Boarding School

[RosieWoodCelt]

DH and I are choosing schools for daughters 10 and 9. We don't want state education as both think it underachieves and lacks proper discipline. Same applies to grammars. Eldest is exceptionally bright and we want a boarding education where she will be pushed hard academically from day 1. From looking at leagues Wycombe Abbey seems top. Anyone able to advise?

[Zodlebud]

That is interesting. I received an email from WA this week (still on their mailing list) saying that she was no longer able to be a guest speaker at an event due to a three day ISI inspection.

[PotteringAlong]

If you want local for ease of exeats etc have you looked at Malvern st James?

[JackieReacher]

Zodle- the governors sent a mass email last week saying she was going by the end of the month, i.e. April. Maybe she is doing IsI in her final week, as penance?!

[Bobbybobbins]

Not sure why it has been mentioned that A levels are 'dumbed down' so state schools can claim good results - the new specs on A level are infinitely more challenging than the previous incarnations. The Eng Lit spec I teach at A level is far harder than the A level spec I studied myself.

[RosieWoodCelt]

Hi PotteringAlong MSTJ is a thought. The exeat issue very relevant I agree. And MSTJ is boarding which is important. Hadn't really considered Malvern but - yes - thank you. Will facetime DH about - if he is speaking that is - not the best week ever!

[GaribaldiGirl]

I’m sure you will have thought of this but consider how you and your daughters feel about the sport on offer. Boarding schools devote a lot of hours to it.
My children don’t like conventional ball sports so finding schools where they didn’t have to play lacrosse/hockey/rugby all the time makes a difference. I remember endless miserable hours on the hockey pitch when I was at school.
Some are really good at offering alternatives. Others less so.
Two of mine like riding and that was a big factor.
If your girls are classic sporty girls it’s perhaps much easier.

By the way I meant children at boarding schools are ACADEMICALLY spoon fed. They have long prep sessions supervised by teachers who can step in and help. Hence the good results. Children at day schools have to self motivate to get their work done at home. Unless their parents are really good at making them, which I suspect is very few.

[RosieWoodCelt]

Sport issue is interesting. I remember hours playing lax and not enjoying so take your point 100%. DD loves riding and pony club and have noticed CLC offers that as it does ski-racing and also girls' cricket. Seems to have a wide view of sport. The point about supervised prep. is also interesting. Shows a major benefit of independent schools who ensure work is done and on time. DD face timed last night and have told her have booked some pen days this term at various schools so is excited.

[cantkeepawayforever]

Shows a major benefit of independent schools who ensure work is done and on time.

Um - no. I appreciate that you don't move in the state school world and so speak out of ignorance and what those around you say, rather than out of malice, but that is simply not true. The vast majority of good state schools ensure that work is done, at high quality, and on time.

The point the previous poster made was about day vs boarding schools. Supervised prep in boarding schools takes doing the work out of the pupil's control - they HAVE to do it and essentially have 'lesson time' in which to do it. ALL day schools, state or private, do not have that opportunity, and pupils thus have to be more self-motivated.

[cantkeepawayforever]

(The only exception would be day pupils at primarily boarding schools, as those day pupils often attend prep too. I know that at my old school, with its 8.30am - 6.45 pm school day for both boarders and day girls, and Saturday morning school, all day girls did prep at school, although if very sporting / very musical they would, as we did, also have to do unsupervised prep after supper and at weekends in the boarding houses)

[GaribaldiGirl]

I would like to shadow a tiger mother for a week to see how they get their day school children to do their homework.

All efforts by me are totally ineffective.

[EalingBroadway]

@GaribaldiGirl I would respectfully disagree on the academics.

Those I know at day schools (London and home counties, especially the elite academic schools) have tutoring at least twice a week and sometimes over weekends, usually in 2 subjects. Particularly in Maths. If a child is borderline for a top set the tutor will make sure that their place is guaranteed and will tailor work to particular academic weaknesses. The parents cherry pick the very best tutors who are often more like mentors and on speed dial for exam season over the weekends etc. For some this continues even throughout university, yes really. Those that might have got the equivalent of an A star in a day school will likely get a A at boarding school IME.

This sort of 'coaching' just isn't possible at boarding school during term time anyway. When you say Prep sessions are supervised by teachers, often that means a house parent or assistant house parent who won't have time to really get involved with showing a child 'how', there just isn't time and they won't necessarily know 'how'.

In fact I would say that children slightly underachieve (if that's the right word) academically at most boarding schools because there isn't the 'support' that is more accessible to day pupils. Their schedule, at the best boarding schools will be packed with all sorts of things, not just academics. I know day school parents who have Oxbridge in mind from about Y6 and 'make it so' with early planning and specialised tuition.The thought being if the child misses out they'll get to a Uni on the next tier down very easily etc. These 'interested'/helicopter type parents also help 'make it so' with music and sport IME again sorting out the elite events/coaching and ferrying children around accordingly.

Children are pretty much on their own and have to do the work in the time allowed at boarding school. If they can't keep up they are moved down a set etc. They pick up life skills that will likely help them enormously later on. There are sporting opportunities and musical opportunities but the child will need the motivation and the maturity to take full advantage of both. Depends on what you and your family value and are after.

[SchnitzelVonKrumm]

OP what makes you feel qualified to make all these sweeping statements about state schools when clearly neither you nor your DH has ever set foot in one?

[SchnitzelVonKrumm]

Oh and FWIW I have several friends with children in top London day schools. They've all been told at different points that they need to pay for additional tuition. Which makes me pretty sceptical about the general quality of teaching.

[RosieWoodCelt]

GaribaldiGirl I would also love see a Tiger Mother get DD to do prep efficiently and on time. That is why supervised prep at school is such a valuable thing

[GaribaldiGirl]

That’s interesting and I see your point - but it’s not my experience at all. My daughters went to independent day schools up to GCSE and nobody was tutored, well maybe a couple of girls on a subject they struggle in. I suspect lots were tutored to get in though.

One of my sons is at the local comp and don’t know of anyone being tutored (except him!). They finish at 3.10pm so even a few hours tutoring a week wouldn’t come close to the many hours a child at boarding school is in lessons (including saturday mornings

Day school pupils come home to all the distractions of TV, laptop, siblings, pets, hobbies etc. My son at boarding school attends compulsory prep sessions. He has no choice and is sitting at a desk in a silent room. I have no doubt that if he was at home he would do the bare minimum and as a result of his school will get much better results.

I’m sure London is very different. Heard horror stories about the pressures there.

[RosieWoodCelt]

GaribaldiGirl Agree totally. I simply think the longer days and more rigorously enforced daily routines in independent and especially boarding schools prevents the post-school flopping in front of the TV etc. There is time for that after prep at boarding schools - it is simply that the school itself shows the DD what her real priorities are. Helps her throughout life.

[TeenTimesTwo]

I think they could both be their own person at WA. You just need to request that they are in different houses. If one were in one of the Daws Hill houses (Wendover, Cloister and Shelburne) and the other not then they would hardly see each other.

My one bit of advice, if choosing full boarding, is you really do need to make sure that the 'fit' of the school is right for the child. Don't choose just on academics. When you are there 24/7 other things matter a lot too.

[RosieWoodCelt]

TeenTimesTwo Yes. great advice. And WA for both DD but different houses is good thinking. I am sure CLC would agree to split them into different houses too.

[longtallwalker]

OP don't underestimate your children's ability. They could cope in state schools. Both mine would count as bright in your eyes I think - got full clutch of A stars at GCSE and A level (in proper academic subjects). One is at Cambridge; the other at Durham, both having exceeded entrance requirements, and both now knowing a broad range of people. And their comp was properly bog standard. They are extra proud of their achievements because they took this route.
Have faith in your children OP.
If they really are bright, and are capable Of making the right friendship choices they'll be fine.
Plus I had the joy of seeing them and their friends and all that hubbub that happens when you have teens. That time son goes .
Go on - trust them

[RosieWoodCelt]

We totally do trust DD. The reason for wanting boarding is because we want the facilities, ethos and atmosphere of a boarding school that are impossible to find in any state school regardless of how good it is as a school.

[longtallwalker]

Sorry I thought the emphasis of your OP was on the general shoddiness of state schools and the millions of students who have to attend them. I just wanted to reassure you that your views aren't a fair reflection of the many many kids who do really well regardless. And come out as critically thinking, well rounded adults.

[TeenTimesTwo]

When I was at WA a million years ago, prep wasn't EVER supervised by teachers. It was done in the 'house study' and quiet was controlled by the older girls (y11 equivalent). However you were expected to be there and not e.g. in the dorms. If you needed help your peers were around or even older girls.

I wonder how much internet access and social media has affected boarding schools. On the one hand I can see it will make them less isolated, but on the other I can see some of the benefits being impacted by online distractions.

I think boarding school can be right for the right child in the right school. But you have to be very careful to get the fit correct.

[cantkeepawayforever]

RosieWoodChelt,

My understanding is that your wish for boarding is, essentially, logistical and because you enjoyed this 'family tradition', and also that (for a reason you have not specified) that you think single sex education would suit your DD.

I don't get the impression that you know a lot about state education, because you move in 'private education only' social circles and your need for boarding because of your work and your DH's rules even the most astonishing state schools out.

Can iI therefore suggest that you don't make statements about state education at all? Of course, if you have visited all the selective and comprehensive options available to you locally, and have ruled them out individually as schools, you can comment about them in particular - e.g. you have not considered Pate's Grammar because you need your DD's to be looked after by the school at night and at the weekend, and it is a M-F day school, even though it is (in terms of academic results and progress) superior to the boarding schools discussed.

However, it does feel as if you have not spent much, if any, time considering or visiting state schools, and your sweeping statements do come across as both naive and a little rude. They may be 'the opinions of your equally state-ignorant social / educational circle', but it doesn't make them generally true.

[SusanWalker]

Your post really resonated with me longtallwalker.

I was sent to boarding school. I got a full scholarship. My mum was dead set on me going private because I was bright, and although I can understand her motivations, I still feel a bit resentful and that she didn't trust me and my ability to succeed.

When I got to uni most of my friends had been to state school and I could see no difference in our abilities. In fact they were more focused than me as the world of pubs and clubs and all the freedom was all new to me and I went a bit mad.

Both my children go to our local comp 15 minutes walk down the road. It is a lovely school and they are both top sets for most things and do lots of after school activities. In fact dd does some kind of activity nearly every day after school. And I never have to make them do their homework. I leave it to them to do as and when they want and it all gets done. DS does maths GCSE papers for fun.

I hated boarding.

I can understand why you think boarding would be best OP, and that you enjoyed boarding yourself but do you have a plan B in case your girls don't like it?

[BubblesBuddy]

The DC is question are at Godstowe. That’s a boarding prep! They can try boarding. They possibly already board! Of course parents know if their child will like boarding if they go to Godstowe! It’s what the school is about. When my DD was there, only the girls who went on to Bucks Grammars didn’t board! Most of their girls go to senior boarding schools at 13, not 11. They have an outstanding reputation for getting girls into the top boarding schools. The school was founded by the same lady as founded WA. Many girls transfer seamlessly to WA and plenty to CLC and Benendon too.

Therefore I cannot see why the op would look at a state school. No one at Godstowe goes to a state school unless it’s a local grammar. This won’t be an option for the op. She didn’t ask about state schools. Perhaps she shouldn’t have even mentioned her views in her op. However, they are no different to many, many boarding prep school parents. It’s just the way it is. You choose a prep school that feeds the top boarding schools, not your local comp.

The op is right that boarding offers everything under one roof. (So to speak). At the best schools, there is a depth of talent and the education is broader with guest speakers, alumni networks etc.

I think if the op visits a variety of schools, the differences will appear and a favourite or two will emerge! I would look at the destinations of Godstowe girls and see where other parents choose for their bright girls.

Boarding schools can have day pupils and these are day boarders. They do their prep with the boarders and have supper with them too. It’s a long day and then there is the journey to and from school. Both my DDs finished lessons at 4.30 and there was no Saturday school. They had long lunch breaks. They didn’t get noticeably more teaching and the terms were way shorter. 3 /4 weeks in the summer! What they did do was lots of extra activities and house events. Boarding is not all academics. It’s way more than that. Few boarders have tutors! When would this be fitted in? Just go for the best fit school, op.