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Secondary education

Connect with other parents whose children are starting secondary school on this forum.

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Original poster

GCSE Triple Science...is this really how it is now??

85 replies

bethnella · 26/04/2014 10:10

I had a progress meeting with dd's tutor yesterday, who happens to be head of science. He has explained that next year, Y9, they will start GCSE triple science by spending 1 year doing biology only and sitting the exam! Then in Y10 do Physics for a year, followed by an exam and then Chemistry in Y11!! Is this normal?? I find it hard to understand why? Surely A level biology will be far more difficult if you haven't studied it since Y9!!! Any input would be great! Should I post this in the staff room???

OP posts:

Original poster

bethnella · 27/04/2014 14:44

But not to the detriment of science if that is where his strength lies! I just feel that the choice is gone! Our kids have to fit in with what the school deem best, which is fine if you feel it is in the child's best interest but I sometimes feel it is in their own!

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HercShipwright · 27/04/2014 14:47

bethnella TBH I feel that DS getting a C in English is in everyone's best interest. His own just as much as the school's. If the school were making a fuss about French or PE or something, I'd be angry. Because ultimately, he doesn't need them. But he needs a pass at English to do anything, really (and he is a very very bright boy, his issue is with writing and, to a lesser extent reading, not with his innate ability. Dyslexia is a real bugger).

Original poster

bethnella · 27/04/2014 14:50

My god-daughter is highly dyslexic and her school has advised her to drop a MFL to focus on English...would that not be a better option??

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HercShipwright · 27/04/2014 14:58

He is doing French GCSE this year. His whole year is. That's how the school does it. No MFL for him after that (he is doing English, Maths, RE, PE (0.5), triple science, comp sci, history and music going forward. We did have concerns about the history but apparently he is excellent at that (I suspect his difficulties with English are psychological as well as dyslexic related. He isn't 'blocked' for history. And he has an outstanding bank of knowledge on history stuff, which boosts his confidence)). We may consider getting him off Eng Lit if the need arises. It would be a shame but you've got to be realistic. The sad thing is, he's one of the best 'read' kids in his year, if you count going to the theatre and audio books. He is familiar with a vast array of shakespeare, for example. :(

hellsbells99 · 27/04/2014 15:03

My DCs school treat triple science as though they were taking 3 separate subjects - which is what they are! So biology is timetabled in the same way that geography is, physics like history is etc.

Original poster

bethnella · 27/04/2014 15:03

I wish you the both the best...one size does definitely not fit all! I'm going to be a bit sad when dd chooses geography over history...it was always my favourite subject:)

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Original poster

bethnella · 27/04/2014 15:06

hellsbells - I am assuming they all run alongside each other and the exams will take place at the end of Y11?? How will my dd know that she is up to the challenge of sciences at A level without that??? Arrrrgggghhh

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hellsbells99 · 27/04/2014 15:21

DD1 who is now in year 12 took them modular as they were allowed to then. But her first biology paper which she took in year 10, she re-took at the end of year 11 along with module 3 and she said it was so much easier and made much more sense once she had finished the whole course - and she went from a B to an A* in that paper.
DD2 is in year 11 and taking all her exams in the 3 sciences this summer. She is practising past papers etc. and will be fine. She is planning to take all 3 sciences and maths at AS level. She took the maths GCSE in year 10 and her school were planning for her set to take AS maths in year 11 (new initiative) - I emailed in saying DD2 couldn't take the AS exams in year 11 (although I didn't mind her doing the work) as she wants to do medicine and most universities want the A levels taken over 2 years only. The maths teacher spoke to the careers department (which they should have done initially) and emailed me back agreeing with me, so instead they have followed a level 3 algebra course in year 11 which is still very good preparation for the AS level. You need to talk to the school and spell out that this could impact on your DD's A Levels and university choices.

hellsbells99 · 27/04/2014 15:23

and by the way, DD1 has found the jump from GCSE to AS level huge!

she is also taking all 3 sciences and maths at AS level

Original poster

bethnella · 27/04/2014 15:39

See - I need to find out if resits are a possibility. I have a feeling that it has all changed from next year and that resits wont count...or something??? I know that the jump from GCSE to AS is huge, and the thought that there would be a two year gap in learning is my biggest problem. Surely a school with a 6th form would want students with the best chance of passing A levels...who knows??

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TalkinPeace · 27/04/2014 15:39

OP
My DD wanted to be a vet.
She organised a week of work experience with a Vet practice (8.30 to 5.30 5 days)
she came away determined not to be a vet

dealing with idiot owners
utterly unrealistic expectations of pre degree work experience
6 years of student debt
no holidays in that 6 years due to needing to clock up the experience hours
working for a pittance for ten years until a partnership place comes up

she is now aiming for biochemistry at Ivy League
I utterly support her in that turn around

SuburbanRhonda · 27/04/2014 15:48

talkinpeace, I wasn't aware the teaching route you describe was called "fast-track science".

I was under the impression it was one of Gove's wizard wheezes, as his personal view was that studying science in modules over two years was not as challenging.

Like many on here, DS has nine science exams in a few weeks time - everything having to be remembered from the beginning of Year 10 onwards.

In other words, it is perfect for people with a good memory for facts.

Original poster

bethnella · 27/04/2014 15:50

TalkinPeace - I KNOW!!! It is ridiculous what they want from them! I am secretly hoping she will come to the same conclusions. But if she feels she is set up for a fall in Y9 where the hell does that leave us???
She is the type that has already set up power points with her 'pathway' to becoming a vet!!! She knows what she needs to do, but I can't quite bring myself to tell her about the schools plan! If I hadn't have slipped into the conversation when GCSE's actually start I wouldn't have known about this!

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TalkinPeace · 27/04/2014 15:52

suburban
Gove is moving things back to how they were when I did my GCEs
memory was as important as capacity for learning.
sadly, being the twit that Gove is, he has thrown the "module" baby out with the "rigour" bathwater
as the Economist has just criticised him for
www.economist.com/news/britain/21601247-attempts-build-snazzy-german-style-apprenticeship-system-crash-cultural-and-economic

ChristopherRobin · 27/04/2014 15:56

I'm a science teacher (although now a SAHM, but still....) and I don't know of any school that does this. I think it is total madness, and if I was asked to teach like this I would look to move to another school. There is no way a student will be able to cope with A level biology after not doing it since year 9, and biology results would be lower than chemistry I imagine. I know some schools have one teacher taking all 3 sciences, and so split the courses up bio1, chem1, phys1 for example, but not splitting whole subjects across 3 years. Personally we did it as 3 separate subjects taught by specialist teachers starting in the summer term of year 9. Not all schools are lucky enough to have so many specialist teachers to cater for this however.

creamteas · 27/04/2014 16:13

Early entry or multiple exams, the dilemma isn't an easy one to balance. It is a difficult call for schools as which ever why they go some pupils will lose out.

A school near me is doing something similar, but going the other route.

Year 9 = Core
Year 10 = Additional
Year 11 = Further

At least that way they are still studying all three sciences in year 11.

Obviously if Gove wasn't an idiot, he would have given exam boards the chance to design terminal assessed courses. Moving modular exams to the end, is the worst thing he could do.

Original poster

bethnella · 27/04/2014 16:20

Pooh's friend - you are filling me with dread!!! DD is my only one and her education is the most important thing to me! Why would they do this? Do you think it is a lack of faith in the kids or teachers?? Or both?? DD has consistently received level 7b/7a this year (Y8) and is in top set with another 24 kids...surely the school should believe that they are capable to sit all of the exams in Y11 and won't be bringing them down in league tables!!!

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SuburbanRhonda · 27/04/2014 16:50

OP, I understand your concerns, but your posts seem full of anxiety - I'm concerned you're going to pass on your stresses about this to your DD. In one of your posts you say you are sad she might give up geography because it was your favourite subject! You need to try to be calm and rational about this so that you are ready for any future meetings with the school and you don't come across in the wrong way.

Of course your DD's education is important, but I don't think it's healthy for either of you if you make it "the most important thing to [you]". It is her education, not yours and you need to get some perspective if you want to give her the kind of support she will need over the next few years.

Original poster

bethnella · 27/04/2014 17:28

Suburban - I can see how it would seem that way (though the history comment was meant tongue in cheek!). I think I am right to worry...every comment has backed up my concerns. Would you feel comfortable with your child starting an A level in a subject they hadn't participated in for two years??
I don't have very much other then love and support to offer my dd and I am very proud that at 13 she has a plan...even if that changes. We recently changed schools and this would have been a big deciding factor if I had have known this was how they were planning to do it. I am hoping I will feel differently once I have spoken to the school and discussed it.

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SuburbanRhonda · 27/04/2014 21:31

OP, you're right that posters on here have backed up your concerns - it's not that I was referring to.

It's how you manage your anxiety about this that's key. If your DD must study GCSE sciences in the way you describe and there's no way round it, you are going to have to support her without making her as anxious as you feel. No mean feat, for sure.

I'm not sure how I'd feel about my DC starting an A level in a subject they hadn't studied in two years. I know it's not the same, but DS is starting A levels in September, and three out of four of his chosen subjects he's never studied before!

bigTillyMint · 27/04/2014 21:46

DD is doing triple science. It is a three year course I think they studied all three for the first year and then the first term this year, but they have concentrated on Chemistry this term as they sit Chemistry this year (Y10) They will go back to biology and physics after the exams and sit them in Y11.

I agree, it is a lot of facts to be learned. Same as when I did Olevels

sassysally · 27/04/2014 21:56

'DD is just finishing fast track triple science
they have done (in 2 years and 6 terms)'

That isn't 'fast track', that is standard

sassysally · 27/04/2014 21:58

At my DCs school biology, physics and chemistry are taught as 3 distinct subjects from Y7 on, everyone (or nearly everyone) does GCSEs in all 3 over 2 years Y10 and 11.

Original poster

bethnella · 27/04/2014 22:01

Well of course I will be supporting dd, and try not to let any of my worries worry her. We'll just take it as it comes...it was all so different when I was at school. All of the current Y8's are going to be like guinea pigs anyway, what with numbered grades for English and maths! Madness!

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hellsbells99 · 27/04/2014 23:22

Bigtilly - not sure I would want my DC doing AS level chemistry if they hadn't studied it for a year. AS builds on gcse knowledge, is a big step up and fast paced.
The approach that Creamteas posted - core, additional and then further seems more logical and sensible.
As I previously posted DD2 is doing all 9 papers this year and it does all seem to make more sense to them when they have studied all the modules. The most illogical thing is the exam timetable hasn't changed from the modular approach of last year - so unit 1 exams are 2 weeks after unit 2 & 3!

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