What do Computer Science an Music GCSE students look like?

[GoodyGoodyGumdrops]

Dd has Options Evening coming up. She's a middle-of-the-top-set student. She has four options to choose. She is considering Computer Science and Music.

Dh and I have a concern that she is 'following' her big brother. It's really difficult to know whether she is actually choosing for herself, or from his example (she has form for this).

We also can't quite get past our own preconceptions. Ds is a total, classic geek. His desk looks like Mission Control, with all sorts of tech that he has bought himself. He learns programming languages for fun, ditto composing and technically manipulating music. So to us, that is what a Computer Science and Music GCSE student looks like.

Dd is nothing like him at all!

Really don't know how best to support and guide her.

On the music: our DD was put off by the talk of 'being grade 8 before you start/doing violin since you were 3/ already composing in your spare time', which I have to say came largely from the braggier type of boy. She also sings (but only started lessons last term, after she'd chosen her GCSEs).

Her school music teacher has since said that she's somewhat gutted that DD didn't take music, that she was more than capable, and would we consider putting her in for the National Youth Choir. Some children underestimate themselves, some think they're better than they are. Check you know which yours is.

You don't have to be a Grade 8 level musician in order to take the subject for GCSE. dd was grade 3-4 at the end of Y9 and this was considered by her teachers to be a suitable level for the Performance element of the course.
Her friends who took Music GCSE were already fairly involved in extracurricular music either in or out of school e.g. playing in orchestra, or a small group e.g. wind band or singing in one of the choirs. She didn't choose this option in the end though due to the way that subjects were placed in blocks (a higher preference subject was in the same block).
For computer science the strongest correlation is being good at Maths and at dds school the subject was heavily oversubscribed (only enough teachers for one class). As a tie-breaker they took those with the highest Maths grades at the end of Y9.

DS is doing music IGCE. They were told that their final performance piece (presented at some point in Year 11) needed to be at Grade 5+ standard.

Yes, ds fits a stereotype, but that's by-the-by. Our concern is that he is the only example we've got of what life is like for CS and M GCSE students.

(For the performance part he is doing Music Technology, which has different requirement.)

It's a relief to hear that not all are like my ds! For me there was a distinct correlation between my O-level grades and the amount of interest I had in the subject outside schoolwork.

The only option dd is certain about is Drama. The 3 others are from one MFL, History, Art, Computer Science, Music. I am concerned that Drama, Art and Music all have quite a heavy workload in terms of independent work.

Oh goodness yes, I'd dissuade her very strongly from doing art, music and drama together, if you want to come out sane. DD's school actively prevents them from doing that. Art is particularly time-heavy (DS did music plus drama; his best mate did music plus art; and DD is doing drama plus art - bonkers, the lot of them).

DS1 is doing computer science, music (and art!) among his options. He loves computer games and he is very good at programming but he doesn't spend masses of time on it outside of what's required for GCSE. He plays several instruments but he was also very keen on manga and anime as well as computers and that definitely seems to be a type.
Despite being lazy as anything he has so far miraculously kept up with all the coursework. He also does a language outside school. A high level in maths was required for entry to computer science and he does triple science as well.
Voice counts as an instrument. For the new spec at GCSE top marks in performance are awarded for work at grade 6, whereas it was grade 5 previously I.e a good intermediate level. So, she might want to consider that in terms of achieving a high grade. Another thing to consider is the composition element and how confident she feels about that.

Haha well a GCSE music student in this house has long long brown hair, is short, slim, dressed in hoody and jeans, never wears make up and always has a book in her hand. Big fan of musicals, performing and Disney.

(This is my DD obv). She doesn't do comp science tho.

But her brother is seriously considering computing. He is short as well, muscular and very sporty, does about 5 different sports a week and never ever picks up a book. He also plays the trumpet but doesn't want to do music GCSE (mainly because once he has done compulsories and PE which he "must" do, he only has one option left!) No tech on his desk btw ...

Seriously, both music and computing are excellent options, well regarded by sixth form and employers. Also both creative in different ways. What else will DD be doing? does she have to do MFL or a humanity?

I see by your later posts that she doesn't play an instrument. Voice would count tho if you could establish what level she is at. I would not advise music if she has no instrument to put forward tho. I would be surprised if school would let her do it. DD (who is in year 11) is working towards Grade 6 clarinet and has just passed grade 4 voice. Interesting about how your DS is getting round that!

I don't think music tech is acceptable as an alternative to performance on all boards.

Dd is doing music gcse and considered computer science. What does she look like? She's very pretty, loves musicals and ballet and is in the netball team. I don't really understand your question.

She's top set maths, violin grade 3 and voice grade 5. Just let her do whatever she wants.

I am even more shocked by your explanation of what a Computer Science student looks like is "a boy".

It sounds as though she is doing a good general selection of subjects so let her make HER choices!

I am horrified that a mother of a girl would discourage her daughter from doing a "boy" subject!

Dd ( year9) is doing a one year music gcse this year . She plays piano and clarinet (studying for grade 7 atm). They were advised to be at grade 5 level to take the gcse.She is quite Maths /science orientated (but won't be taking those until year 11) and will be doing a one year art gcse in year10. She's not into computer's at all though.

What's the stereotype OP? Looking like a cross between Mozart and Bill Gates?

Oh I took the OP to mean what sort of things are they into

I think the OP means, does it matter if they're not passionate about computing to do well? If I had a DD who was as keen on programming, and had built her own computer like DS has I would absolutely encourage computing GCSE. Nothing to do with not encouraging a girl at a "boys" subject, but trying to figure out whether that kind of enthusiasm is necessary, or whether some kids - maybe girls more than boys - can do well without it being a leisure time pursuit

Really!

I am not wedging my dc into stereotypes. It just happens that ds fits into one. Our only experience of Computer Science GCSE and Music GCSE is via ds, who spends a lot of leisure time on those subjects. We are wondering whether someone who does not do that should take those subjects. If I had said that she doesn't study any instrument at all, then I imagine everybody would be saying she couldn't possibly do Music GCSE

Thank you Evergreen. Exactly.

Yes to that about music GCSE OP, but you must see that that is a different case. I would encourage a student to study history or French if they were keen, whether or not they spent their leisure hours reading up on the Berlin wall or watching Gerard Depardieu films.

But music is a bit different in that it does require the input of the practical element - and year 10 would generally be a bit late to be starting an instrument with a view to getting to the required level in 18 months.

To be fair computing is not my area of expertise, but AFAIK it is fine to do it just based on an interest and ability in it shown in school lessons. I would talk to your DD's teachers and see what they say. I am sure they will snatch her hand off if she has enthusiasm and ability - all the computing teachers I know want more girls in their classes (if only to bring a bit of calm :)

Personally, I wouldn't encourage music with no formal training and theory knowledge and ability to read music.

Computer Science teacher here. I don't know if this is useful to you but very recently, the Computer Science syllabus has drastically changed so it will be different to what you DS studied.

The controlled assessment has gone down from 60% to 20% in all exam boards. It will only be released in the September of your DD's Year 11 year and marks must be submitted by end of March and not beginning of May like before. It will be based on programming and not include a research investigation like before.

There are now two theory exam papers rather than one and the second one is all about computational thinking and completing algorithms (there was only one question on this at the end of the paper before, now, it comprises of an entire 2 hour paper.)

The theory content has increased by a third in terms of new material (I don't know which exam board your school covers but is the same for all) and includes more Maths (negative binary signed and unsigned, left and right shifts and floating point binary as just one example)

If considering it (and I love the subject and would highly recommend it) just be aware of these changes so your DD can make an informed choice.

You will be able to see all of this at the Options Evening so make sure you take a good look at the two sample exam papers and example Non Examined Assessment (which is vastly different in terms of content than before)

Good luck in choosing!

My daughter did GCSE music and computer science , she's now going computer science as one of her A levels, I wouldn't describe her as a geek, she is also doing Maths, further Maths and Physics, and planning to do computer science at Uni, she doesn't love for computers, doesn't do computer games other than the odd bit of pokemon on the DS, I don't think you have to be a complete square to want a career in computers and have an aptitude for it

Surely you are over thinking GCSES?? Yes, you need to play an instrument /sing /be able to read music for music gcse, but otherwise surely you just learn the syllabus at school? Dd1 got a* Spanish but didn't 'do' any Spanish outside what she learnt in class, ditto geography and biology.

Reading all this with interest as my DS wants to do computer science. Kittyvoncats do you mind me asking about maths ability. DS is computer mad, quite knowlegeable. It's his life! But poor at maths. Doing Foundation level. Might, if he works at it, get a grade 4. Maths and CS science teachers, at options evening recently, both said if he's interested in computers and enthusiastic he should, and can, do it and it will HELP his maths. Are we skating on thin ice here?

The maths involved in Computer Science is all logic maths Minstrelsareyum. Is your DS good at following logical 'steps' to solve maths problems? If so, he should be fine and as with anything, lots of practice will help! Maths takes up about 30% of the course so even if not, he can still certainly achieve up to a 7 fairly easily. I'd say go for it if he loves it!

Thanks Kitty and sorry, op, if I have hijacked your thread. I was going to post about this after this week's options evening! Thank you. We will suggest he goes for it.