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Secondary education

Connect with other parents whose children are starting secondary school on this forum.

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Original poster

What should send me running (secondary school visit)?

31 replies

redskybynight · 02/10/2014 11:51

OK, so slightly tongue in cheek, but we will be visiting DS's prospective secondary school soon. Based on where we live and the primary school he goes to, it's the only school within striking distance that we are likely to get into (and the schools not within striking distance that we would get into are all significantly worse - on paper anyway).

Our "choice" is therefore

he goes there OR
we hate the school so much that we have to think of a plan B (not clear what that might be).

So, I'm not after constructive questions to ask and positive things to spot. I'm after things that would be a complete "no" in a school that we should worry about. Also I guess things that might be a "hmm" that we could live with but might want to keep an eye on/mitigate elsewhere.

OP posts:

mychildrenarebarmy · 02/10/2014 13:19

The one that we absolutely hated didn't have bathrooms for the students to use, they had toilet cubicles that were between classrooms. If we hadn't already seen enough to put us off the layout of those, plus the smell, would have done it. It screamed no privacy and no trust to me.

NotTheKitchenAgainPlease · 02/10/2014 13:27

Visit again at home time. See how the kids look and behave on the way out.

KittiesInsane · 02/10/2014 13:50

Run away from any school that claims to have no bullying.

It means they do, but ignore it when it happens.

Ericaequites · 02/10/2014 13:58

Filthy loos would send me running. Grammatical or spelling errors of displayed papers would be another no for me. A lack of streaming or setting would be another untenable situation.

ElephantsNeverForgive · 02/10/2014 14:01

I hasn't at all taken with the HT who looked utterly disinterested in the whole welcoming and showing parents business.

ElephantsNeverForgive · 02/10/2014 14:04

Parents around business.

He really didn't seem to care if we came or not.

Seemed an odd attitude when birth rate was falling and he needed pupils that year and younger siblings even more.

MosquitoFood · 02/10/2014 14:10

All the secondary schools I saw with my dd all had the kids showing the school to the prospectives. I would ask these kids what they didn't like about the school. I think you get a lot from how the kids react to difficult questions. My favourite school was one where, when I asked that question, one of the two kids showing us around really went for it whilst the other one just cradled his head in his hands. I thought that the teachers must have known what a git this kid was but yet still felt comfortable to put him out there to meet parents. It gave me the impression that they really valued the kids and encouraged them to be who they were. DD's first choice was the flashy-er, all mod cons academy closer to home but that school/kid really impressed me.

MillyMollyMama · 02/10/2014 16:41

I would actually ask what the children thought could be improved about the school, rather than actual dislikes. Most children showing you around will be pretty positive about the school, but might be sparky enough to think of improvements. Ask them about the quality of teachers. Pupils really know if there are lots of good ones. A short list would put me off. After all, you need high quality teaching and learning above everything else, so trying to get information on this is vital. Ask what the best lessons are like. What is exciting about the school? Shoddy work in the classrooms, staff not being welcoming and no pride in achievements would be a turn off too. If the Head gets teaching and learning right, though, you will be ok!

HumblePieMonster · 02/10/2014 16:51

Indicator of a good secondary school: Are the office staff polite, friendly and helpful?

If not, its not a good school. The better the school, the lovelier the office staff.

Someone told me that decades ago. I applied it. I checked out the office staff at schools for my daughter and schools where I worked.

'Nasty office staff, nasty school' works.

Daughter's school had the nicest office staff of all. They liked all the 'daughters' and were nice to the parents.

Ishouldbeweaving · 02/10/2014 17:00

As someone already said, I'd avoid a school where the head says that they have no bullying because to me that means that they just don't want to see it. Like you we had a choice between school X or no-no-no, we looked for litter and graffiti but never considered the toilets. We probably should have done seeing as the head apologised for them in his talk. Providing they were above the standard of a bucket in the car park we'd still have sent him there because of the lack of other options. As it's turned out the school was a good fit for DS and we couldn't have chosen better even if we'd had some others to choose from.

I found the primary school gate to be a very reliable source of information, many of my son's classmates had older siblings already at the school in question.

Bunbaker · 02/10/2014 17:06

It is DD's year 6 transition open evening tonight. She is helping out in one of the departments.

I know for a fact that her school knows that bullying happens, but they also say that they will not tolerate it and will deal with it, but they do need to be told about it.

PastorOfMuppets · 02/10/2014 17:16

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

shebird · 02/10/2014 18:25

Ive recently visited a couple of schools. I was initially impressed by one school with a shiny modern building until the girls showing us around let their guard down a bit. One of them openly slagged off a teacher in front of us saying his lessons were boring.

TalkinPeace · 02/10/2014 19:55

enjoy the open evening but the acid test is sitting quietly in your car outside the gates at kicking out time

the tidal wave will always be a tad intimidating (esp in a big school)
but is it happy?
is the vibe good?

TalkinPeace · 02/10/2014 19:56

Humblepie
I just mentioned your 'Office staff' rule to DH - who visits over 100 schools a year - he agrees

shebird · 02/10/2014 19:57

What I witnessed spoke volumes, if this was the schools finest what on earth were the rest of the pupils like. Don't be fooled by amazing buildings and facilities, try to spend time talking to pupils. Are they polite, articulate, friendly, well mannered? Are they happy and enjoying life school?

crazymum53 · 02/10/2014 20:25

I would be wary of a school that didn't let you meet any actual pupils.
At one very highly regarded local school, we were shown round by teachers and there was no opportunity to meet any pupils. That really put us off!
Trouble was this school looked really great and a good fit for dd (on paper), but had the feeling that they were so smugly oversubscribed that they wanted fewer people to apply.
"the schools not within striking distance that we would get into are all significantly worse - on paper anyway" It really depends what you mean by worse, if it's results and OFSTED ratings they can change. Also bear in mind that OFSTED requirements have changed significantly so the school rated Outstanding 4 years ago may not be as good as the one rated Good earlier this year!

joanofarchitrave · 02/10/2014 21:00

My bottom line is whether the school provides triple science GCSEs or not. I'm not totally against combined science GCSE or whatever it's called as a concept, but my understanding is that the jump from that to A-level is very hard, and I don't want any barriers between ds and science A-levels if he should choose to go that route.

Likewise, I cared if there has been a viable group doing Further Maths A-level in the school in recent years. 1 child in two years is not a viable group IMO. DS is good at maths and he may not want to go that far but I want a school that is not struggling to find him a peer group if he does.

I found that I also cared very much whether the head teacher seemed exactly like David Brent (he even used the word 'entertainer' )

Mandyandme · 02/10/2014 21:24

I found the open evenings were fantastic but do agree on sitting outside the school at home time and doing the visit during the school day.

I visited a lot of schools when I was looking for ds and we came to the conclusion that in all of the OFSTED outstanding schools when we returned for the school day visit all the children looked completely bored.

Also as I knew a lot of the parents from one of the schools we visited and it did leave me wondering whether it was the schools teaching that was getting the good results or the private tutors my friends were employing.

SonorousBip · 02/10/2014 21:54

Deffo agree re office staff.

I also look out for how teachers talk to students as they move around the school and vice versa. I like it when they know names but just the general demeanour is interesting. The one I was at on Saturday, the interaction was very pleasant - teachers not patronising to the children, children polite but engaged and not remotely scared

Zippyandbungle · 02/10/2014 22:02

No work displayed at all. We visited a faith school who didn't have any work on the walls, when asked the teacher showing us around said "well, maths equations aren't very attractive haha."

HumblePieMonster · 02/10/2014 22:05

Humblepie I just mentioned your 'Office staff' rule to DH - who visits over 100 schools a year - he agrees
Deffo agree re office staff

Bless! Its MN and people agree with me!

for you!

TheFirstOfHerName · 02/10/2014 22:06

Streaming and setting are very different. Our closest secondary school puts Y7s into fixed streams across every subject (based on the results of a CAT test) and then keeps them there for the next three years, with little or no movement between streams. Many parents did not realise this when they chose the school.

negrilbaby · 02/10/2014 22:27

I would always want to see the school in action. I wouldn't be comfortable not being able to walk around the school during the school day.
I work in a school and our HT regularly has escorted tours around the school. The parents seem to find them very informative.

AtiaoftheJulii · 02/10/2014 22:31

My daughters' school had an open evening last night and then tours today (normal school day). Dd2 took round a group of three families and they'd all been there the evening before too, which I thought was interesting.

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