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Secondary education

Connect with other parents whose children are starting secondary school on this forum.

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Original poster

GCSE pass rate when choosing a school

62 replies

BurnTheBlackSuit · 08/09/2017 14:00

Obviously not the only criteria we are looking at! But I'm just interested- what kind of GCSE pass rate would make you worried about choosing a school.

Going on last year's GCSEs- national average for 5 A-C grades was 58.7% and for A-C in English and Maths was 63%.

Would you be worried about a school where 70% got 5 A-C grades? Or 60%? 50%? 40%?

Just want to get a rough idea of what others think...

OP posts:

megletthesecond · 10/09/2017 10:13

Marking my place. I've got a few weeks to get my head around it.

DumbledoresApprentice · 10/09/2017 10:14

I'd go for school B personally based on those figures.

sashh · 10/09/2017 13:42

When I choose my dd's school nearly 2 years ago, the Progress 8 didn't seem to be a 'thing'. I studied a heap of data but don't remember seeing it (or knowing what it was)

It's a recent change so may not have existed. I think the idea of looking at progress is good but progress 8 assumes all students can make the same progress in a set of subjects that is biased towards science and maths.

Very few people are equally good at or interested in the same subjects.

And because this is how the school is assessed it determines the curriculum taught.

A student may be gifted at art and want to take GCSEs in photography, textiles and art and be capable of A* in all of them, but they may only be able to take one because the timetable is dominated by progress 8.

The same for someone good at humanities, only history or geography are counted.

It worries me that it may be the C/D students who will miss out in certain subjects because students hate science and would have chosen single science or no science are not going to be put in the top set but in the borderline set. There is a huge difference in teaching a child who is C/D because they have to try harder to get that C and teaching a child who is not interested but this is what is going to happen.

Witchend · 10/09/2017 13:49

It also depends on your dc.

If you have a dc who is looking at a row of A/A, then it could have excellent A-C rates, but not be able to support those who are going for the top grades.
Otoh if you have a dc who will be looking to get 5 C grades then if they concentrate on those who will get top grades and not worry so much about those who are scraping through then you are looking at a different setup.

But you also want to look at other things-SEN support if relevant, pastoral support (never trust a school that says they have no bullying), extra curricular things etc.
What is relevant and important to your dc.

ChocolateWombat · 10/09/2017 14:04

The key is to first have a pretty good idea about your own child. Are they academic, middling,struggling? If in doubt, ask current school for an honest comment.
Know too what your own values and hopes for education are.

Lots of people start looking without knowing either of these answers.

Once you know these, you can look to see if there is a school that has good numbers of kids like your own and serves them well. You can see if it shares your values and offers the kind of subjects you think suit your child .....A levels, separate sciences, vocational etc. You can look at destinations afterwards and see if they fit with what you'd expect from your own child or not. If you are lucky, you will have a school nearby that fits the above. If not, you might have to go for a best fit option or consider alternatives like moving.

Having a sense of the overall school is good too, because your child as an individual has to exist within the wider school. It's usually not good to be one of only a few clever children, or only a few with specific needs, or who struggle with maths and English, because the provision is usually better when there are larger numbers.....of course this isn't always the case. I'd also be interested in ethos and attitude towards homework, extra curricular, behaviour etc and if it fits with what I value.

Many people don't have perfect option available to the them and even those who can pay do t always have the perfection combination of attributes available. For most people it will be a best fit thing.

catslife · 10/09/2017 14:36

Going on last year's GCSEs- national average for 5 A-C grades was 58.7% and for A-C in English and Maths was 63%.
The League Tables for 2016 are arranged in a totally different way to previous years. The first figure 58 isn't a percentage it's the "attainment 8" score which is the score based on how well pupils have performed in up to 8 qualifications, which include English, maths, 3 English Baccalaureate qualifications including sciences, computer science, history, geography and languages, and 3 other additional approved qualifications.
So the first figure isn't a percentage is a "points score" based on so many points for an A etc. This is why this score is lower than the percentage with A-Cs in English and Maths. In old style league tables the percentage achieving 5 A*-Cs was usually higher than those including Maths & English.
The other difference as stated by a previous poster is that the range of subjects included in attainment 8 is more limited e.g. a child who takes both Art and Music may have a lower points score as only one of these subjects counts towards the score, even if they have higher actual GCSE grades than a child who has taken Geography and Music for example.

AlexanderHamilton · 10/09/2017 15:01

Then you also have schools like my daughter's school who get quite a few kids who previously went to private schools who didn't do SATS.

My dd's results won't count for progress 8 because she has no SATS score.

RedSkyAtNight · 10/09/2017 15:14

Ah, thanks catslife that makes way more sense that the first of OP's stats is the attainment 8 and not a raw percentage!

With that in mind, I'd not worry about any of OP's choices, but sounds like School B has the most able intake.

Original poster

BurnTheBlackSuit · 10/09/2017 20:03

Thank you all! I am learning a lot from this thread. As someone who is not involved in education, I don't know what goes into the figures like Progress 8 or attainment 8, so it's very interesting to know if they are the be all and end all!

Obviously there are many other factors we will be looking at when choosing the order we will add the schools to our preference list. I will be asking more Mumsnet questions soon!

OP posts:

wwwwwwwwwwwwww · 10/09/2017 20:19

I'd also look at how many were entered in English and maths compared to how many in a year. Non entry is away of concealing those who would not pass and artificially boosting the pass rate.

Original poster

BurnTheBlackSuit · 10/09/2017 21:40

According to government comparison website, school A enters 100% into Maths and English GCSEs. School B enters 99% into maths and 97% into English. School C enters 100% into maths and 99% into English.

Would they all be ok entry rates? Relevant to this might be that school B is a much, much larger school than A or C?

OP posts:

wwwwwwwwwwwwww · 10/09/2017 21:52

That sounds good for all three. I'd look at number of entries. So if intake is 180 in year 7 and 160 are on role in year 11 they may have entered 100% but managed to lose 20 low performing students.

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