How much would you sympathise with dd in this situation?

[Takver]

She's complained to me a number of times that their science teacher frequently comments on several of the girls' personal appearance. Apparantly he tends to 'pick on' specific girls, particularly the - for want of a better word - pretty/popular ones (ie not the geeky ones!) if they aren't trying hard in class.

DD is very clear that he's never singled her out, (unsurprisingly since she's ms science geek) - but she says that she knows some of the girls he does pick out are already funny about their weight, and she feels it's unhelpful if a teacher calls them 'fat and stupid', even in jest.

So far I've suggested that she sits quiet and says nothing, since she has many more years of being in his class - but would you be more sympathetic - and if so, any helpful suggestions??? (I'm sure he's trying to be lighthearted and funny, and just jolly them along, but it does sound like not the best approach with teen girls.)

I just can't see that a counsellor would break confidentiality by passing anything on to the relevant staff- there's a big difference between a pupil talking generally about a teacher being rude in class, and an assertive parental email or phonecall with the expectation of action.

I'm all for being laid back about stuff that is genuinely unimportant, but you can take all this meek shall inherit the earth stuff too far: nothing ever changes until somebody makes a fuss, and when you are in a position to prevent young girls being belittled in the classroom, I think it's only right to do that.

I'm so glad that's your experience, CamelHump- good for those girls not putting up with such shitty treatment.

I'm guessing your dc don't go to a small rural school, CamelHump?

You just cant go round calling people fat and stupid.

Wow. NOT acceptable.
I am with the pp who said, you should praise your DD for standing up for her classmates. If you haven't, please do. Please don't tell her to put up and shut up I know teens can be um, overly enthusiastic I tore strips off teachers probably not much more than 5-10y older than me over issues like animal rights/ socialism/ feminism, I was actually Saffy from AbFab-- but, secondary school teachers need to know how to deal with that without crushing the kid, or themselves none of what I objected to was even close to the quite personal, sexual comments your DD is reporting. They are NOT acceptable. End of issue, if your DD can't or won't, you need to report this. If I were you I would be concerned about 1. the probably very vulnerable teen girls who this teacher is, to whatever extent, preying on and 2. your DD who has admirably stuck up for them.
Ps - don't think because your DD isn't the target now, she won't be in future. I was a science geek too. I still get ID-ed now in my early 30s. I looked 12 in 6th form. So I wasn't a victim of these type of teachers...it hit me when I was studying for my Masters. Suddenly every desperate guy liked me. Ugh. Please please teach your DD to be assertive, and that boys/ men are NEVER entitled to female attention.

erm... I would be complaining on behalf of your DD, not even the other girls.

First, he DID single her out. He very obviously implied she was fat when he said "well, you're not stupid".

Second, how dare he insult someone's country?! Not "just" fat and stupid "jokes", but also xenophobic ones. IMO, the example you gave is even worse than calling a student fat and stupid. Because he did that anyway with an extra dig that all her family is too!

Third, your DD should not see you sitting by thinking this is no big deal. Even if he hadn't made the above comments to your DD. It IS a big deal. If the students he's saying these things to are self conscious and embarrassed then they won't be complaining, even to their parents.

OP I kind of understand your reluctance, but you don't have to have an all-guns-blazing approach. A carefully worded email to the Head of Science , not the counsellor, keep it separate, Could work wonders for the others in the class, and shows your dd that it isn't acceptable and others need to be aware of what he says.

In a different class, workplace, time it might be your dd that's on the end of some less than savoury comments - she needs to know that's it's ok to do something about it, and that doing something doesn't have to be a scary thing to do.

"That's where I've been to date, BeaufortBelle. Basically - yes, it's not great, but it's up to those affected to complain."

Wow. Those other teenager girls being told by a teacher that they are fat and stupid? Yep- they are going to be in a really good place to complain from, aren't they? Of course you have to say something. Make an appointmnt ith the Head of Year and just tell exactly whwt you've said here.

Wtf! Report this to the school.

It is totally unacceptable for a teacher to be calling pupils fat and stupid.

He should be struck off.

If you really feel like you can't report to the school report him to the teaching regulatory body.

The best most empowering and productive thing would be
for your DD to talk in confidence to the head of year. What could be better then your DD sorting it out

Thanks everyone for your comments. I think Butterflywings has the best mental picture of my dd - she's definitely in full Saffy teenage enthusiastic stage. (So for context, she was the pupil on the school trip who pointedly took a packed lunch to eat in Macdonalds )

So I'm really not encouraging her to put up and shut up, just maybe to be a little aware that sometimes it's worth picking your battles. However, I'll get her actually to write down next time the actual comments + context, and take things from there.

Heh, she sounds great I used to try to prevent my younger sisters buying Nestle chocolate with their pocket money! So I know what you mean about picking battles was told that more than once
I just think in this instance she's right and those comments are inappropriate and unacceptable. If you had posted about the teacher mocking her latest save the whales petition or similar I would totally understand the reaction.
I missed (x-post maybe) the comment he made to her about not being stupid. It really sounds as if he thinks girls/ women can't be both attractive and intelligent which is such a damaging lesson for them to learn.
Telling her to write incidents down is an excellent plan - not dealing with problems by going nuclear, but assertively, following procedures, gathering evidence, is a great lesson for her to learn. In 10 years you'd want her to do that if eg there were sexist comments in her workplace. Good luck.

She needs to approach the head of year herself. She needs to learn to speak up

I think raising it with your DD's tutor sounds like a good idea in the circumstances you describe. Chances are colleagues have their antennae raised already about this teacher and will take these complaints very seriously. You MUST report it though.

"She needs to approach the head of year herself. She needs to learn to speak up"

No she doesn't. This is not about a "learning experience" for the OP's daughter- it is about what is happening in the classroom.

Takver- you have to do something about this now. Saying that it's up to the people concerned to complain is just not acceptable. And anyway your daughter is involved. He told her she was fat.

"I really don't think he's that awful! I think he's a bit socially awkward and getting it wrong, to be absolutely honest."

This may be the nub of it.

Because, as you say in OP, he's 'picking on' them if they aren't trying hard in class

So it's not so much what he's doing (commenting on effort/work/attitude), it's how he's doing it ('jokey' insults usually aren't remotely funny, and should only be used by the socially skilled). What does he say to boys who aren't trying hard?

Bert why can't it be a learning/empowering thing for her DD? She's old enough to raise the issue

She doesn't need any training in that area, French- Takver has already said she's pretty assertive. It's important that the issue is raised in an official capacity by a parent so it actually gets dealt with. Copies of emails are dated and can be kept, there will be a record of what action will be taken, if there's no satisfaction it can be escalated etc. and everyone can be brought up to speed accurately. There's also the important element of protecting the daughter from possible victimisation for 'whistle-blowing'.

Brief update: DD says that there haven't been any more comments (following the lesson when she 'complained') and she suspects someone else may have said something. But if it happens again, she's going to make a note of exactly what is said.

It could be worse - my friend's dd (different school) got told off this week for 'speaking the language of the devil' (ie, English)

". It's important that the issue is raised in an official capacity by a parent so it actually gets dealt with"

This.

But hey ho. So long as it doesn't happen in the OP's dd's hearing again, that's fine. After all, it's for the people affected to complain..........

BertrandRussell - I think you're being a bit harsh. I mentioned in my OP that I have had to deal with school for problems that do affect dd directly (quite serious bullying). Because of this, I'm reluctant to complain as readily as I might otherwise about other matters, as I want to avoid being seen as 'that parent' who is always the first off the mark to pick up the phone.

I could also point out that there are 29 or so other students in the class, who can potentially also raise the matter. It seems likely that one of them has done so, and it's been dealt with.