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Secondary education

Connect with other parents whose children are starting secondary school on this forum.

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Original poster

Secondary school bus - wwyd

101 replies

MadamPatti · 24/03/2017 15:14

My son is in year 7 and gets a school bus to school. It's about a 40 min journey. It's normally utter chaos on the bus. He hates it but has no other choice. The behaviour seems to have got worse lately. For about the last four weeks there has been a water fight on the way home, Probably started as part of the bottle flip challenge, but with no lids.

I monitor the situation as best I can, my son and his friend won't join in and try to discourage others.

Yesterday, he was hit by several flying bottles, and when he stood up to get off at his stop he fell over on all the water. Another older child said if he hadn't got up by the time he needed to get off, he would stomp on him. Son arrives home in tears, not for the first time.

I just don't know what to do. I am aware that kids of this age need to sort things out themselves. Also, I wouldn't class what goes on as bullying, as none of it is personally directed at him. Yesterday he was just in the way. Virtually everyone on the bus seems to be involved. Son can be a bit serious, with some tendencies to exaggerate, and if he knows he's in the right he refuses to back down.

Are these essentially low level behaviour problems sufficiently serious to inform school?? He's not being bullied in my opinion. I think that at secondary they need to learn to sort things out for themselves a bit more and I don't want to overreact. WWYD??

Thanks

OP posts:

FreshHorizons · 25/03/2017 08:39

School bus behaviour was always brought up at general school meetings - the fuss would have been tremendous had the school said it was not their responsibility!
Parents need to make sure that the school know it is their responsibility and hold them to it. You won't get anywhere if you believe that it isn't.

FreshHorizons · 25/03/2017 08:41

If all fails take up the safety issue with the bus company - very distracting for the driver. Get them to put pressure on the school.

CancellyMcChequeface · 25/03/2017 08:43

I feel so sorry for your son, OP. I had the same problems and refused to take the bus - I'd either walk (90 minutes!) or get buses at other times when they weren't busy, which usually meant being a bit late for school and very late home.

Unfortunately I'd say it's only the school's problem/responsibility if it's actually a designated school bus organised by the school - if it's a public bus, it isn't. You did say 'school bus' though - if this is the case, do talk to the school about it! It's good for DC to sort out their own problems, but in this instance the school are much more likely to take your complaints seriously than his.

FreshHorizons · 25/03/2017 08:43

You wouldn't expect staff to be controlling pupils in town after school time! You would however expect them to deal with those causing it - in school the next day and to get the parents in.

FreshHorizons · 25/03/2017 08:45

My comments were for a school bus- I assumed that was what it was.

user1490123259 · 25/03/2017 08:51

Parents need to make sure that the school know it is their responsibility and hold them to it. You won't get anywhere if you believe that it isn't.

But it absolutely isn't. Thats not to say schools don't want to stop it, but they are not actually responsible.

user1490123259 · 25/03/2017 08:52

make sure that the school know it is their responsibility and hold them to it.

funny, its often the same parents making unreasonable demands of teachers who complain their children are taught by so many supply teachers - and fail to see the connection.

GreenGinger2 · 25/03/2017 08:53

But some make it their responsibility. Surely a hands off attitude re school bus behaviour isn't going to help with your town behaviour.

Astro55 · 25/03/2017 09:02

*This is a nightmare.

It is absolutely nothing to do with the school, and the school staff will be dealing with horrendous behaviour all day every day, and are likely to have a complete breakdown if forced to attempt to control behaviour on the buses too.*

It is the school responsibility- DD school send letter home a warning then a ban for kids that can't behave -

The bus company have also withdrawn a route or two because of bad behaviour -

The bus company sometime rings the school for certain pupils to be collected (morning bus) by a senior staff member

Another bus was on lock down until the police arrive (child trying to set fire to a bus) school were also called to deal with the situation

Sometimes a teacher goes in the bus -

So yes it is a school issue!!

Can you imagine if parents said 'well they aren't in my care so not my problem?'

FreshHorizons · 25/03/2017 09:03

Of course it is their responsibility! I don't know where you live but trouble in our town by school children at 4pm would result in members of the public writing to the school, letters in the local paper and most certainly whole pages of the town's Facebook page being devoted to it. The Head would have to take action or it would have a dire effect on the school's reputation.
It is not an unreasonable demand that your child should travel to and from school safely!!
I would say that the school that can't get staff and has to rely on supply teachers are the ones who won't take responsibility.
If it were a service bus, and not a school bus , as a member of the public I would be phoning the Head and asking him/her what they were going to do about it. If they were a pathetic 'not our responsibility' I would be telling him/her what further action I was going to take!

FreshHorizons · 25/03/2017 09:04

Exactly Astro55

FreshHorizons · 25/03/2017 09:11

I was a supply teacher and I wouldn't have taught in a school where behaviour was dangerous on school buses- it tells me all that I need to know about behaviour in general in the school.

SoulAccount · 25/03/2017 09:13

I am astounded that the bus company allow a situation in which their bus gets covered in water and missiles are thrown.

It isn't safe.

And are they wearing seat belts? Or is it a regular bus?

Do you PAY for this service?

I think you need to complain loudly to the bus company, too.

user1490123259 · 25/03/2017 09:13

fresh horizone, and what would you have done if you were told to get on the bus and stop it?

FreshHorizons · 25/03/2017 09:16

I have never, ever said that you should!
Letters home to the parents- just tell them they will lose their bus place if they can't behave.

GreenGinger2 · 25/03/2017 09:16

No teacher ever stepped foot on ours. Why would they need to? Kids hauled in at school,parents and bus company phoned. Sanctions and warnings given out. Sanctions and warnings followed through if needs be.

FreshHorizons · 25/03/2017 09:17

Definitely not a school to supply teach in if they just expect a teacher to sort it and don't have a whole school policy.

FreshHorizons · 25/03/2017 09:18

Exactly GreenGinger2 - so simple - and works.

user1490123259 · 25/03/2017 09:21

The Head would have to take action and if the action he took was to resign and take his choice of other schools needing a head......?

You don't get it, do you.

We have absolutely reached the tipping point for " holding school staff to account"

There are now so few teachers that many will just walk out when it gets too much to live with, and some areas have a 40% shortfall of teachers... so no one who leaves one school has to worry that they won't find a job in another.

Many old permanent staff are now working on supply contracts, so the amount of notice they have to give that they are leaving is exactly zero.( most will give a few days or hours - I've known plenty who have taken the decision not to even stay until they end of the lesson....)

How about instead of this aggressive militant attitude of "everything in the whole world is your issue what are you going to do about it "

and

" If they were a pathetic 'not our responsibility' I would be telling him/her what further action I was going to take!"

how about approaching in a friendly way, asking for cooperation and support???? Thought about that ever? at all? in any situation??

The school is NOT responsible for behaviour on the buses. Most schools will WANT to help, if they can.

But schools are not law enforcement, and if behaviour is criminal, ( on or off school premises) it is a police matter.

user1490123259 · 25/03/2017 09:23

I would say that the school that can't get staff and has to rely on supply teachers are the ones who won't take responsibility.

what a meaningless sentence, most schools can't get staff. Your point is?

GreenGinger2 · 25/03/2017 09:26

Your head sounds pretty weak. Heads are paid a fairly hefty sum because they have to deal with this shit on a daily basis. If his/ her stance is to walk out if faced with being held to account for poor behaviour alongside holding his/her hands up saying "not my remit" he/ she surely shouldn't be in the job.

FreshHorizons · 25/03/2017 09:28

All I get is that you teach in a school with behavioural issues and that is why you can't get teachers.
I agree that teacher recruitment and retention is at an an all time low but think schools do better if the behaviour is good and they have whole school policies.
I travel on service buses with school children and have never had a behaviour issue.
I might well be friendly and cooperative if reporting it but certainly not if they abdicate what is clearly their responsibility!
OP's child has a right to travel to and from school without missiles being thrown- THE END.

FreshHorizons · 25/03/2017 09:30

My point is that as a supply teacher I go to schools with a clear behaviour policy. If behaviour is poor , with no back up, I never go back.
Poor behaviour on transport would come under 'never go back' as indicative of behaviour in school.

user1490123259 · 25/03/2017 09:30

Kids hauled in at school,parents and bus company phoned. Sanctions and warnings given out. Sanctions and warnings followed through if needs be.

who does the hauling? Which kids? who decides which kids? What evidence do they collect? Who takes statements from whom? Who judges validity of statements? Who calls in parents? Who deals with parents who are unsupportive? How do you contact parents if no phone number works? Who meets with parents? Who decides what sanctions? Who puts sanctions in place? Who monitors? How? Who carries out sanctions? Biggest job of all - who enters all the data into the records?

This is just the start of it! So what would that be? Three full days work for three members of staff??? just a rough estimate. What about all the disruption to lessons, as every individual on every bus journey is pulled out for their statement. And all the teachers that have to catch up with every individual that has missed something?

And you know all the statements will contradict each other.

You have very unrealistic view of the world.

As I say, most schools will want to help, even though they don't HAVE to, and the best start is for the school staff to have access to CCTV if it exists, to identify the culprits. ( But you might find many cover their faces during such incidents, anyway)

But don't go marching down to the school with demands and ultimatums.

It is a horrible situation, I'm sure the school will help if they can, but they are unlikely to be able to do much.

user1490123259 · 25/03/2017 09:32

OP's child has a right to travel to and from school without missiles being thrown- THE END.

absolutely they do, but ultimately it is a police matter, not a school matter.

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