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Original poster

King's Scholarship Exams

65 replies

Luckyone1 · 15/10/2015 11:04

Hello Everyone,

We visited Eton recently and my DS, as he is not registered, was advised to take the KS exams next April for the entrance at age 13. I understand this is a relevantly short period of time as normally one needs at least 2 years preparation. However, DS was so motived after the school tour at Eton and decided that that was 'the' school for him. DS is bright and doing very well academically. Hence, I am trying to explore the possibilities of tuitions for the KS exams. Should he move to a prep school for it, or get private tutors and carry on with current schooling?

Any advices are sincerely appreciated.

OP posts:
Gruach · 16/10/2015 20:59

It's unlikely that anyone whose child entered at sixth form would open a KS thread ...

No boy I've ever known could give any coherent answer as to what the computerised test involved.

Eton2017 · 16/10/2015 21:28

Actually, though that's often said, mine gave me a very coherent report of what was in it - including explaining what he'd left out of his descriptions when he was asked back at prep school because he didn't think it fair that some people should know in advance what was coming! So I won't share, except to say that I agree that preparing VR and NVR, or anything else specific, would have been pointless.

Gruach · 16/10/2015 21:31
Envy
peteneras · 16/10/2015 22:52

”Peteneras is mis interpreting the standard expected of the candidates from the inserted quote , being asked Oxbridge style question does not mean that candidates will be at the same level in their answers.”

The inserted quote: sieglinde(19/04/2011):
“The King's Scholarship papers at Eton are the hardest CE-level papers I've ever seen, so tough that I actually thought of recycling one for Oxford admissions.”

And again by the same poster (15/08/2012):
“The Challenge is the (old?) name for Westminster entrance exam/scholarship exam. Used to be very very tough, but now I think it's probably less tough than Eton's scholarship exam, which is the toughest I've ever seen.”

The point is not about Oxbridge style question - a question is a question no matter what style it is presented. Rather, it is the Oxbridge level of toughness that the said Oxford don was at pain to put it.

Eton has another exam for candidates being asked Oxbridge style questions but does not require candidates will be at the same level in their answers. It is called, Common Entrance.

Original poster
Luckyone1 · 17/10/2015 04:00

Gruach, is it logical to think that the next and last chance for a boy to go to the school is Sixth Form Entry at 16 if he is going to miss the entry at 13?

Eton2017, I agree that it would be unfair if some people knew what's in the computer assessment in advance. Then maybe it has been happening anyhow, particularly with prep schools, which have been feeders to Eton for years? Was Curious to know what sorts of topics it covers, e.g pure academic subjects-maths, English, or rather quiz-like, brain-teaser, etc....

OP posts:
Translucently · 17/10/2015 08:18

The level is of an Oxbridge First Year standard.. Peteneras I realise that you are rightly proud of your DS's past achievements in getting a KS but frankly it is ridiculous to claim that because the essay questions are thoughtful and open ('Oxbridge style' interview or essay questions') the candidates are required to be of the standard of a first year undergraduate in the depth, knowledge and sophistication of their answers. IEven KS students fail to get through Oxbridge interviews which according to you would be despite them having been at first year undergraduate level before they even started at the school. Hmm

Gruach · 17/10/2015 08:29

OP I must make this point just to reassure you - I have never taught in any prep school (or any school) so have no idea what information is shared over the sherry but I can tell you quite categorically that on pre-test morning boys at even the most successful preps wake up sick with nerves and with no idea of precisely what they will face in the test. And when the results come out a fair proportion of them will be disappointed. I can also tell you that boys from other types of school (state and independent) are just as likely to do well in the test.

I daresay prep school Heads' Reports may be more precisely attuned to what the senior school is looking for - and the boys may have had more opportunity to try out a wide range of activities in school which their HMs can speak honestly about.

But as far as I can see the one distinct advantage boarding prep school boys have at this stage is that they can enthusiastically confirm (if it's the case) their enjoyment of the boarding experience during their interview.

So you shouldn't feel that a non-prep background is any disadvantage prior to receiving a conditional offer.

As your DS is so enthusiastic it might be wise to allow him to take the January test. He's as likely as anyone else to get through.

AnotherNewt · 17/10/2015 08:48

"So you shouldn't feel that a non-prep background is any disadvantage prior to receiving a conditional offer. "

Point of detail : OP isn't trying to secure a conditional offer. It's KS or nothing.

But, the underlying point is valid. Eton uses computer-based tests (used by no others) which no-one knows how to prepare for. It is meant to be a test of ability. And yes everyone is nervous.

Gruach · 17/10/2015 08:59

Mmm.... The point I was making is that a prep school comes into its own in preparing for CE/KS once the child has an offer.

Eton2017 · 17/10/2015 09:02

Try not to let your DS worry, though! DS said the test was fun, and according to Eton that's what a lot of the children say. There's really no need to prepare, so don't worry about that. Keep the effort for the KS prep! I think you need to approach the whole thing as fun, actually. I venture to suggest that if your DS has any chance if enjoying College, he's going to enjoy KS prep: you need to think of that challenge and learning and fun as the point, with actually getting a KS a bonus that would be lovely if it happened.

IndridCold · 17/10/2015 10:35

Re sixth form scholars, there were about 13 who joined this year I think. One scholarship is a specific drama award, one for music, the Horizon scholarships are for boys from the Middle East, and there is a similar one for Russians, and I think there is also one for boys from Liverpool.

All the rest have to come from state schools, although boys at independent schools can be considered if they are on a bursary. I'm still not sure what type of school your DS is at now OP.

Gruach · 17/10/2015 11:10

I remember when I was applying to university staring in disbelief and sorrow at the long, long list of obscure scholarships available - none of which pertained to me. The second sons of destitute clergy from a village within a mile of Thurso, say. Or the red haired daughters of anyone named Clarissa. Or boys under 5 foot nine with an ancestor in the House of Lords who had won the high jump at their prep between 1873 and 1886. Hmm

I muttered harsh things about my parents' and grandparents' lack of forethought ...

But surely, surely, with the wonders of modern science, the MN archive and an advance train ticket, even I could build a suitable boy from Liverpool? Wide open field.

I love a project.

IndridCold · 17/10/2015 11:57

Cannot now remember where I read about the Liverpool one, I don't think I made it up Smile.

Original poster
Luckyone1 · 17/10/2015 12:05

Thanks, everyone. So far, the discussion is 80 : 20, may I say. 80% discouraging and 20% positive!

Eton2017, I could not sleep much those few days due to the big question mark we are facing - to be or not to be? However, you have pointed out the direction! yes, fun approach is the way. I am thinking to get private tutors (who are local and teach A level) to work with on past papers. Even if he won't get KS at the end, at least the exercises would enhance his academic study anyway. If the computer asses can't be prepared, then one has to leave it.

OP posts:
Original poster
Luckyone1 · 17/10/2015 12:35

IndridCold, DS is in an independent school and receiving bursary partly. But this school is all the way to Sixth Form itself. Hence, for Sixth Form Scholarship, he doesn't meet the condition '...UK fee-paying schools with no provision for Years 12 and 13...' In this case, does he has to move to a state school before the application to meet the condition? is there any information on that how many years he has to be in a state school to be qualified?

The dilemma is that DS is very happy at the current school and doing very well in all aspects, he does not want to move. Then if stayed where he is, he would loss the chance of applying for Eton later. Of course, if got KS now, this problem would be there anymore.

OP posts:
Original poster
Luckyone1 · 17/10/2015 12:37

Sorry, I meant 'this problem would NOT be there anymore'.

OP posts:
IndridCold · 17/10/2015 12:55

According to the website, he would have to have been in state school for at least three years I'm afraid.

Gruach · 17/10/2015 12:59

Are you not slightly tying yourself in knots OP?

As far as I understand there is no current requirement that prospective sixth form entrants must apply for a scholarship. It's true there aren't likely to be many places available without - but it is a possible route.

In the meantime - give the pre-test a try; fortune favours the brave.

Original poster
Luckyone1 · 17/10/2015 13:35

IndridCold, 'at least three years' is for New Foundation scholarship at 13. For Sixth Form Scholarship, there is no specific on how many years. I tried and tried to find it on the web. Please do indicate where if you read it there.

Gruach, there are two ways of entry at sixth form. One is Sixth Form Scholarships and the other Sixth Form Entrants. The later requires full fee payment, which I can't afford. So the former is the only option. Hence, the dilemma.

I like what you said 'fortune favours the brave', very kind and encouraging! Indeed, he wants to have a go regardless the outcome!

OP posts:
Gruach · 17/10/2015 13:39

Hmm Surely all full fee entrants are free to apply for a bursary? I'd be surprised if they are only available to the 13 + cohort.

Dapplegrey1 · 17/10/2015 15:00

I think it is fantastic that your DS wants to have a go. Very best of luck to him!
If he succeeds he has got a fantastic experience awaiting him. If not......well he sounds the sort of boy who will get on in life wherever he goes to school.

IndridCold · 17/10/2015 15:12

Lucky you are right, it doesn't say three years on the Sixth Form Scholarship page, but on this link, if you scroll down to Sixth Form Scholarships it mentions the minimum of three years.

I have to say that it does seem as if the odds are against you, but if your DS fully understands that he might not succeed then I see no reason why he should not give it ago. The Etonian view would certainly be that it is better to try and not get in, than to just give up and spend the rest of your life wondering what might have been!

Original poster
Luckyone1 · 17/10/2015 15:48

Gruach, from the web - 'Financial support is not available for entry at age 16, other than through the Sixth Form Scholarship scheme for students in UK State Education'.

Dapplegrey and IndridCold, thank both for the encouragement. Yes, you are right, Indrid, it did say 'at least three years'. Would be interesting to watch whether there will be some changes in admission as well as in other aspects of the school with the new HM, who had an interview with Telegraph recently.

OP posts:
Gruach · 17/10/2015 15:58

Oh - that's a shame.

However, you never know what might change in the next few years. And let's hope you won't need sixth form entry.

MidLifeCrisis007 · 18/10/2015 06:59

There is nothing to lose from sitting from your DS for the KS exam, but in my limited experience the fact that he is bright and doing well in his year group is in no way a guarantee that he'll shine in the KS exams. There are lots of boys who fly high in their year group who don't even get places - let alone try to be amongst the top few percent of those who do secure conditional offers.

My DS's prep school (which was very small) told us that it would be unable to prepare him for the scholarship exam - the standard required and the angles that they come out are not in line with the Common Entrance syllabus and the school didn't have the resources to "extend" him in that way. As it happens, he wasn't disappointed as he never liked the idea of being in College anyway and any boy can earn an Oppidum scholarship by getting 3 successive distinctions in trials.

I understand many of the Asian KSers have done their maths A level by the time they sit the exam. They aren't just bright - but child geniuses.