Year 8 end of year exams

[Everhopeful]

DD is not great at revision. I have been gently trying to get her to do some, since the exams are now only a fortnight away, but without wrecking her holiday. I would expect reasonable performance as long as she looks at everything she's done this year, since she's got a fair memory. DH is of the view that she'll fail everything unless she spends a lot of time on revising and that will mean she drops down the sets enough to end up with the "wrong" exams (and probably a higher proportion of the more maladjusted at her school). I tend to feel it's Y8, not GCSE and she's got enough work ahead of her, but he feels I'm being too optimistic. What's the view out there?

Think we've slightly neglected DS and his Y8 exams as we've had dd doing GCSE's. DS's are all done and dusted now - in 2 weeks before half-term.
He did occasionally pipe up with "I've got exams too Mum" and I'd say wwell have you got revision for homework tonight ds? Recently - when his friend and friend's Mum were over - he got round to telling us they will affect which sets he's put in for Maths and Sciences. Hoping his natural ability especially in Maths will mean it works out OK. And it's a good school so hopefully any of the sets will be OK for him within reason? Gosh, I'm so much more laid back with DC2! GCSE's have taken all my attention this year

ds is in Scottish system and there were no end of year exams at all - so first "real" exams he had were the Nat 5 (GCSE equivalent) prelims (mocks). He had had the odd subject test - particularly in maths where they were more serious and used for streaming -but other than that nothing. So consequently he had no real idea about how to revise - and prelims were a disaster. I did sit him down well before his actual Nat5 exams though and helped prepare a revision framework as described above - let's hope it has paid off. I have noticed though that this years S3 (the year below ds) do have end of year exams for the first time so it looks like the school have realised that they need to give the students the opportunity to learn how to revise before the national exams are upon them.

I wouldn't want to do anything I didn't feel I couldn't sustain so I've never helped mine organise their own revision, even though some were ultra disorganised. But they learned to become more organised themselves, in time. Their school does test regularly throughout the year though, which must help. Very occasionally one or other DC has asked me to test them from their exercise book but it's fairly pointless, since I don't know the syllabuses and can often barely read their writing, so it's all fairly limp. Personally, I'd be wary of too much parental input beyond general encouragement and aiming high, as Milly says, or they might come to rely on that help whereas by secondary school, with school stuff, surely they need to be self-reliant? What people say they're doing on this thread sounds good, but it might possibly be counter-productive. Perhaps I'm just lazy.

I think you have lots of children, Molio, so lazy is possibly not an accurate description of you!

For a few years DD1 had school exams after half term, so there was a bit of nagging during the holidays to start revision. After a couple of years, exams were moved to before half term and therefore all revision was done in school. I also think my children were in the "just in time and just about enough" box. Both have now learnt that strategy is risky - but, they learnt that for themselves.

It's just yr 8 end of year exams .. my opinion is who cares they don't count for anything. This country and exams ....next they'll have to take in nursery so they can poop !!!

Banding tests are overlooked by teachers in primary schools even thought it effects Secondary Schools yet Sat's are the end of the earth because its what the schools get measured on & reflects teachers pay rise sorry mean performance.

To me, the Y8 exams matter mainly as a learning experience of preparing for and sitting exams. (I wouldn't want my DC to learn this when they are doing their GCSEs).

It also teaches techniques for dealing with exam nerves, if necessary.

The final benefits are that it may effect setting in year 9 (which matters a lot to some DC) and it can highlight a subject a child is struggling. Although DS1 goes to a really good school, not every teacher seems to be on top of how each child is performing.

But, I agree, they don't count for anything (Thank God!).

We have done exactly the same as you SonorousBip, ds has year 8 exams starting next week so fingers crossed it works!

haggisaggis - weren't there exams at the end of S2, to help the Dc choose which O Grades they should do (or whatever the exams are called nowadays!)?

I would hope that grades throughout the year and baseline data would affect setting more than a single exam grade var123, but perhaps not.

Also, I do think there might be a real risk of upping the ante on exam nerves by making really very trivial exams into a massive great deal, with this level of parental scrutiny and guidance. I think it's possible DC take exams more in their stride if they just get on with it. Perhaps not.

Not my son, Ds1. He was terrified of the SATS, slightly less so for the Y7 exams, less again for the Y8 exams. If nothing else, he's learning to believe in himself with each successive set, and also learning how to prepare.

The Y7 results were used to set for year 8. I don't know what will hapen in year 9, but unless the teachers actually start marking DS's work themselves (rather than getting the children to mark and grade each other's work), then I can't see how they will have anything useful to go, except the year 8 exam results.

Obviously children are different but I can't see why any child should be nervous of SATS, let alone terrified. What caused the terror var123? Were the teachers at school handling it badly? It seems terribly wrong - no child should fret about SATS.

And usually in schools there will be a whole lot of data being collected all the time. I very much doubt that the exam grade will be a make or break thing. Lots of schools get the DC to mark each other's work but the teachers won't just be sitting back - there's apparently some purpose to the DC doing mutual marking; I'm sure a teacher could explain.

To me, the Y8 exams matter mainly as a learning experience of preparing for and sitting exams.

This has also been my experience. Each time my children deal with exams, they are slightly more confident and better equipped than the time before. The eldest sat his first GCSE paper this year, and dealt with revision and exam calmly and competently, because of the practice he had put in each summer since Y7. Perhaps some children are able to do this naturally without practice. If so, then lucky them!

I don't disagree that familiarisation in the earlier years is good, I simply query whether parental annexation might do more harm than good. My DC were well prepared by their school for GCSE and none seem flustered at all - but then compared to subsequent exams, GCSEs are a doddle, so I'm not sure one can judge outlook solely by them.

Y6 was a funny one. Ds1 had a teacher who worked part time doing 1 day a week in year 5 and year 6. Ds1 didn't get along well with her.
In y5 she taught writing and scolded ds until he cried in class.
In year 6 she adminstered sats tests and ds1 kept getting notes on his saying "Failed" or "Not good enough" or "You MUST work quicker".
I left him to it at first until about halfway through the year when I began to see the things she was writing for myself as the class were being told to take their test papers home.
I even went through a couple of the maths ones, using the official marking scheme and found that Ds had passed the exams - level 6 maths, not failed at all.
As to the writing speed, I hired a tutor to help and she guessed dysgraphia within minutes. This was formally diagnosed later.
I had a meeting with the teacher concerned and the class teacher. I also told the HT that I was considering a formal complaint.
After that things improved slightly but Ds1 was very anxious about the sats. I think he just wanted good results so that he could feel better about himself.

I think that those early exams should be used reinforce to the DCs the importance of keeping reasonable organised notes during the year and knowing what topics they have covered so that they don't have to waste their time re inventing the wheel for their revision period.

I suppose if the parents step in to help too much for this it might be counterproductive for the next year?
Like Molio's my DCs have had reasonably frequent small tests during the rest of the year including for language vocabulary and maths. That helped them not only as mini revision but also to gauge the effort and time they needed to get good marks.
I think parental involvement for helping their DCs in revision is inversely proportional to trust in their DC eventually becoming self-motivated but also trust in the school that a DC won't be allowed to drift through those early years without developing a sense of what is needed to do their best in public exams.

That teacher sounds more than rubbish var123 - I'd have been furious.

And way back, what I meant was that I wouldn't want to start anything I felt I couldn't sustain - not the opposite (over indulged in negatives!).

Yes, I was quite angry with her. Also I was upset with myself that DS had been telling me for a while but I had stayed out of it as I didn't want to be over protective.

When I woke up to what was happening, the Ht got the brunt of it of my dissatisfaction with the situation. I suspect, two years later, the HT still remembers the phone call!

The teacher was about to retire, so i think she just did what she felt like. It was sad that she didn't like Ds though.

After the teacher and I met, she left DS1 alone and all was quiet for a while. Then she switched her attention to me. She went out of her way to create situations and be aggressive with me a couple of times. I was mad about that too, and she came very close to having a big problem on her hands for the last couple of months of her career. Stupid woman!

The thing is it really shook Ds's self-worth, which is the reason why doing well in exams matters so much to him, I think.

Yes, summerends, that's what I was reckoning was the main worth of it all. At this point, DD already reckons she hasn't done enough, but she often feels that way without doing anything about it: I think she needs a bit of a nudge. I've found a few things she can try to help herself, though I don't think it's worth getting her going on them just now - things like gojimo and duolingo I will download on her phone if she ever lets me, but I expect her to start using them towards the end of the summer hols, so that she doesn't waste too much time when she starts back. I just want to start the "empowering" aspect of gentle revision now, to avoid the meltdowns that I'm sure are coming later and feel that sending her into a panic now will tend to make them even worse.

Yes, var123, I would have been livid with that teacher too. I still feel bad that we went through the 11+ with DD, with the work applying to several school entrance exams and the only exam she didn't do brilliantly in was the very first: for the local grammar. I know it shook her confidence and, no matter how much I point out she won a partial scholarship to a private school (unfortunately it wasn't enough to help us afford it) and got a place in a school we weren't in the catchment for, I have the impression she still feels the work didn't pay off for her. We have to rebuild. It is so easy for some kids to get knocked back. Others would brush off the same experiences though, which tells me that it isn't all down to us. We can only do the best we can. I'm sure your DS was proud you went in there, even if it was late in the day.

Everhopeful I agree, I think it can be helpful to reinforce the message to the DCs after the exams that they now know what to build on and change in their approach from the beginning of the next school year.

The feeling of 'self worth' should come from a mixture of things obviously not just exams, but in any case IMO the process of education is an ongoing long term process and that entails DCs working out what is the most effective strategy for them to perform best in exams. The tools of how they do that should ideally be provided by the school or experienced older siblings or pupils, however in some cases the parents provide a shortcut.

"Learn from experienced older siblings or pupils".... I wish! If there is one thing DS2 will not do, its take advice from DS1!

Usually, Ds2 just wants to find out what Ds1 achieved and beat it, which is a pain with these objective measures. But that's another story.

var I'm guessing he won't take formal advice (I can't imagine most DCs doing that) but he might be picking up the odd bit of useful information by observation and discussions if he's competitive with him . I suspect Molio's DCs have all been a help to each other perhaps by help in schoolwork but also by observation and useful information in navigating the system.

Yes that's very true summerends, they have all helped each other either directly or indirectly. Obviously it's been easier with all of them born close together and going to the same school - same teachers, same test regime. University stuff has been much easier too, I'm very conscious of that.

Molio my experience of large families is that the older DCs have a very significant practical and influential role with their younger siblings. Obviously the positive benefits for learning by example depends on the eldest two or three being effective and sorted themselves (which I think is the case for your older DCs?).
That source of guidance can be partially replicated by contact with helpful older pupils (one of the advantages of mixed-age school houses including boarding houses).