Are sixth form careers guidance and work experience opportunities much better in private schools?

[dithering14]

DD1 is weighing up the pros and cons of changing from a state school to a selective private school for sixth form. She is an academic all rounder who does not know what she wants to do and has no particular leaning towards professions such as medicine or law. She would therefore really benefit at some stage from better careers information and wider choices of work experience than her present school or we could offer.
We'd love to know from your experiences whether you think there is a tangible difference to what is offered in the better know private schools? Does it matter anyway if students can avail themselves of career advice and networking at university?

Halkult what professions are the ones that 3-4 top boys independents give you an "in" too?

Hakluyt as I said above I agree that it is not enough of a reason to pay for private but in her case it might tip the balance which is why we are interested.
Actually ultimately education is about creating future interests and opportunities so I don't think it is an odd reason to put into the mix when choosing.

You may have DCs who know exactly where they are heading or like certain academic subjects so much that they already have a rough idea, or whose academic strengths narrow the choices, in which case it may be irrelevant to them.

However, not withstanding CareerDragon's very helpful advice from what I can gather
Basically lots of career talks could at the least help an uncertain DC gain some perspective on what's out there, saving time searching and possibly sparking a real interest or opportunity.
As Milly says some private schools make very good use of their 'old boys' (still not sure about old girls) not just parents, for talks but also for work experience placements in holidays. That could stretch beyond school.
Unfair life advantage perhaps but still there.

Of course as I said before, that may all be irrelevant if there are suitable opportunities at university (if she wants to go).

happygardening I assume Hakluyt is talking about politics or the city. Actually cynically I think a DC who is thinking about politics would be better off remaining in the state system to play the 'real life' card.

My dds school is a day school but they run seminars in different areas, eg media, engineering, medicine inviting old girls to come and speak. They also have an old girls' magazine which is full of interviews with old girls describing their careers, one was on different careers starting with geography degrees, they've just done one on working in theatre (acting, writing, costume design etc). They also have speakers every week for those doing a levels. In yr 10 they do the Morrisby (sp?) aptitude tests & then spend an afternoon visiting a relevant organization, lawyers, architectural practice etc.

Wycombe Abbey, girls boarding school in High Wycombe may offer this, I don't know but if she is just starting year 11 I suggest you look at their website & speak to them about open days as they will be interviewing etc this term for year 12 entry next September. The women (in their 20s) I know who went there are doing interesting things.

Happygqrdening- politics, the City, comedy.............

"Actually cynically I think a DC who is thinking about politics would be better off remaining in the state system to play the 'real life' card."

Hmmm- can't immediately think of anyone that's worked for!

Hakluyt I am optimistic enough to think the tide will turn again for politics if there are enough young people from the state system who have a developed a sense of service ( and can cope with the agro).

Eastpoint your DD's school is offering the sort of thing we were wondering about/hoping for. How can all that not be a big plus in the education of a teenager like my DD. It can also be really interesting to hear / read about the life paths of people and how they got into their careers.
Wycombe Abbey have already done the first part of their entrance procedure. One of their criteria must be forward planning teenagers .

She should be sorting out her own work experience!

Very naïve comment.You generally need contacts to arrange any sort of meaningful work experience which a16 or 17 year old does not generally have.

"
Very naïve comment.You generally need contacts to arrange any sort of meaningful work experience which a16 or 17 year old does not generally have."

I suppose it depends what you man by "meaningful". Thinking about my dc's friends who arranged their own work experience, they worked in a charity shop, a vets, a solicitor's office, out local MP's office, several primary schools, a special school, a fashion wholesaler (that was my dd- and wow, it opened her eyes!) with a midwife and with an art gallery. Loads of lessons learned....not necessarily the obvious ones.

I think very few schools, even the most high profile ones, give pupils an 'in' just by being there .

DH for example, wouldn't offer some random kid work experience just because he had attended w.

That said , what seems to go on is that those who know know one another sometimes help out.

Of course this happens in all walks of life but if you attend private school the pool will be high status. Or leaning that way.

Also private schools are often quite tight knit communities in their own right. Dd school is small. I know every girl in her year and their parents. Old girls come back all the time. So the links there are solid.

It does seem to me that part of the value of work experience is the process of finding it. Surely better a week washing dishes in a cafe you have found for yourself than shadowing a high court judge because he's your uncle? Or working in the local vet's because she's your mother?

My late FIL had a printing business, and got into trouble with the local schools because he insisted on paying work experience kids. He said that a) anyone who worked for him got a decent wage for the job and b) what was the use of work experience if it didn't include one of the most important reasons for working. He ended up not being allowed to offer work experience......!

I think it very much depends what you want out of it

There is a world of difference between WE that teaches you important life lessons, WE that introduces you to an industry that might interest you and WE that may be beneficial to your future career prospects.

It completely depends what a young person is looking to gain from it,

I agree WordFactory. A part-time job (easier for DD1 if she remains where she is) or any WE (I like the abbreviation) would provide the first.

We are more interested in better access to the information about the second two.

I think year 10 WE should mainly be about a student showing commitment, getting on with people, etc.

Year 12 should be appropriate to career - last summer all the law firms and solicitors on the list were being uncommunicative or saying they didn't offer WE placements any more - school agreed that if nothing turned up there would be no point dd going somewhere irrelevant, and were going to let her study in school - thankfully somewhere did get found in the end, but whilst at year 10 I would have said she should probably go where she was sent and suck it up, in year 12 I'd have been annoyed if she had to go and work in an ice cream parlour or something!

OP I have two DSs one in a well regarded FE college, one in a well know independent all boys boarding, who thankfully has no desire to be a politician, go into the city or become a comedian.
IME the careers advise in the FE college is ok, universities visit, tutors help if kids ask but not much more, if you don't know what you want to do I'm not sure how much help you get. A couple I've talked who are aiming high Bristol etc but I'm unconvinced they've received good advise from the college about A levels, they're doing textiles and other equivalents. This also applies to his old "high achieving outstanding academy". The high fliers on the other hand those who are good candidates for Oxbridge etc get an enormous amount of input.
At the independent, universities visit, from the UK and US, boys attend talks from yr 11, all yr 11 boys are offered one of those career profiling things (which we pay for), universities options are regularly discussed from very early on by HM's tutors, dons and of course the boys and parents, quite a few had already Oxbridge colleges informally even before starting at the school in yr 9. Fairly obviously A level subjects like textiles don't exist!
Many in both don't seem to know what they want to do at Uni certainly, but I get the impression that many at the independent are planning on following their parent (usually father) into the city and it's the simple undertaking of a degree /university attended not the subject studied that is all part of that stepping stone. Many at the FE college talk about being teachers.
Now I've got two children in the 6th form I can see that many are simply not ready to specialise and are being made to choose a limited number of subjects too early, that the IB probably is a better bet for some and also not even ready to specialise at Uni either, and perhaps this is reflected in the increasing number at my DS's independent school who go off to the Ivies.

I Agree with that nit though neither of my DCs schools do year 10 WE.

I am happy though that part time work can offer that experience. Probably more so, since even a Saturday job will have proper responsibilities and problems to deal with.

I think the problem even at year 12 is that it's just not appropriate to have them around in many work places. Law firms are particularly tricky because of client confidentiality etc.

We used to have them at my old firm and it wasn't ideal. The young person couldn't come to court or sit on on interviews. Or even see the documentation.

DH firm now only does proper paid WE for those during or post degree. It is hard to secure a place and well paid. It serves as a first filter for those looking for a TC.

DD went to the magistrates court a few times: she loved it! But yes, she did say that by the last day they were clearly struggling for jobs to give her.

Meant to add DS1 (state educated) did work experience in yr 10, the school held a list of a few employers who'd consider it but unless you DC wanted farm work or shop basically parents were very much expected to sort it out themselves. This was partly due to our location because anything much outside of these area would require parents to drive them to a bigger town/city. My DS got work experience with a huge multinational, I did the initial leg work and then he applied and was interviewed, we then drove the daily 100 mile round trip twice a day.
At DS2's school WE hasn't been mentioned yet.

Our was 'organised' by NYBEP. Who are shit.

DS1's work experience at the multinational was incredible they run it three weeks of the year and take about 10 children each time. They had a very organised programme, different activities morning and afternoon it's a very famous R and D defence company. Definitely worth the effort on our part.
My only gripe; they had far too much fun not like work at all!

Happygardening that's an interesting perspective and in line with what I've heard.
As an aside the IB was the catalyst for considering changing but she seems to have been put off it now as being to prescriptive in how the time is organised and less flexible in subject choice, for example you can't do 2 MFLs and 2 sciences. I'm not sure how true the former reason is.
Possibly more universities will follow UCL with degrees which allow more subject mixing as in the States (definitely too far and expensive for us at undergraduate level)

Scottish universities I'm told and I know Edinborough does because my DS has researched it offers a broader degree. For the first two years you can choose 1-2 modules unrelated too your chosen subject. But this does mean the degree takes four years to complete instead of three but I personally think it's a good thing so I don't see the extra year as a problem. Obviously you've got to be in a situation to be able help financially at the very least with the living cost for longer.

dithering if my DS was going into yr 11 and not yr 12 and I know what I know now about the subjects that interest him we would have seriously considered the IB. By the time I realised it might have suited him it was too late. I'd heard lots of things about it like you much of it negative but I definitely think if your DD is interested she should go and look at schools who are actually successfully running it and talk to the pupils and staff. I recently talked to a boy that did it and although he like many think it's considerably harder or shall we say more work than than A levels he loved it.
Hey oh we can all be clever in retrospect!

Happygardening despite a recent reattempt at gentle persuasion on my part for considering IB (I think it would suit her perfectly including the CAS) she continues to be stubbornly against it and time is running out. Teenagers know best . Interesting about Edinburgh, probably one of the reasons it is so competitive to get into.

Again only IME teenagers have an infuriating habit of doing abrupt U turns. My DS spent 2 1/2 academic years absolutely convinced he was going to do one particular Pre U. He started to wobble in March and looked at similar subjects and then in June did the abrupt U turn and selected a subject that he'd previously rejected despite my occasional suggestions that he might enjoy it and grumbled slightly he couldn't keep up the other as well.
If like my DS she's a very able all rounder do try and persuade her to look at the IB.