GCSE options 2018 vocational courses

[BrownTurkey]

Our school (large academy, good performance) is recommending all students including those doing ebacc subjects choose one vocational course alongside GCSEs explaining that :

What are VCERTS, Cambridge Nationals and other vocational qualifications? These courses are equivalent in value to GCSE, but are designed to be vocational and as such aimed at preparation for the workplace. They include both examined elements and the production of portfolios of continuously assessed project work. Unlike GCSEs, the internally assessed projects in vocational courses account for the majority of the assessed grade. We recommend that all students should consider one or more vocational courses alongside their GCSE studies.

This seems sensible advice - any thoughts against? For instance they are offering PE and Music as either GCSE or CVFE (which don’t give a numbered grade, more pass/fail/merit type system).

This may be controversial, but solid GCSEs are more likely to be useful for pupils expecting to follow an A level, University route. So if I had a child like this I would be recommending they consider then reject unless there was a subject they particularly want to study.

For a more middle of the road / less academic this could be beneficial as a) one fewer subject to revise and take exams in, b) a good introduction to the BTEC way of working.

They may be 'equivalent in value', but some qualifications are more equal than others imo. (My DD1 did a Level 3 BTEC at college. It was 'equivalent' to 2 A levels, supposedly.)

That's exactly the views I'm after really. I can understand that it might mean at least one subject done more through assessment than final examination, which is great. But she could for example do music GCSE or do Music Performance - so are they going to be considered equivalent in the future? I think in dd1s case, as she much prefers applied and active learning and will likely take a set of ebacc subjects, a vocational qualification may be ideal. However I am not so sure about dd2. Thanks for your thoughts.

I think it depends what they aspire to in the future. Good universities will prefer standard GCSEs and 8,9 or 10 of these takes up enough time without anything vocational for a vocation you don’t yet know you have! Whether you have music GCSE or music performance will not matter much unless you want a music degree.

GCSEs should be taken by the brightest students and how the other qualifications really prepare for A levels or other qualifications should be explored. I bet the possible Oxbridge students are chuffed with this decision!

Apologies ahead of my post as it may be biased (I teach a vocational qualification!).

Vocational qualifications have often been seen as a lesser qualification and that they should not be an equivalent to a GCSE and this is certainly true on the view on MN. There have been instances where schools have used a qualification to game the system and force whole cohorts through in order to raise their league table results (BCS IT for instance) and there have been instances in the past where the internal verification element of the large amount of coursework has not been done by schools correctly which may also have fed this perception of a lesser qualification.

However, there is a place for vocational qualifications and the recent tightening up from OFQUAL and the DoE on which vocational qualifications can be undertaken has gone a long way in legitimising them.

Vocational qualifications will have to have to be at least 40% exam based in order to be approved so long gone are the days of 100% coursework based and whilst some may see this as still not enough, some are concerned that this detracts away from the vocational aspect i.e. apply/do. The remaining 60% coursework requires a lot of work from students not only with the content but the skills they have to display to complete the coursework.
The verification of the standards is now a much more closely monitored process and (in my view) the content is a lot harder than some GCSEs. What is different is the assessment.

In terms of university applications (including RG and Oxbridge) they have always accepted a vocational qualification at KS4, they also despite the usual MN view accept for Level 3 qualifications as well (not only can this be found via their entry requirements a lot of 6th form providers/teachers can testify to that, including myself).

Vocational qualifications bring a lot more to the table for students than just the end qualification, as a recent article in TES from ex-head of Eton testifies to
Tony Little, who headed the £12,910-a-term boarding school between 2002 and 2015, said: “In my view, things won’t change until it’s an obligation on all schools and all students post-16 to take at least one vocational course. Whoever they are, whatever their aspirations may be. For example, he said, a highly academic pupil, studying double maths and physics A levels and planning to apply to top universities, would benefit from taking a vocational course in engineering, problem-solving or design. Students who take vocational courses, he said, “tend to be more flexible, more able to deal with information in different ways. Even better with deadlines.“

And yes, whilst he was discussing Level 3 students, the same skills are developed at GCSE levels which only enhances the full education experience for students and not just ‘teaching to the test’. A lot of my students have stressed these skills they have utalised from the vocational qualification in their personal statement and we often have ex-students speaking at open evenings about how these skills they developed greatly helped them at university, especially in the first year where they have seen peers who entered with A Levels only struggle especially with research, presenting etc when they started their courses.

In terms of the qualifications on offer presently, a lot of schools are going back to vocational, especially in light of the changes to GCSE. For example the DT department in my school have abandoned the new GCSE specs for a number of subjects as they feel they are no longer ‘subject based’ i.e. the spec for food is predominantly science based whereas the NCFE Vcert Level 2 requires students to not only know, understand and apply their knowledge in the externally assessment and subsequent coursework units but also develop and display their actual skills. This is the same for a number of subjects, especially those that are/should be a practical subject rather than just remembering facts.

Education should be there to help students to develop a full range of skills in order for them to be rounded individuals and the use of vocational qualifications does lend itself to that.

That view and info seems to really validate what the school is suggesting then - thanks so much for the detailed reply, puts it much more in context of the development of both GCSEs and the vocational qualifications. You are right about the prevailing view, which was very much in evidence talking to other parents. I really can't see any downside taking at least one, alongside single sciences and a full set of ebacc subjects. (If she can face taking French).

To me it is more regarding the subject.

If my DD wants to do more cookery, and the qualification the school offers is a VCERT, then fine.
But I wouldn't make my child do a VCERT in a subject she didn't want to do, purely because it was a VCERT iyswim?

But I wouldn't make my child do a VCERT in a subject she didn't want to do, purely because it was a VCERT iyswim?

couldn't that be the same for a qualification in any subject?

My interest is rather theoretical, as DD will definitely make her own choices, based on school and our guidance, and I am interested in what those choices will be, less interested in directing them 😃

cricket couldn't that be the same for a qualification in any subject

Yes. But as I was reading it, the OPs school were saying it would be good to do a VCERT just from the point of view of doing a VCERT. I don't think I would say to my mythical very academic oriented child, instead of doing this academic-focussed GCSE do this other more vocational VCERT because doing a VCERT is of itself a Good Thing.

As it is, for my actual DD, I might be hoping the school offers a VCERT in cooking rather than the new GCSE food tech spec, as it might well suit her better.

My DS did a vocational qualification during his gap year. He’s highly unlikely to peruse it as a career but I felt it was very useful and demonstrated that he has work based skills and well as academic ability. A friend whos very involved with graduate recruitment for a FTSE 100 company felt that in the competitive job market graduates are entering these qualifications can make you slightly different and also interesting as long as it’s combined with a good degree from a good univetsity and help to make you stand out from the crowd.

Rabbits. Always the rabbits.