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Secondary education

Connect with other parents whose children are starting secondary school on this forum.

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Original poster

Y7 maths: If you have a top set dc, what are they doing in maths now?

71 replies

Iamthinking · 25/04/2016 09:45

My dd was telling me in bed last night how disappointing maths is at secondary.

She did the Y6 papers for SATs and really enjoyed extra lessons. Now she is stressing that other people in schools elsewhere are overtaking her as she is not learning anything new. She says she is bored because they are doing things that she learnt in Y4 and as a result she doesn't like maths anymore.

I asked her what they were doing at the moment and she said that after about 5 minutes of practicing times tables, they are currently doing time calculations and time tables etc. She said when they do trigonometry they are being taught basic level stuff like 'what is an acute/obtuse angle'.

They do not have setting at her school, so there is quite a range of abilities (state).

OP posts:

user789653241 · 26/04/2016 17:05

I am dreading my ds's secondary school would be same as OP's. There are no children at my ds's level at the moment in primary, and everybody goes to the same secondary.

Khan academy does help. It teaches up to quite high levels. It's worth trying, if she likes it or not.

JustRichmal · 26/04/2016 21:20

I do not know if you can still get the Letts revision guides and workbooks for KS3, but that is what I used with dd at home. CGP do similar ones, so it depends what style you like. These could be an alternative to getting a tutor. At least then you can see she is following what she should be doing in the curriculum. Dd also did Khan Academy and used to pick through the videos if there was something neither of us understood from the revision guide.
Year 7 can be tiring, everything is new and different, so it is important to keep it fun and something she is enjoying doing if she does the work at home. The one great thing she has on her side is she wants to learn the maths and so that will take her further than many other children, even if they are in top set in a SS.

Catmuffin · 26/04/2016 22:36

I asked him if there were any plans to set in maths and he said they are talking seriously about it for year 8 but nothing is in writing.
Yes it sounds like a good time for pushing for setting. Have ofsted said anything about it? Normally they comment on how the most able pupils are stretched in their reports.

Catmuffin · 26/04/2016 22:37

Or at least, in reports I've read I've seen this commented on.

Emochild · 26/04/2016 22:46

For those of you saying you can't differentiate that spread of ability, will you please tell that to the education secretary that because that's exactly what they expect from year 6 teachers -and they aren't even maths specialists!

defunctedusername · 26/04/2016 23:46

Yes, she is being overtaken by students in other schools. Happened to my DC, nothing you can do as the comprehensive system is designed to make everyone equal in the middle/bottom. Only option is private education, free school, grammar, pretend your religious or home school. Do not trust the state with education.

noblegiraffe · 26/04/2016 23:55

It's nothing to do with being a comp, most comps set for maths in y7.

HPFA · 27/04/2016 07:42

jeremycorbyn certainly not true of my daughter's comp but I doubt you'll be convinced no matter how many of us say this!

Catmuffin · 27/04/2016 08:44

A state grammar school is a state school Jeremy.

blearynweary · 27/04/2016 08:52

Our local comp definitely sets from year 7. I do not see how they can teach maths otherwise.

Catmuffin · 27/04/2016 08:55

They've done higher level / astar GCSE syllabus and are now doing further maths level stuff with the aim of moving on to the a level syllabus next year
Will they take Maths GCSE during year 7? I know a child who took it at the end of Year 6 and got A*, although that was via tutoring from an early age rather than the school.

Catmuffin · 27/04/2016 08:57

Also, when will they take A level?

user789653241 · 27/04/2016 09:07

If the school have huge average/ below average intake and not enough children to make up a set for high ability, what happens then? Do they still make up set for one or two children, or they will be put together with lower level children?

yomellamoHelly · 27/04/2016 09:25

Catmuffin - GCSE next year apparently to allow them to "mature" a bit. 12 in ds's class. Tends to be around that number following this route each year. (School know for it's maths and science.) Not sure about a level. Ds never been formally tutored - just me and him and revision guides / books trying to figure out whatever it is he wants to know.

Catmuffin · 27/04/2016 09:50

Thanks youmell.
Irvine. I'm not sure but it's probably quite common in a secondary modern in a grammar area to have one or two more able. Some may have moved to the area after the 11+ or had a bad day or something. They probably have extra sessions before school to stretch them or something?
I know of a grammar school with a super selective intake which ofsted claimed wasn't stretching the most able enough, so can affect all state schools. I don't know if all private schools stretch the most able as no experience.

user789653241 · 27/04/2016 10:05

Catmuffin, thank you. We live in rural area with only one secondary. There will be no choice of grammar so unless we can afford private, my ds's future looks grim.

var123 · 27/04/2016 13:05

In answer, to the original question in the subject header, DS2 is in year 7 and is doing UKMT Junior individual challenge past papers this week ahead of the exam tomorrow morning.
So, its rare to find, but this is an example of true extension work.

Catmuffin · 27/04/2016 13:26

Irvine. Have ofsted said that the most able are not stretched at your local secondary? Also have you checked the value added for the high ability children at your local school? You are looking for a figure of 1000 or over for value added. (If they haven't changed this since i last looked.) You can also check the percentage of high ability children at the school. www.education.gov.uk/schools/performance/

Catmuffin · 27/04/2016 13:31

Look under Best 8 value added

Mishaps · 27/04/2016 13:32

This is exactly why the Yr 6 SATs papers are such a nonsense - the pupils are pushed to do stuff that they then repeat in the first two years of secondary school. Those children who struggle in Yr 6 are being labelled as underachieving for no good reason and with the unfortunate effect of loweuing their confidence and putting them off Maths.

Catmuffin · 27/04/2016 13:35

You could also look at the destination universities of children who leave.

iseenodust · 27/04/2016 13:41

Could have written your post OP. DS has complained about maths since the start of the year. He is at an independent school (a decent one before any one starts on what are you paying for?) & they don't set in yr7 as they take from so many primaries they use the year to bring them all up/assess properly. They are set in yr8 so roll on the summer.

Original poster

Iamthinking · 27/04/2016 14:56

JeremyCorbyn Just to clarify - I said it was a state school, but it is actually a free school - I was just showing that it wasn't independent and therefore had the full range of abilities in each class.
I can't say how the school is doing from published results because this is just the third year of intake.

OP posts:

ohtobeanonymous · 27/04/2016 15:09

seems a shame it isn't standard to allow kids to take their GCSEs early if they could cope. Does anyone have experience of schools which do verticl grouping - i.e ability/experience level across Key Stage rather than within Year Group?

lljkk · 27/04/2016 15:33

If the series starts 7, 16, 25, 34... find the nth term.

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