Should we turn down allocated school?

[Holymoly321]

Hello, DS did not get offered any of his choices and has been allocated a totally unacceptable school. It's currently just six portacabins in a very run down area crime ridden area and he is not going to go there even if we have to sell our home and send him to private school. We will be appealing for his 1st choice, but wonder if declining the allocated school now would affect the appeal in a positive (i.e. He will have NO school and so needs to be helped) or whether it would have a negative effect on the appeal. Any advice most welcome. We are so tempted just to refuse this place now do that the local authority will be compelled to help but are we kidding ourselves? We are very clear that he will not be going to this school under any circumstances so should we just tell the local authorities that now?

What's the school's OFSTED like?

It's too late for independent school entry now, in all likelihood. If he's academic, you could investigate trying to get a bursary either when an occasional place comes up or in yr 8.

I am the admissions officer in a large secondary school and last year, quite a few parents went to appeal for their year 7 places, for varying reasons. However, two families had very similar circumstances, in that their year 7 children had siblings already at the school. One family had recently moved to the area (Family 1), and there had been a place for the older sibling so older sibling joined, and the other family had simply forgotten to apply for a place for their younger child and only realised at some point during the summer term (Family 2). Family 1 accepted the place offered at a different school for their younger child, and younger child duly joined that school. Family 2 refused the place allocated for their younger child, deciding to 'hold out' on our waiting list. Around October/November, both families went to appeal. Family 1 were refused because child was already in another school. Family 2 won because child was out of education.

There you go.

It's too late for independent school entry now, in all likelihood

depends on the school. less academic ones that tend to be the backup option might have space.

So what would happen if OP turns offer down then in September has no place for their child? If there was no school for them to go to. What would happen then?

I would put his name down on every waiting list for schools you would consider.

Call your local authority and neighbouring authority admissions and ask what schools have places. If there are any you would prefer you could request one of these.

Try and keep as many options open as possible.

What went wrong with the application? Did you apply for your three closest schools or were your choices unrealistic?

Just out of interest what would happen if you refused the offered place and didn't get to the top of any waiting lists by September. Child didn't start in September with yeargroup. Parents say LEA hasn't provided us with acceptable place, we work, won't be home schooling. What happens with respect to truancy? And the child's education?

See I just think there'd be massive pressure on the LEA to get that kid into education, and they be more likely to shoehorn them into the first/second choice school surely to make the problem go away? If the child had previously accepted or actually started at school number 7 on parental choice list in September, they'd be far less motivated to take any proactive action surely?

So if this was me and there was no way my child would go to the offered school, then I would refuse the offer and remain without a place, on the waiting lists of the other schools and go to appeal. I don't really see what the OP has to lose in this situation?

We did this at Reception when offered a school that we hadn't applied to that was in a different town. They offered us a place at second choice school the day before the appeal - I understand it's a different legal position at primary though with children having to be in education?

Thing is gavel, the parents are legally responsible for education, not the LEA. So why would the LEA be under pressure to make the issue go away? Not their circus!

Gavel the reply above from Tiggy covers it. Essentially they have to offer a place. Whether or not it's acceptable. If it had to be to the parents' liking then everyone would be getting their choices.
Once the L.A. offers a place their obligation is complete. If no other space comes up and the offered space has been declined, nothing has to happen. Some other form of education must be found by the parent.

Family 1 accepted the place offered at a different school for their younger child ... Family 2 refused the place allocated for their younger child ... Around October/November, both families went to appeal. Family 1 were refused because child was already in another school. Family 2 won because child was out of education.

There may have been other considerations too but, on the face of it, that sounds like a surprising decision if the appeal was allowed for that reason alone.

Most appeal panels would, I think, look sympathetically at any appeal where the local authority had failed (for whatever reason) to find a school place for a pupil and - if the admission authority's case for not admitting was not very strong - that might tip the balance in favour of the appellant. However, the situation is very different if the child has no place because the offered school was rejected. Rejecting a place and then going to appeal saying "look, my child hasn't got a school place" reminds me of that old joke about the person who murders their parents and asks the court to show mercy because they are an orphan.

Parents must educate their child.
L.A. must offer every child, whose parents apply, a place.

Indeed, but if parents reject the first offer, the local education authority is under no obligation to keep making offers until the parents decide to accept one and the appeal panel is under no obligation to allow the appeal just because the child now has no school place.

Sorry Panel that ^^ was meant as a tl:Dr version of my previous post :)

Can you imagine the shenanigans if every offer had to be acceptable?

I understand you can but his name down on the waiting list of as many schools as you want - I would start by doing that!

Gavel as regards truancy the parent has the responsibility to ensure that a child receives a suitable education. The local authority can investigate and If a parent doesn't provide evidence of home education or private school place they issue a school attendance order for the child to go to a specific school. If the child doesn't attend (or other education provided) then parent can be prosecuted.

If a parent is evasive and not providing education that might flag as a child protection issue.

www.gov.uk/school-attendance-absence/legal-action-to-enforce-school-attendance

So has anyone any experience of this actually happening then? A child not having any place, the parents not sorting out an alternative and the education authority turning up and prosecuting? I only ask as I've never heard of that happening, here or in RL. Some solution always seems to 'turn up' over the Summer...

OP, did you apply for nearby schools that you have maybe missed by a very short distance? If so, you will hopefully get a waiting list place. School places move a lot once the first round is done, and again over the summer when people move house.

You can now go on waiting lists for schools that you didn't originally apply for.

Do you have grounds for appeal? Shrieking about poorer areas of the borough, where panel members may well live, will not help.

Yes and you could buy yourself some extra time to find a place by saying you're home educating in the meantime. From what I've read here I don't think they do much checking up on what you're doing once you've declared them 'home-schooled'.

Essentially they have to offer a place. Whether or not it's acceptable. If it had to be to the parents' liking then everyone would be getting their choices.

Personally I don't think the LEA should have to make an offer that's 'to the parents liking'. However I do think the LEA have a very clear responsibility to make sure that all the schools under their control are 'acceptable' and if concerns are raised re portacabins, shoddy educational standards or child safety then these should be immediately acted upon. Under no circumstances should anyone be faced with having to send their child to a school where they feel they would be seriously at risk but the answer to this isn't more parental choice but actually feeling with the issues raised. For the sake of the kids already at the school.

Dealing with not feeling with - obvs

Of course the problem with this is there's no money to invest in making state schools better. They could have done with that 320million which has been given to 'free schools' really. More shite about parental choice rather than good education for all.

Triedandrusted - Family 1 accepted the place offered at a different school for their younger child, and younger child duly joined that school. Family 2 refused the place allocated for their younger child, deciding to 'hold out' on our waiting list. Around October/November, both families went to appeal. Family 1 were refused because child was already in another school. Family 2 won because child was out of education.

Are you sure you have all the facts for this? If what you are saying is correct, then I can see quite a few problems emerging for that school in future years. Particularly if other families get wind of this happening. What will they do if they get 10 families at appeal who have rejected their school allocations. How many “out of education” children can they realistically accommodate every year?