Fees aside....

[StewardsEnquiry]

My head is going round and round with this and I need some advice here, please!

Can you explain why I might want to choose a grammar school instead of an academically vigorous selective independent school?

The child in question is very academically able, but no particular talent for sports or music - although enjoys participating in all of these activities.

Thanks!

I think I basically agree with you, but it's an argument I'm thinking about a lot at the moment, as I try to make this decision. Re the schools teaching avarice point - I'm sure they don't, but my impression is that some schools perhaps try a bit harder than others to remind their children how lucky they are, get them involved in helping the local community and generally discouraging a 'my house is bigger than yours' culture. But as you say, that's about finding a school with an ethos that you like.

On the doing good point, I didn't mean that doing good has to involve a very high powered job. For example, a close friend of mine went to a top flight independent followed by Oxbridge, and has spent his career teaching in state secondary schools. Obviously you don't need to be privately educated to be a good teacher (!), but I do think that his schooling has given him a superb subject knowledge, breadth of education, confidence etc that all contribute to him being an outstanding and inspirational teacher. So I would say he has used his privileges to do good for others instead of feathering his own nest - he could have commanded a high salary in finance, law etc as most of his schoolmates do. I would love it if my kids did similar things, not nec teaching but anything from PM to international development to medicine to working for a charity that involves putting something back.

Lots of independent schools do community work it’s pretty standard stuff.
I don’t think you can shield your DC’s from the “my house is bigger than yours culture” it’s part of our general culture everywhere you go not just in independent schools I’m sure it occurs in the state sector as well. . I think a lot of this stuff comes from Home. Yeas ago I used to give a three year old a lift to school she used to sit there telling me her car was bigger than mine, list her possessions, how big her garden was for the area etc etc. She’d clearly heard this at home. If we as parents place a lot of emphasis on this sort of stuff then it’s likely our children will too. Conversely if we don’t hopefully are children won’t either.

Agree that home is the most important factor, but surely not all schools are exactly the same in this regard, just as they're not the same in other ways?

OP you've been v quiet. I'd be really interested to hear your views on the thread, as it sounds like we might be in a similar position.

I’m pretty sure nearly all independent schools do community service.
Re promoting rampant materialism? It’s difficult isn’t it? Heads are unlikely to stand up in front of the kids going, don’t be a ghastly materialist adult, be happy to live in a 1 bedroomed broom cupboard, drive a 20 year old clapped out car and work for a charity earning peanuts. Nearly all comments on here talk when discussing independent schools are about results, most hope these good results will lead on to admissions to top unix and then a “good job”, let’s face it for many a good job is one with a large salary attached. This is what parents want, and are paying for so you would have to be a very brave school to go against this.
We live in a materialistic society,you only have to turn on the TV to see that possessions cars houses etc are important to us, as is status and salary associated with your occupation. It’s all around our children. Schools generally mirror what parents want, if you paying maybe more so I don’t know, but I suspect grammars also promote the same ethos as do high performing comps and even some low performing comps.

No, I agree they're not going to specifically promote low paid jobs, but surely there's a middle ground message around: we will help you get the top qualifications to do and be whatever you want (but we will also instil in you an ethos of service, compassion, more-to-life-than-money and political justice, so that you might end up not only wanting to spend your life raking in the cash). Maybe I'm hoping for too much.

“Maybe I’m hoping too much”
I’m a dyed in the wool cynic so I’m going to say suspect you probably are .

I think what happy gardener has said is exactly why I personally would be uncomfortable with the ethos in some i independent schools. The underlying assumption that good job = very high earni ng and equating income with status etc is exactly what I wouldn't want my children surrounded by. And perhaps what I meant earlier about what feels like arrogance/expectation/entitlement that their place in society is at the top/high status and earning jobs.

The grammar school I used to teach in was far more rounded (in my opinion) in that it encouraged high grades to enable choice and options. Many went on to be occupational therapists, teachers, as well as consultants and doctors as well as TAs sahm, part time workers etc.

In fact I'd completely echo witch and think it's far closer to the grammar school I taught at and not asking too much!! I think all areas and schools are different though. As ever.

I'm sorry, I have been very quiet! I was reading with great interest all of your posts. Thank you everyone for your thoughts - there is a great deal of experience and well thought out opinions being shared.

My own position is that we are almost certainly going for a selective independent school which is very, very good. I realised that we hadn't really even considered the local grammars, and just wanted to make sure we weren't missing a trick.

I haven't had any experience with grammar schools because there were none where I grew up. But I think the main point I'm taking away from this thread is that grammar schools are still state schools with all the problems of funding, class size, assessment and extra curricular activities that state schools have. For that reason I'm feeling much more confident that the independent school we have chosen is right.

Snap. For all my caveats, I think we will probably make the same choice.

Good luck both of you I hope it works out well for your DC’s.

Thanks