Triple science or French Gcse?

[Lilyray89]

Dd only has a few more weeks to choose option and thought she was going to do triple science but now she’s not sure.
The compulsory subjects are :

• English lit and Lang

-Maths -Science ( 5 hours a week) -R.E And then they get 3 options.( Was quite shocked at how few options they get )

She wants to do Geography and art and then isn’t sure between triple science and French. She’s a very bright and able girl , 7/8/9s, and she’s thinking about going into a medicine career but not totally sure.

She enjoys both subjects a lot and on a recent French test she got a 8 & 9 but she also got a 8 on the recent science test.While she’s considering a science career the French department are really pushing that she needs a MFl as they’re much wanted and needed especially with brexit.

So which one is more important and what are the courses like? Also has anyone got advice on how the courses are on Art and geography?

Triple science will be better for her if she wants to do science a levels; there will be less of a jump from gcse to a level.

Yes to Triple science. If she's clever she could always study for a French GCSE out of school (if she's only doing 8 or 9 GCSEs in school)?

Triple science, definitely.
DS is studying a language outside school with a Tutor because he refused to continue with French and really wanted to do Japanese. he'll take the GCSE next year and loves his lessons.
However, can I just recommend your dd talks to some students taking the new art spec this year - it's changed a lot and you have to be prepared to do even more work outside the classes. I think it could be a tough one to get a really good grade in and if she's thinking of medicine that may be a factor. However if she's very good at keeping up with coursework she should be fine!

Also if she’s really keen on science then the others kids who are really keen are more likely to be in triple science. DD’s school teach triple science in double science time which would solve your DD’s dilemma. Only the able kids do triple as the pace is faster. There will be very bright kids in double science but more likely to be all rounders or strong in humanities?

Do you know where the best teachers are? I have noticed that some departments spread their strong staff, some have them teaching top set, some have the weaker staff teaching top set and stronger staff teaching lower sets.

We just moved DD from top set triple science to 2nd set triple science as the stellar teachers are there. We said it was because her friend is in set 2 and DD has some organisational issues (true) but the head of year raised an eyebrow when he saw who the teachers were.

I'm going against the grain here. At GCSE level, it's more important to get a set of well rounded subjects, and that means at least one language. When you say "science", what does that actually mean? Is it not double science? Just single science? I've actually not heard of single science. Even my very average DD did double science. I do think having to choose between triple science and a language somewhat shocking. My friend's DC, for example, did double science at GCSE (also took a language) and then all science and maths A-levels and studied veterinary medicine at university. Another, also studying a science subject at university, also only did double science for GCSEs, but sciences for A-level, but has a language GCSE too, so doing double science at least didn't hold them back. The only children I know who did not take a language at GCSE are those who were dyslexic. The A-level subjects matter more.

I find it very odd that the school should deliberately set up a hugely restricted options system (only 3 options) that actively works AGAINST children getting the EBacc.

As RE does not count as a humanity for EBacc, then the school should be allowing triple science + language + geography / history.

As a comparison, DC's comprehensive does not have RE as a compulsory subject, and has 5 very open option choices. Languages and humanities are offered in multiple blocks, so it is really quite difficult to avoid doing the EBacc for suitably bright children. My DCs did 2 languages plus at least 1 humanity plus at least 1 creative subject. The compulsory amount of RE is taught through regular 'off timetable' full days (Citizenship, PSHE - things like drug and alcohol education, sex ed etc - and RE - moral dilemmas as well as a wide range of religions -well as are taught in a combined manner through these days) and Philosophy & Ethics is taught as a GCSE option.

Actually the number of options does look odd and stacked against ebacc, which doesn't seem in the school's interest! At DS's school triple science isn't one of your options, it's the default if you're good at science.
Ideally, you'd go for triple science, French and geography if you have three options and I'd agree to a teenager they may not sound like real options! However, it's the best range under the circumstances for medicine.
I really do get the allure of art but it's not an easy subject at GCSE and very time-consuming.

That's a good point about art. My DD is quite a talented artist but is adamant she is not doing it for GCSE because it involves so much work. She's doing two languages instead.

We were also told that she can do the combined science (2 GCSEs) and still take one of those subjects for A level if she wants to as long as she gets a high enough grade so it is still an option instead of the triple, although I appreciate it is a big jump to A level.

As she has to do RE (which might not be an EBACC humanity, but is certainly a respected humanity subject for uni admissions and as pp said, the ethics component is good for medicine), I suggest she drops geography and does both triple science and French.

Otherwise, have a very hard look at whether she wants tomdonarr as an examined subject, or just keep it as a fun hobby or evening class

Also worth bearing in mind that 'new' (ie 9-1) double science has more content in than the 'old' (A* to G) double science, and in my discussions with science teachers, this makes the jump up to A-level much smaller than it used to be.

I would say that DD (a genuinely excellent artist who is likely to aim for an Art-related degree / career) has to spend as much time on Art homework as on all her other subjects combined. For someone aiming at medicine, the 7 or 8 that could have been a 9 in a science subject, if time had not been spent on Art instead, is probably worth considering. Triple, geography + French would definitely be an easier option time / effort wise.

(Especially where Triple takes up an option block. Triple done in Double timetable time is hard and fast. Triple done in 1.5x double time is far more relaxed in terms of pace, in fact probably more relaxed than a wholly separate subject)

Can’tkeepaway I’d agree - art has taken up more time than anything else and still isn’t complete! Combined with the choice of music GCSE, which also has coursework, it wasn’t perhaps the best choice. The music is a lot more doable in comparison, though!

shouldwestayorshouldwego oh that’s interesting to Hear.I think they’ve already started the re gcse actually.

Chillywhippet
At dds option mornimg the teacher said they’d have any science teacher for 2 lessons a week just going through combined science and then they’d have a specialist teacher ( like a biology teacher) for another 2 others.
For biology it’d be the Hod which would be good but idk about the Rest of the teachers as they vary quite a bit.
In year 7 she had the worst teacher where they did worksheets or taught themselves through projects all year.She got a 5 that year.
But then in year 8 and 9 she’s had an amazing teacher where she’s got straight 8s and best in class a few times.

daisypond
I think it’s combined science or something , they do get two grades but I don’t know if it’s double science.
Yes she was definitely considering just doing the normal amount of science but she’s aiming for top universities maybe even Oxbridge and if she wanted to do a medical course there’s she’d probably need triple science as it’s so competitive.

cantkeepawayforever The school aren’t encouraging the ebacc much except for a few teachers but she could do it with her 3 option but it doesn’t account for a creative subject which is a shame.Especially as Dd like art and dt.

LooseAtTheSeams It would be a lot easier if they did triple science just for top sets as I’m sure they could get through the course in the same time as normal science.
They do sound like very good options but she really does like her art and the lessons seem much more relaxing comparing to other lessons.And she loves the sound of the sketchbooks and everything

Do you guys think that she could drop geography as she’s already doing another’s humanity : re?

Lilyray,

I think you do need to emphasise just how much work is required for Art if she thinks it will be 'much more relaxing' compared with other lessons. The lessons themselves may be relaxing, but it may be worth her asking existing GCSE Art students how many hours per week they are doing outside lessons.

I think you need a modern foreign language at GCSE for entry to some universities. Your DD must, in my opinion, take a foreign language. I agree with the others - art is a lot of work.

If the current plan is medicine three sciences makes a lot more sense. The question will then be between geography or french.

One consideration of MFL, unless you are continuing with the language in some way afterwards (holidays etc) as you quickly (or at least I do) loose what you don't use.

cantkeepawayforever I think she understands the amount of coursework but I’ll keep reminding.One of her friends took art and they spend weekends and lunchtimes and staying after school for the homework and they don’t really enjoy art anymore.

TheLetterZShe probably won’t use her french after gcse so she might end up forgetting it but what her MFL teachers were saying is that the skills that come and are associated with languages is confident speaking , people skills , more open minded and normally only more able pupils take it.

Might be worth looking at the requirements of potential degree courses. DC did a science degree with double science gcse followed by sciences at A level. Whilst double science wasn't a hindrance to dc1, I understand some universities do question why a student is offering double rather than triple science if triple science is an option at their school (and yes, every university dc1 applied to made reference to this in the interview).

Lilyrae I find it very odd that you're told that with a language GCSE "normally only more able pupils take it". I don't think this is true at all. I would expect all average and above pupils to take a GCSE language and many to take two or even three.

Daisy, I would agree.

At DC's comp, almost everyone does a modern language for GCSE. They do 1 in Y7, normally 2 in Y8-9 unless they have SEN, in which case they use the second language slots for extra English / Maths, and then usually 1 for GCSE.

More able pupils do 2.

Very able linguists can do 2 more as after school clubs leading to GCSEs. A very tiny number who are bilingual also do their 'other' language to GCSE, so the maximum number of MfL GCSEs possible is 5.....

It saddens me how little importance so many people in the UK place on learning another language. Art rather than a language, seriously?? Because art is "relaxing"? If she's pushing for Oxbridge, I'd drop Art and instead do Triple Sciences and French (and Geography).

I was one of the few people in my school who choose French (and Art and Geography! But we had more than 3 choices). I ended up carrying on French at A level (with a Spanish GCSE on the side) and on to university to do joint honours in French and Economics. I never planned to have a "linguistic career" (i.e. interpreter, translator, etc) but having a second language has opened so many doors for me in my actual career (which is Financial Services). It gives you an edge over a lot of people (Brits mainly!) but it also opens doors to understanding different cultures and makes it easier to pick up other languages too. I meet so many people who say to me that they'd wish they'd chosen a language at school - and carried on with it. By contrast, much as I enjoyed my art, it never added anything to my future. I can sketch whether I have a qualification in Art or not. My cousin is a reasonably successful artist (he has works in the Saatchi gallery, has won awards, solo exhibitions etc) but it was art school that made the difference rather than Art GCSE.

Just some food for thought.

My yr10dd is aiming to study medicine too & definitely triple science for this field. DD May or may not need a language later, but language qualifications that show enough proficiency are easy enough to pick up outside of school if needs be.