Is this Normal Secondary Homework Behaviour - Or Should I be Worried?

[GirlInASwirl]

The information from school is that my son (Y7) should be doing around an hour of homework a night. The tasks certainly seem consistent with this.

Since he started high school (3 weeks ago) we have had homework every night from 3.45 to sometimes 7.30-8 pm. This makes tea late and I am worried that my son is not getting enough relaxation/leisure time mid-week. I am very frustrated and know that the homework support/routine has to change (for everyone's sanity).

My son did very well in his primary SATS with some level 5s. But that was due to intensive,systematic work every night at home - where he has done everything with guidance. My son is bright - but he also processes information slowly, finds following instructions difficult and has sudden drops in concentration/daydreams. He responds slowly and often with answers that seem unrelated to the question. School have also noticed this quirkiness - but there were differing responses to whether he had extra support/SEN needs. He did however get extra support for his coordination and writing skills (reluctance for the latter).

I am trying to gradually withdraw so that my son takes more onus for his work. His concentration wonders/he struggles with low motivation and does need some monitoring to keep him on task - or else nothing would be completed.

I am unsure how much of his behaviour is conscious non-cooperation and how much is down to any difficulties. This makes dealing with the situation subtle and I admit that sometimes I feel at a loss.

Example Problems during homework:

Only superficial understanding of the task to be done/the purpose of it
Often does not know when work is due in
Daydreaming/low work output when left on own
Fiddling with things/random off-task behaviour if left alone
Doing tasks he wants rather than what has been set
Responding to every distraction - cats, traffic outside etc

At this stage; I am unsure whether this is 'normal' behaviour, symptomatic of extra support needs or just a transition thing that will pass.

Would welcome opinions and ideas on how to motivate children to do homework. If it was your child; would you contact the school and let them know?

That's too much for him. 20 minute bursts would be better. My daughter is the same with processing bit has improved massively and is coping fine in year 11. Having more visual stuff has helped her.

I would contact the school OP, if the guideline is 1 hour that's far too long.
it isn't unusual for children to struggle with organising homework at the start of Y7. But if the problem is that teachers are not giving clear instructions the school does need to know.

Find out how long they expect him to spend on each piece. Then time him, and stop him after the time has finished. I would stick in post it notes, or you could write in the planner (teachers sometimes suggested writing into the book itself). The best thing is to let him work at his standard, and then request he gets help if teachers complain (although detention can often be used to help re-explain expectations). If he just works slowly (no messing) then the school needs to understand - so I'd probably talk to HOY or form tutor.
Does he have a school planner? Can he write his homework in in properly? With completion date? If he struggles with that I'd mention it to the school.

Do you have a parents evening coming up?

Sometimes its better to get the school to tell your child to do something, as they will listen more to teachers. Also a peaceful home life is very important for learning.

Having DDs who except for revision and hateful history projects, seem to do just fine on about 3-5hrs HW a week, until Y10, I'd seriously ask what's going on.

An hour a night would be reasonable if appreciable effort was put into MFLs and all subjects consistently set HW. But what your DS is doing is way OTT.

(At the DDs school not all subjects and teachers do set HW. DD1 is dyslexic and MFL were a non starter. DD2 is good at one and simply gets detention for the other. There is no cure for this except giving it up at the end of the year.)

I think there's 2 issues here:

Not having understanding of what the homework is / not knowing the deadline

and

Daydreaming / distraction

The first can be improved by him in terms of using homework diary properly, and asking the teacher at the end of the class if the task set is not clear. If he is not doing this then maybe ask the school to put him on report ie to show his homework diary to his tutor every day to show he is using it properly.

The second could be improved by you in terms of providing a suitable distraction free environment. If he can't be left in his own bedroom to do homeowrk can you set him up on the kitchen / dining table, no other items within reach except books required, so you can hover and check he is actually working for the duration (I think he may be taking so long because of the distractions IYSWIM)

I don't think 1 hr a night is excessive. Neither do I personally subscribe to the "down tools after X minutes" approach - the time for each task is just a guideline IMO and some may take more than others, and undone work may come back and bite later if the notes are needed for tests for example. But as i said I think you need to make sure actual work is being done and if that means you need to be in hover mode more than you's like then so be it - hopefully as he matures and gets into the senior school mode of working you will then be able to withdraw.

Liking the idea of 20 min. bursts - Lizzy - did similar when he did his SATs revision and had some success. Could try again.

I am not sure if its the school not giving clear instructions; or if my DS is distracted at the time that the homework is discussed - Crazy. It could just be pre-occupation as he is packing his stuff away and thinking about getting to his next class. We have discussed what happens at the end of class and how important it is to write down the homework task and the due date. He often hasn't written it down fully in his planner; but can elaborate a little. Due dates are a real problem though - so we just assume next session.

Mummy - my partner and I have discussed a similar approach lately. We think differently on it. My partner is all for it thinking it will save work later. I feel uneasy though for two reasons I think. 1.) The school is in the process of arranging ability bands and I would prefer DS to get into a higher band where they will have greater expectations and (hopefully) motivated class mates. And 2.) I am finding it hard to back off fully and let him 'fail' - even though I can see that progress must always start from a base point.

There is a peaceful home here and he has a study where he can sit and work quietly.

But is the study entirely distraction free? I think you need to almost do a home experiment to see how much of the time spent each evening is wasted time - so if you take him away from all potential distraction and keep him in view more or less, and he STILL takes hours every night you know there may be a more fundamental issue to discuss with the teachers

I think you need to supervise quite closely tbh to see what's actually going on with him. I agree with the general principle that parents should back off during the secondary years, but gradually, and only once they've settled in, know what's expected of them and good habits have been instilled. Backing off now is setting him up to fail from day one.

So homework in kitchen with you hovering, he has to tell you what the task is (worth emailing school to see if tasks are put on the website - ours do this), what he needs to do to achieve it, then give him small targets -e.g. write down five facts about earthquakes in 20 minutes. Then he shows you, then he tells you what the next bit of the task is and you set him another 20 mins to do it etc etc.

Until you do that I don't think you can really be sure whether his issues are mere procrastination, or the fact that he genuinely can't process the information.

ds has just started year 7. He gets between 1-3 pieces per night, each one should take 20-30 minutes.
he is at grammar school so the expectation is high, but the homework seems to be very balanced - finishing off something from class, or learning words in french and so on.

He is hopeless when he has to research in the computer, as that takes him hours, but apart from that he really is spending the time the school says.

So I would say you need to work out if the tasks given are too much, or if it is that he is struggling to do them.

Not having it written down is a big issue, that I would tackle early on.

My ds is very motivated and has gone off to do homework without being asked (!) but I still need to help him structure, work out his time (you need to finish that now and move on to next task) and keep a check on getting it all done. It is a massive change from primary and they need help with the adjustment.
I would break it down into subjects, get him to explain the task to you, sit him down with a timer (15 minutes) then check on him, how much has been done etc, give him a second 15 minutes, then put a post it note into the planner.
Get him to go and run around for 10 minutes, then task 2. It will take a lot of support from you, but if that is what he needs, better to teach him how to structure his time, and withdraw than let him drop.

I would also have a word with form tutor, especially about not getting task written down. Do you have an email for him/her?

I'm on my phone so not as wordy. 20 minutes at a time can mean the difference between good, motivated work or poorly thought out "I'm just going to get stuff on paper to get it out of the way" work. As he matures, his concentration span will improve. In the meantime, speak to his form tutor or year manager and ask for strategies with regard to him writing his homework down properly and maybe some lesson notes if they're available.

Far far too much time spent on homework. Not fair on the child in any way, shape or form. Asking for trouble further down the line by overworking him.

Overall balance of life and mental and emotional health will be very compromised by overdoing it on schoolwork at such an early stage. It just isn't neccesary.

intensive systematic work at home every day for SATs? why?

I don't let my kids spend more than between 30 mins and 1 hour max on homework (oldest is only in Y7).

We also distinguish between real work and day dreaming. We all do our homework at the kitchen table before dinner, after dinner it is time to relax.

I feel your DS is spending a lot of his time doing homework inefficiently, could you help him with that? or the school?

Yes I am open to the idea of that - Home. There is a lot of wasted time at the moment. The study is minimally decked out with ref. books, a desk, chair writing/art equip etc.

I usually start a session with him and briefly make sure he knows what he is doing and peak his interest. Then I let him get on with it and visit him every 15 mins or so.

Sometimes I go in - his head is down on the desk and little/no work has been done. He fiddles with pens - click click click click! distributes his art equip on the floor, guesses at answers/rather than researches, writes sentences that don't make sense (bear in mind he got level 5 for Literacy), makes careless mistakes and doesn't correct.....

Take last night...

Last Task Of Session - Write a Haunted House Story with three characters (he says 1.5 pages long max, his friend has already completed 3 pages)

Complete homework diary together - only partial account
Look at planning for story in English rough book - extremely minimal and unfocussed
Improve planning together - verbal and written notes (approx 15 mins)
Talk about how to structure the story into paragraphs
Seems enthused - leave him to it 'Come and see how you are doing in a bit'

20 min later - written a paragraph only - the most boring writing you can imagine! Not really on haunted house.

Reiterate task - set him off again.

15 mins - written two pages - only a paragraph can actually be used. The rest is diary accounts (similar to Diary of A Whimpy Kid). Not bad writing - but off task. Pull the best bits out but say that he has to start again. Not happy! Unsure if he is being deliberately subversive and avoiding task.

It is now 7pm - tea is late. I give him 20 mins to complete a Haunted House only piece of work and say that he needs to make a plan for full writing tomorrow. Piece comes back on task but still have a long way to go tomorrow.

It's like this all the time for each piece of work

Blimey. Your son has no appetite for work. Give him a break. Seriously consider the issues involved of creating resistance to work at such an early stage.

I get why you want him to be in higher sets - really - but you have to step back and let him do the homework on his own. He's written a couple of pages, but you decide only one paragraph is good enough? And why couldn't a haunted house story be in diary form?

It sounds like he's letting you take over - 'mum'll do it for me'. Yes, keep half an eye open to check he's actually working. But otherwise you need to let him do it himself. After all, you can't control the work he does in the classroom. And if he's not managing at all, it may well be that he'll be better off in slightly lower sets - it's not some kind of a punishment not to be in the top sets.

You need him to hand in the two pages that he had written in the reasonable amount of time. He will get feedback from the teacher as to whether it is acceptable and you will get tea on time.

I think your role is to make sure he works, not comment on the quality of the work. Time will come when you probably won't know how to help with the subject matter anyway (GCSE level). Micromanaging is not the way ahead, helping him to be organised and focused on the task is within the parental remit IMO. Take him out if the study into your full view and see how he approaches his work

He had got carried away with the diary format jee and 'forgotten' to develop his haunted house story. There was only a few sentences mentioning 'a house' that he was intrigued to visit.

I am aware that sometimes he tries to get me involved by playing the 'I don't know' card - when I know he does. We have talked about the fact that he is not helpless and can think on his own. I do let him reason things out more than I used to do.

I am having to adjust to high school too. I am primary qualified and supported him up from under-achieving at level 3s to level 5+ for SATs. I am starting to shift the responsibility.

He is capable of high grades with support.

He has just had his CAT tests without any preparation - so I am waiting to see what they say about his general abilities.

I think I stepped back from content a couple of year sago op. It was actually the key to stop homework battles. So, since year 4/5 I have seen it as my job to make sure he sits down and does it, but the content is up to school. We talked about it and I said that is what I would do, and then the content was between him and his teacher.
He actually jumped at the change and the homework battles changed completely.

I know your ds has a few additional needs, but I would say that maybe the time has come for you to step back.
I would tell him also that after a certain time, you will put a note saying he has spent 30 minutes on it and send it back like that. That may motivate him to make the 30 minutes worth while.
The other end of that may be that he does get a detention to re-do homework, and that might give him the push he needs.

If that approach isn't going to work, then you need to sit down with school and make a plan of action

I think if you keep at him - he will just "pretend" to study. Then in a few years he could totally flare up and rebel.

I have experience of how demotivating it is for students to be in too high a set, where they struggle to get the work done, can barely keep up in class and receive no help for any extra needs they may have.

Extrinsic motivation - which is all you are giving him, ultimately doesn't work. Intrinsic motivation which you and school should be trying to build is far more useful and long lasting. He's only just at the beginning of year 7 and you are not letting him learn by his mistakes.

If he struggles to get the homework down, it is worthwhile flagging this to the school who can help. If it is relatively minor then maybe you need to get him to play the "phone a friend card".

However especially at in years 7-9 students need outside interests. The most successful people I know all did a variety of things outside school, and that tends to be where "soft" skills are learnt and developed. It is also something that all universities and employers look for (even if Oxbridge are only really interested in those which relate to their subject).

Why didn't you let him hand in he'd done on the haunted house? As I said earlier you need to facilitate his homework, supervise him doing it, make sure he understands, check regularly, let him explain what he thinks he needs to do next.

Not mark the damn homework and judge whether it's up to standard - that's up to the teacher!

And is he'd handed in something way off target better the teacher knows that he struggled with it.

I get why you want him in the top sets, but in all honesty if he's having to do 3 or 4 hours a night, with you only letting him hand something in once you've determined it's what is required, he shouldn't be in the top sets.

Thanks for your comments/opinions so far. I have sent an e-mail to DSs form tutor with my concerns and asked for support with both the homework and (maybe) further investigation into DSs concentration/processing problems. Awaiting response.

I think helping a DC understand the task, plus helping with structuring etc can be fine. Sometimes the DC needs 1-1 to help them understand.

However you need to lower your expectations to ensure he can produce stuff in a reasonable time. And also, if you are not doing already, you need to include notes on the homework as to the level of support you have given him.

(DD1 needed support throughout y7-9, and now y11 still requires some with certain tasks. The aim is she will be able to do them by May!)

Seriously, you demotivate and demoralise him like this every day!!!

Where is the positive affirmation?

I think you either need to step away a little or alternatively do it all for him to your standard. I think his teachers might notice though. [roll]

step away from the homework

You're his mum, not the homework monitor!

Have fun together, relax, take the pressure off, prioritise the love.