths then there are plenty of information on this.