Did you go to private or grammar and are sending your child to state school?

[TheWoodenSpoonOfMischief]

How do you feel about it?
Dh and I went to private and grammar respectively but ds1 will go to the local comprehensive. I hope he'll be fine there but I feel a bit sad that we can't offer him the same type of education we had.
I obviously don't want to offend anyone with my remarks and I know lots of children do well in state.
Just want to hear from anyone who's done the same.

"Stop being so judgy for making my choices...they are individual to me, not you."

Just accept that you are buying into a deeply unfair system - one of social, intellectual and financial apartheid in education which both creates and perpetuates social inequality. You are helping to sustain it.

"they are individual to me, not you."

You live in a community not in a vacuum - as do your children and the other children in local schools. Your decisions and those of tens of thousands of other parents are what shapes the character and intake of the schools that the rest of our children have to go to.

Strange notion also that those children from deprived areas cannot be clever, talented children, who could, given the right opportunity - develop into children that people would not take an exception to.

Not all schools are adept at identifying these children...but some are, from all sectors. Not all schools are selective in other words - from both sectors and therefore these children, if motivated enough, may turn things around with decent teaching, peer groups and collaborative working environment. Something that both sectors have, but not all.

Just like a bright child motivated enough with a strong ethic, may have this stripped to bare if having to push that water up hill from the get go. This also applies to both sectors.

Just accept that you are buying into a deeply unfair system - one of social, intellectual and financial apartheid in education which both creates and perpetuates social inequality. You are helping to sustain it

You know what else creates social inequality and the other problems you mention? Kids who's parents couldn't dream of sending their kids to private school not getting a place at a good school because richer people are coming in and pricing them out of area/buying a hugely expensive house down the road etc. I send my kids to private, we can easily afford it, and live in a very socioeconomically divided area with few good schools, one of our catchment states is one of the best in the country, should my children take the places at those schools and force the ones who's parents can't afford private to have a bad education at a bad school? I don't think so.

I send my kids to private school for many reasons, but that is one of them, I can afford to send them to a good school like Holland Park comp (our local, also some more deprived neighborhoods in catchment), but with them going there, that is going to deny someone who might never, ever be able to afford such a high standard school.

The good state school places being taken up by millionaires is outrageous IMO. It's a big problem here in London and it's terrible.

If you met me in the street Nicole (god forbid), would you single me out as different? And if so, how would you identify that?

Would you judge me if I said I worked in private, public sector, self employed or...a stay at home mum?

But it's ok for you to judge me because I did not make the same school choices as you, and that you hold me solely responsible for the education sector as a whole? But your friend who chose state school A over B is what, ok to hang out with? (because all the state schools are equal of course in your world)

And that my 'community' schools are full (because it's London) and that therefore it's my duty to have my DD travel 8 miles out on 3 different modes of transport...to what. Breathe a different community that she doesn't even live in?

I repeat, given the choice, most of us would choose to send our children to the local comp. That a private education does not necessarily equate to a better education. By this thread, wouldn't even provide a better learning experience by those already posted.

I think your prejudices run a lot deeper than schooling choices alone.

Going back to OP's point - they said they feel a bit sad that they can't offer the same education to their children. I think they've got a pretty balanced and objective view from the posters here who are hopefully reassuring to their choices.

Well, some at least.

There aren't any comprehensives where I live (Kent). I went to independent and comprehensive, DH to a sec modern.

DS is at a superselective and DD is still at primary. She won't be going to independent.

I went private and DH state. Our DC are at an outstanding comp that we were very lucky to get into. I work in a lovely selective private school. Sometimes I feel a bit guilty that we can't afford private, but am really not sure that there is much value added in private compared to my DC's outstanding comp.

My dh went to grammar school and I went to the sink comp.
2 of ours went to local state schools, I wish they'd have had the opportunity to go private, in another town.
DD boards, but not for academic reasons. I'm still glad she's not in our local state schools.

Some are amazing, good as any private. However, some are dire and it doesn't seem fair that there are such discrepancies in the standard of education.

I went to a grammar school which also took fee-paying boarders. It was a lovely school in many ways, and part of me would love to send DD somewhere similar, but that's just sentimentality as the local comprehensive is actually a much better school.

I went private from age 11, my ex went private all the way (but in another country)

Ds has just gone private, mostly because the area I live in has really bad failing schools with high staff turnover and large class size, and I would have had to of moved to get a place at a school that I think he would have settled at.

I also, personally, feel that I let ds down a bit because I'm a single parent (I know, I know) and the one benefit I can see from me and his dad being apart (asides from our sanity!) is that the cost of the school fees is halved which is the only way it is affordable for us. I am the black sheep of the family, and I just wanted to give ds the best education I could to try and make up for that.

Larger in comprehensives in places like London where a disproportionate number of high ability and education focused children are in private (15%) and socially exclusive church schools. This makes them harder places in which to teach and learn.

And yet London comprehensives, on average, outperform comprehensives in other areas of the country, in terms of outcomes for different ability bands. You are more likely to outperform the national average for a school of comparable make-up in a London school. Statistically, you are more likely to attend an 'Outstanding' school in London.

I can think of at least 3 comps in my general area where the FSM level is much higher than national average, and so are the results.

Obviously there are schools where there are problems - a critical mass of harder to teach pupils.

Nicole: London has high levels of wealthy population, (alongside high levels of disadvantage), high levels of international corporate employees with school fees paid in with the package. I wouldn't assume the overall reasons for a higher level of private ed are based on feral London youth, or as having a disastrous effect on the make up of London's schools!

I went to private school and my experience put me off ever doing the same with my children. Lucky, as we couldn't afford it!

I went to a state grammar school, my dh to a private boarding school (public school...). Our children are state educated - one now at the local comprehensive, the other still at the local primary. We love the comprehensive school - he is so happy there and it has a lovely atmosphere. I just don't see the need to hanker after anywhere else.

Thanks for sharing your experiences everyone. I do feel less disheartened now. Im sure ds will be fine at the local comprehensive.

I went to secondary modern and then private. All my siblings went to grammar and private, or just private.

My DC are going to comprehensive, even though we have grammar schools (super selectives) in my town...I ship them out to a neigbouring town. (TBH only DS1 would have got into the grammar school) All my siblings DC attend/ed state schools. All my friends from the private school I went to send their DC to state schools. Sorry one sends her DSC to a private school, but they live abroad and I think she may want them to have a British education, knowing they will move back to the UK...or she may have chosen an nice private school if she lived in London, or elsewhere in the UK...who knows...

There are no private schools near me I would be willing to send my DC to, apart from a public school at £30Kpa which I couldn't afford.

I know quite a few people from baby groups when DS1 was a baby who sent their DC to the near by public school (when I say quite a few there are only about 12 in Y7, but I seemed to know them all). When they all started in Y7 I lamented, thinking DS wouldn't achieve what his peers from baby group would just because they were going to a public school and he was going to a comprehensive even though DS had obviously been the brightest baby He's just started Y12 with very good GCSE results. Not all A*s, but I honestly don't think he would have got better results if he'd been to the public school. I genuinely believe the state school he attends have got the maximum out of him any school could. He could have done better if he's put in more work, but that was never going to happen whatever school he went to. The school he attends is a "good" school, nothing outstanding, but it's really worked for him, and I pray it works for DS2 too.

I realise not everyone is lucky enough to be able to send their DC to a state school which works for their DC. There are some fab independent schools out there, and some dire ones....a bit like state schools really.

This is of interest to me, DS isn't at school yet but DH went to a mix of private and then very selective Grammar and I went to my closest run of the mill (quite bad actually) school and we've turned out to be pretty similar people (although he is to be fair higher earning now but we are in wildly different industries and mine is low paid). He wants DS to go to a private school very close to our house while I want him to go to the close Outstanding state primary. My arguement is that why would you commit that amount of money to educating a 4 year old when you have no idea what the state school is like in comparison as they aren't really tested on the same level, and that an outstanding state can be better than a middling private school. But then I see that we want DS to have the best shot at the Grammar when the time comes as (my lefty principles aside) it is one of the best schools in the country and of course I'd want to maximise his chances of getting there. God, education is hard. I suppose I should be happy to have choices but I just went to the closest school to me, no other choice where I lived!

My kid shave had a much better education at their comp than I ever got at my private selective school.

DH and I were both privately educated and our DC will be going state

1. We just can't in any way afford it. I have no idea who can really these days. Our parents were all teachers but there's no way teachers kids are going to private school now

1. I was brought up in a rural idyll with no choice of school but now live in an academic city where there's really no such thing as a bad school just more and less good ones. I don't reckon it's worth bankrupting ourselves for.

1. Arrogantly I think I would have done just as well with or without my private school. It was non-selective, perfectly reasonable but nothing special. My parents had far more of an influence through their support at home. Research is on my side with this.

We were both privately educated all the way through - and boarded from 8 and 11 respectively. We have four children and the secondary fees for schools that I would consider here, would be about £120k a year - even to the day schools. Even on a six figure salary, we just can't do it, and have a life, eat, keep a roof over our heads etc.

So they will be going through the state system - and already DS1 is at a superselective grammar (one of the best in the country), DD has just taken her 11+ and fingers are firmly crossed that she gets into grammar - and DSs 3 and 4 will take it and we'll see! We are very lucky that we have excellent state options here, and many people move from London to take advantage of this (we did). Therefore the schools at both primary and secondary are extremely good, parents are very motivated about their children's education and are very involved in the schools and there are a huge range of extracurricular activities and clubs in the area to give the breadth of options outside of school - it just means we do a lot of ferrying about to things, rather than them being on site. Yes, they are perhaps less 'polished' or confident than some privately educated children, but we try to teach them manners and encourage them to behave like moderately civilised human beings .

I do have moments when I feel sad that they won't have the same experiences we had - but I think that nowadays it is necessary to have so much money to send more than 2 children to decent private schools, that it's a totally false reality and doesn't let children experience the 'real world' - one could argue that some of them will never have to inhabit it, but most will - at work, at university etc, and I think it's important to understand that not everyone skis in the winter, goes to Barbados at Christmas and is on a yacht in the summer (I have my tongue in my cheek a little bit here).....

At DS1s school this week, the private school children were absolutely horrified that they were going to have to sit on the floor in a whole school assembly which did make me smile....even at my very expensive private school we had to sit on the floor - things have changed a bit!!

On the other way round...

I was state educated all through and NEVER imagined paying to go private. But I was driven to it by the utter chaos in the local state primary, which badly let down my first child. I now have one in private senior and a another in private junior. I am not saying this to boast - rather it is to express my intense frustration that I felt I had no choice in order to get my kids the same standards of academic focus (and in our case a good musical experience) that I had. I earn just enough to make it feasible, though it has affected everything else we do. I envy those who live in an area with a good comp or grammar schools. Our neck of the woods is a bit patchy on that front!

"I wouldn't assume the overall reasons for a higher level of private ed are based on feral London youth, or as having a disastrous effect on the make up of London's schools!"

I didn't say or imply that London state schools are in a state of crisis. You have put that spin on my words.

But their make up and character IS affected by the large numbers of high ability children who are educated separately.

My brother's children attend a state perfectly decent state primary school in west London. Every single child who was on the top table for maths left in year 4 and 5, apart from my nephew. They all left to go to private schools in preparation for selection at 11. In my dc's primary class in a much rougher part of London 4 of the brightest children in a class of 30 have disappeared to attend private schools. It's really depressing. Both my boys were in properly mixed classes representing the full range of ability. Towards the end of primary there's a sort of 'winnowing out', the result of which is that the local comprehensive appears to be almost entirely lacking that cohort of very high achieving children. Bright children - yes, these children are there. But the ones who have had parental support and tutoring to turn that brightness into achievement at a very high level, they've gone.

I agree that London schools are better than many others, and there are complex reasons for this. One of the reasons for better schools is that we have great access to a very large pool of teaching talent from abroad, compared to places outside London. We also have very large numbers of children from immigrant families, who pound for pound, seem to achieve vastly higher than children from white English families who are attending similar schools and whose parents are in the same sort of income bracket.

Thank god for immigrants I say. The heads of the crappest schools in London must give praise every day for the immigrant children who land in their schools, bringing their education loving families and great work-ethic with them.

One of the reasons for better schools is ...

... that you get loads of cash thrown at you.

the City of London getting the most at £8,595 ahead of Tower Hamlets (£7,014) and Hackney (£6,680.05) ... At the other end of the scale, Cambridgeshire is the worst funded per-pupil at £3,950, followed by South Gloucestershire (£3,969) and Leicestershire (£3,995)

Thank you for starting this thread. It has reassured me greatly about dd and her being fine in state education.

DH and I were both privately educated. The DC are highly likely to be state educated primarily because the fees are just unaffordable - I haven't even bothered thinking much about what I'd prefer because private just isn't an option. However, I did have a very positive experience at my (girls') school - didn't see any massive bitchness (or at least, none higher than with any girls), I don't feel that I was hugely shielded from 'real life' (whatever that means anyway), and I did well academically. Impossible to know how I'd have fared in a state school.

I do hope that the DC will achieve their full potential in the state system, and I hope that they will get all the opportunities I got. It worries me that there is only one chance with their education, and we only have one choice. But that's that. So far, oldest is only Y3, but I can't see how she'd be doing better in the private system, which is positive.

I've heard that school fees have increased far faster than wages over the past few decades - does any one have any information which shows if that's true?

Nicole - the only dc at my children's primary schools who left for private are those who had SN (one with autism, one with very severe dyslexia). One or two went private for secondary, with only modest additional tutoring.
In some areas there may be a mass exodus to private, but not in our part of North London. Fwiw.