progress 8 based on KS2 SATS

[summerchocolate]

On one of the other SATS posts here someone had explained that "progress 8 attainment is based on KS2 SATS scores. That is why secondaries use them to predict grades- they need to get all pupils to an = or + score for progress 8".

Can anyone explain this. I can understand for maths how this might work but how would it work for English where there is a separate score for reading and SPAG plus a teacher assessed writing. The results for each may be very different to each other? Which part would they use for an English score?

Even if secondary schools don't have any faith in the SATS results themselves are they being forced to use them to set their own GCSE targets and to be measured against on progress?

Because so much of what is going on in education is such a load of crap that teachers are losing the energy to endlessly point it out. It's a small turd within a massive heap of dung.

the publicity about the SATS were due to how difficult they were and that 11 year olds were being labeled as failures by the DoE if they didn't achieve above average. what you are discussing on this thread are targets not results which the teaching unions have been fighting against as they are being used as a stick to beat the teaching profession with

FFT targets have been set like this for years. However, they are targets for the school, not the student, and the student should never be given them. The targets the student should be given should be set by a teacher who knows them and be realistic.

the student should never be given them

Agreed. DS1 went through secondary, having gone straight into Y8 from a Scottish primary, without any SATs-related targets, and once we'd got our heads around the alien concept of levelling it all seemed quite straightforward and focused on how he was performing at the time without any reference to how he'd done at primary school.

This time around should be a doddle, we thought, but no. The first Y7 interim report was a very pretty and colourful diagram detailing whether or not he was on target in various subjects, without giving any information about what his targets might actually be. By the end of Y8 we have a list of mostly grade 9 GCSEs to aim for, which is no more helpful. He is bright and a high performer in a couple of subjects, but there's no way he's in the top whatever % in everything. Not even close. It's no use to him to be given misleading information, and it's certainly no bloody use to the poor sods charged with getting him these grades.

These are the targets that my school put on pupils' report so definitely shared with them. It was a total joke for DD. Her school was one who boycotted the SATs that particular year and didn't do the science one. As a result, the system allocated her the average level 4b and then targets reflecting this, so it meant that her GCSE target was a B when she'd only ever had As and A*s at all her exams.

Obviously once explained it didn't matter, but then had to go and seek the explanation as the school certainly didn't bother to explain, all I got from teachers was that it was utter nonsense and to ignore, however, it did become an issue when she applied for 6th form and offers were based on target grades (independent school). The school was great though, I went to speak to the Head of year and agreed to manually adjust the target to an A*. Thankfully, she'd also already done her first mock test by then (in November, so earlier than all the other local schools) and was able to share these results.

I am still to try to comprehend the benefit of this system. How can it be any good for the school if it is not accurate?

Very odd that the offer at sixth form was made on target grades and not predicted.

That was the problem, the secondary school was using target grades as predicted grades!

Agree that it's bizarre the sixth form entry was not based on predicted grades or, more typically for an independent school, an entry exam.