Should Alevel teachers have a degree in the subject?

[MitziKinsky]

I just presumed they would.

DS is in Y12, and assures me one of his physics teachers knows what they're doing. The other doesn't seem to have a clue, apparently, as he's usually a maths teacher. DS says he has a degree in Philosophy and Maths. (I'm presuming that's two different degrees )

Shouldn't A'level teachers have a degree in the subject or I'm I totally out of touch?

[Ricardian]

DS says he has a degree in Philosophy and Maths. (I'm presuming that's two different degrees

You're presuming wrong.

Maths and Philosophy is one of the hardest courses to get onto at Oxford.

www.ox.ac.uk/admissions/undergraduate/courses-listing/mathematics-and-philosophy

It's a very well-known, very hard-core combination. I know several world-class theoreticians who have that as their first degree.

[Ricardian]

Computing : did not exist when we were at school

How old are you? O Level computer science was a mainstream subject in the late 1970s, and the syllabus dated back well before then. There was a matching A Level, which I did in a big group. A lot of the content would be beneficial for today's undergraduates.

[IguanaTail]

Interesting. I also have a friend who is a French specialist but teaches English to GCSE. Her class make the best progress in the (already very good) department.

[MitziKinsky]

I stand corrected Ricardian..

The school last year had one of the most highly qualified science departments in the universe, so they said (or maybe they county - I may be exaggerating )

If the physics teacher has already told Y12 what degree he has, he must be proud of it, and good for him.... but I'll keep my fingers crossed that he can teach physics.

[noblegiraffe]

You can do conversion courses to teach A-level physics, I know a teacher who has done one. So the teacher may have training in teaching physics A-level.

[BoboChic]

MFL degrees are a quite reasonable basis for teaching English, at least up to GCSE. Any sort of comparative literature degree at a good university should have imparted the skills necessary to teach English to 11-16 year olds.

[jorahmormont]

A few of my friends are doing their PCET to teach A Level Drama and the requirement is that they have a degree in the subject they want to teach.

That said, in secondary school one of the English teachers had studied drama. Our maths teacher doubled as a geography and PE teacher, and RS teacher also taught Leisure & Tourism.

[catslife]

Depends on the type of school really. It may be reasonable to expect this if your ds is at a fee paying school but otherwise a degree in a closely related subject would be OK (especially if it is closely related so Maths, Engineering or another Science would be fine as the teacher is likely to have done A level Physics himself at some point). As has been said upthread there is a shortage of Physics teachers.
Sadly most of my contemporaries with Physics degrees have left teaching but often they moved subject areas e.g. teaching computer Science and Electronics as well.

[Ladymuck]

I'd noticed that even the local superselective grammar schools are now advertising for teachers of humanities, rather than history or geography or RS specialists.

[TalkinPeece]

I still maintain that having a teacher who is just a chapter or two ahead of the class in the textbook is a poor substitute for having a teacher who loves the subject and knows it inside out

Which does not necessarily require having a degree in it.

If I went in to any sort of teaching it would be in the topic which has provided my income for the last 25 years in which I have neither O Level, A Level or degree.

[BoboChic]

I agree, Talkin, that it is possible to be far more knowledgeable about a subject that is not the subject of one's degree when one is 10/20/30 years into one's post-educational life.

[Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g]

If I went in to any sort of teaching it would be in the topic which has provided my income for the last 25 years in which I have neither O Level, A Level or degree.

IIRC, you've got a professional qualification in it equivalent to a first degree, if not a second degree. Still a very different proposition indeed from what I'm talking about.

[Pandylion]

One of the things which really impressed us about our DC's grammar school was that all the teachers actually have degrees in the subjects they actually teach. This is rarer than you'd think.

I certainly wouldn't want our DC being taught maths by someone with a geography degree (and I know a school where this is currently happening). Essentially in these circumstances the teacher is just a few pages ahead of the pupil in the text book. And what if an inquisitive, bright pupil starts asking questions that are even further ahead in the text book than just a few pages?

At our DC's school a geography teacher trying to teach maths to the top maths sets would probably just get eaten alive. You need to be very good at your subject and seriously know your stuff if you're going to try and teach it to the top 5% in the county.

Some subjects blend very easily. If you have an English degree there's no reason why you shouldn't teach Media, though I would hesitate at a Media graduate teaching A Level English Literature.

Having a decent degree in the subject you teach should be the basic requirement. And you should have a decent ability at conveying what you know to your pupils. All pupils deserve nothing less.

[BrendaandEddie]

its the skill of the teaching that makes the diff

the subject can be learned

[BrendaandEddie]

and often a level syllabi have NOTHING to do with your degree

say, for example in History. teacher did saxon history and teaches 19th cent European

[TalkinPeece]

Pandylion
I am 50. What I studied at university has no bearing on my current skill set.
If I'd done a geography degree but then gone into Accountancy and then retrained as a teacher I would not be a few pages ahead of the pupil in the text book
Especially once I had a few years experience under my belt.

Teaching is about pedagogy, not what you fancied learning about for 3 years at age 18.

[Pandylion]

"I still maintain that having a teacher who is just a chapter or two ahead of the class in the textbook is a poor substitute for having a teacher who loves the subject and knows it inside out

Which does not necessarily require having a degree in it"

Quite true. However, we do need some sort of standardised, recognized level of qualification which demonstrates that the holder of the qualification has an in depth knowledge of the subject.

Otherwise, you could just have any Tom, Dick & Harry rocking up for teaching posts with a heartfelt 'Honestly, I really, really love literature/maths/geography and have loved it all my life and I'm really enthusiastic about it. So I would be the best person for the job. Honest. Just let me into the classroom. Go on. Let me."

And, you would only have their word for it.

You do get graduates who aren't enthusiastic about their subject, and they shouldn't be teaching. But luckily you do still get graduates who enjoy their subject and are teaching it to a high level.

[charis3]

It simply would not be possible to have a degree in every subject you are required to teach to A level.

I have degrees in Botany, and pathology.

I have taught A level biology, physics, chemistry,maths, psychology, sociology, business, media, health and social care.....

I think it is a real advantage to struggle in a subject before you teach it, as you understand the pitfalls and difficulties better.

If A level subjects were only offered by teachers with a degree in those subjects you would cut the A level course on offer in this country by more than 75%.

I have only ever met one maths teacher with a maths degree, in 20+ years teaching.

[BrendaandEddie]

i teach a subject i have NO qualifications in at all. i get V good results every year.

Even when i did teach the one i DID, the course i taught was not like my degree

[Pandylion]

Not all subjects can be learned to a sufficiently high enough level to teach it successfully at A Level.

Try as I might I think no matter how much I studied I would never be able to teach A Level Physics for example. Same with A Level Art or Music.

[TalkinPeece]

However, we do need some sort of standardised, recognized level of qualification which demonstrates that the holder of the qualification has an in depth knowledge of the subject
Piffle.

You need people who have qualified as a teacher - so that they understand HOW TO TEACH - PGCE is the most common

Having huge subject knowledge and a deep love for the esoteric parts of a subject is actually an impediment to getting past the marking schemes of GCSE

FFS you can read 10,000 books for your English degree, but you'll still be teaching Of Mice and Men year in, year out

[Pandylion]

"I think it is a real advantage to struggle in a subject before you teach it, as you understand the pitfalls and difficulties better.

You see this is just the weird alternative universe of Mumsnet, where it's better to be really crap at a subject you teach, and that way you can empathise and understand what your pupils will struggle with.

No. Be good at your subject and also good at teaching in a way that all your pupils will understand.

[charis3]

I didn't say be crap at your subject, just that if you found it hard to learn yourself, you can better help others with the same difficulties.

[charis3]

You need people who have qualified as a teacher - so that they understand HOW TO TEACH

this is irrelevant, as you get exactly 0 say in how to teach on the actual job.

[TalkinPeece]

Try as I might I think no matter how much I studied I would never be able to teach A Level Physics for example. Same with A Level Art or Music.
That is your problem.
I could get myself back up to the right level to teach Physics at that level with a month or two of cramming.

If I ever fancied teaching that is.