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Secondary education

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Original poster

Do you let your students go to the toilet during lessons?

74 replies

user1494968883 · 16/05/2017 22:11

My year 7 class seem to be regularly requesting the toilet during lessons. Do you let your secondary students out to the toilet?

OP posts:
MaisyPops · 17/05/2017 19:11

20 yrs ago we just got up and went and were told by the teachers we didn't need to even put our hand up to ask....just nipped out if we needed.
(Disclaimer - I use discretion and no blanket ban)

20 years ago we... Isn't a decent reason. years ago there was limited checking of adults working with kids, lots of kids with send weren't educated in mainstream, 20 years ago parents held their kids accountable for their results and now a reasojabke number think teachers should work endless unpaid hours to ensure their children get graded with as little effort as possible. 20 years ago if a teacher set a detention, it stood. Now we get calls telling us we are mean for daring to challenge bad behaviour. Today a colleague was verbally abused by a student because she told him to do his work.

I use discretion (default no but I'll be reasonable) because I think it's the right thing to do.

Verbena37 · 17/05/2017 19:23

Maisypops I guess our comprehensive school was just very forward thinking. We as the students respected the staff and they in return treated us as grown ups.

DH and I were chatting about it the other day actually...not just the going to the loo without having to ask thing but how we don't remember a single child in the school being expelled during our time there and even a suspension was rare.

Noble I know some kids take the piss but the ones who do, surely do it a lot and the teacher could deal with them appropriately. For all others, who I'm pretty sure wouldn't all need to the loo at the same time, could be let go. They're supposed to be progressing towards adulthood not being treated like infants....who should also be allowed to go to the loo.

noblegiraffe · 17/05/2017 19:27

Verbena

And if you realise that kids are taking the piss, then what do you do when they say 'I need to go to the toilet right now, are you going to let me wet myself?'

Trifleorbust · 17/05/2017 19:29

Verbena37

Your school is your school. Mine is mine. Most of my students are lovely and can be trusted to go to the toilet, but it is still a safeguarding risk and against school policy for me to let them. I therefore reserve the right to say no to students I don't trust for whatever reason, as it is my neck on the block if they get hurt.

MaisyPops · 17/05/2017 19:30

Verbena37
My experience is similar to yours. Only a couple of kids in serious trouble and there were often things in thr background.

I treat my students like young adults. I'm firm but fair and it works well.

Just speaking from my time working with kids, there's been a big shift in attitudes in the last 5/10 years in terms of how some parents speak to/about teachers. It's lead to a shift in how some kids view authority figures.

I have some classes I could absolutely say yes any time and know that they'd almost never use it. But it's not the norm around schools.

requestingsunshine · 17/05/2017 19:34

This is interesting actually because my dd(14) got a detention today for requesting and going to the toilet during a lesson. She doesn't have a medical card but has always had a very weak bladder so can't hold it for long. (she refuses for this to be medically documented as she's very embarrassed about it hence no medical card) I did feel a bit sorry for her but also understand from the teaching point of view they have no way of knowing this. She was given the option of not going or detention.she took detention because she didn't want to wet herself. God I'd have never got her back in that school if she'd done that!

PaleAzureofSummer · 17/05/2017 19:38

Do you mean she had to go back at lunch to make up the time she missed or a full on detention that goes on the system/parents notified?

requestingsunshine · 17/05/2017 19:44

Back at lunch for a detention not to make up lost time. She was gone for 5 minutes as the toilets were right next to the classroom.

She's an a grade student, well ahead of her targets and this is only the second time in 3 years she has had to go during a lesson so not excessive. This teacher clearly has a blanket ban instead of using a bit of common sense

Trifleorbust · 17/05/2017 19:55

requestingsunshine

That isn't a blanket ban.

user1494628932 · 17/05/2017 19:58

I don't let my pupils go. They have enough time to use the toilets outside of lesson times. Today during a double lesson right after lunch I had a girl ask to go, I said no and that she would have to wait. She asked two more times and told me she would wee herself if I didn't let her go. I told that she should have gone at lunch. She waited until the end of the lesson.

Verbena37 · 17/05/2017 19:58

requestingsunshine for that I would have been fuming. I would write to school and tbh, the newspaper, explaining that A grade children are being given full lunchtime detentions for asking to go to the loo.

This country has gone mad!

mumsneedwine · 17/05/2017 20:01

Ask them to hand over their phone. And they must be back in 5 minutes or they will make the time up at break. That's after jiggling signs and repeated asking. Just asking then downing a load of water gets a No. Its amazing how some don't want to go anymore when I ask for their phones - a piece of equipment I did not know was required for the toileting process 😜

Verbena37 · 17/05/2017 20:03

user1494628932
I hope you feel really ashamed treating that girl like that.
She probably held it as she was respecting you but caused herself a urinary infection in the process!

I'm shocked you're saying what you've said.
A double lesson is two hours! If she ate and drank at the start of lunch, even if she went to the loo during lunch, she would probably still need the loo two hours later. You're supposed to be a caring and compassionate teacher are you not?

Trifleorbust · 17/05/2017 20:06

A double lesson is two hours! If she ate and drank at the start of lunch, even if she went to the loo during lunch, she would probably still need the loo two hours later. You're supposed to be a caring and compassionate teacher are you not?

I didn't realise I was supposed to be caring and compassionate. I thought my job was to teach my students. Hmm

Seriously, though, most people without medical issues can wait to go to the toilet for two hours. I do it every day, as do virtually all of my students without medical reason.

user1494628932 · 17/05/2017 20:07

Verbena37

She asked 5 minutes after lunch break, she should have gone then

Verbena37 · 17/05/2017 20:12

Trifle are you the OP as well under a different name?
And yes, as a teacher of children, of course you're supposed to be caring and compassionate!

If you need to ask that, you're really in the wrong job!

noblegiraffe · 17/05/2017 20:14

verbena

You haven't answered my question. What would you do if you knew a kid was taking the piss but insisting that they would wet themselves if you didn't let them leave the classroom?

DoctorDonnaNoble · 17/05/2017 20:15

Many of our students have activities at lunch time. Or revision sessions.
I don't understand this resistance to letting students use the toilet. I'm currently pregnant and one of the things covered in the health and safety discussion is making sure it's possible for me to get to the toilet if I need to. And this card system for children with medical reasons sounds dreadful. As if the issues weren't bad enough already, schools are making these students visibly different. Awful.
On my PGCE we were taught not to give class punishments for misbehaviour but that seems to be the reasoning behind most toilet bans.

Trifleorbust · 17/05/2017 20:17

Verbena37

Nah. I am not the OP.

I am a teacher, my job is to teach. I care and I believe I am compassionate, but not to the point that I acquiesce to every request a student makes of me, particularly when I know from experience of that student that this will compromise their learning and my professionalism.

noblegiraffe · 17/05/2017 20:18

Donna do you not have students meeting up in the toilets for a smoke/quick vandalising at your school? Or kids who ask every lesson because they can't be arsed to sit still for an hour?

DoctorDonnaNoble · 17/05/2017 20:19

@noblegiraffe to avoid a scene or confrontation I would at that point let them go but follow it up through the correct behavioural channels. However, I wouldn't even need one hand to count the number of our students who have taken the piss with toilet visits. In fact, there have been two.
But there we go. Different schools have different practices. What works for me might not work for others. I find it strange though.

DoctorDonnaNoble · 17/05/2017 20:21

@noblegiraffe - nope we don't. Not a huge amount of smoking - it tends to occur in an alleyway near school before and after school (and mainly sixth formers). And nope, they don't meet up in the loos. There have been rare incidents of vandalism. They are dealt with by us noting who goes and when. I have maybe two requests a week on average. More if there's been an 'event' at lunchtime.

noblegiraffe · 17/05/2017 20:26

Different schools, Donna! I can easily have 2 requests a lesson. Like I said in an earlier post one Y7 class was averaging about 5 requests per lesson which is when I had to say 'this is ridiculous, you can go but you will make the time up'. Then the requests stopped instantly, which just shows that they didn't really need the toilet that badly at all.

user1494628932 · 17/05/2017 20:27

The girl I wouldn't let go today could easily have gone before class. The girls toilets is directly opposite my classroom.

DoctorDonnaNoble · 17/05/2017 20:29

They always have to complete any incomplete class work anyway, so that's a given. Regular requesters get followed up. It's jut never been a big deal at any school I've gone to.
It upsets me as I used to flood at the start of my periods and if I'd not been allowed to go in lessons it would have been absolutely hideous.