Nottingham Boys High School going co-ed

[NickL]

The headmaster has, just this morning, announced that, after 502 years, the High School will be enrolling girls from September 2015.

Would you send your girls there rather than across the street to the NGHS?

I know some boys who went to nhs two years ago. I was surprised they passed the exam. However, the school is a business and if they need to have x number to make it financially sustainable, and not so many are applying, then the pass mark has to go down. However, if you have more to select from in the first place (boys+girls) then you can chose more of the best.

This is about financial stability and maintaining standards. This is implied on the website.

I thought it was pretty explicit that is about money, rather than implied. Still not convinced that there is room for the additional children. Lovell House was full before, as littleredsquirrel has explained.

I trust the Head to have got this right -hopefully he isn't going to resign or retire part way through the implementation and will see this through.

Sounds to me like the NHS junior school is very full and then at secondary level parents enter their children for nearby Grammar schools in Birmingham and the best boy leave for free but excellent state Grammar schools in Birmingham.

Economic pressures are taking their toll. Outside London and South East incomes just are not rising and house prices are flat or falling so parents cant afford ever rising fees and grandparents cant help by doing equity release on their homes to pay fees.

Private secondary is becoming unaffordable for many people who might have considered it but they are still willing to stretch to Prep school fees if it guarantees a place at free state Grammar.

Insider information told me it was about standards. They have plenty of applicants but there have been boys getting in who shouldn't really be in and then they struggle.

Very few boys leave MoreBeta, the reason many go to the junior school is just to secure their place at the senior school. Birmingham is a long way away for us. The vast majority of families at NHS have two working parents.

I agree with littleredsquirrel. I've never heard of anyone leaving for a Birmingham school. Newark or Southwell maybe? I believe it is to do with standards and the spare places that need to be filled.

Perhaps the Head will be clearer at the parents' meetings? If he is reading, please can I have a paper invite and not learn about things on Twitter or via The Nottm Post though? Perhaps reflect a bit on the PR?

Does anyone know whether my fees the school pays for PR consultancy and guidance on comms? Finding out by delayed email was very poor form and announcing it on Twitter like an excited teenager was an embarassingly approach. Amateur beyond words!

If the school has been letting in boys who aren't up to it, who is held responsible for that? That's not fair on the child who struggles and the individuals allowing it ought to be disciplined and retrained accordingly. There's nothing to prevent them for letting in girls who aren't up to it either unless the practise is stopped.

Having experience of boys school that went co-ed (with elder DS and now younger DS), even 7+ years down the line, the co-ed still feels more like a boys school. Roughly 1/3 girls in all year groups and whilst they do seem happy nowhere near the amount of activities for girls that are offered to boys. Never heard of a dance class but of course the girls are welcome to join the rugby and hockey clubs with the boys!

Undoubtedly affected numbers and quality of applicants at local girls school although suprisingly their academic results have still stayed the best in the area despite this.

I think they do the marketing in house, baffledmum. IME their communications have always been like this. They have sent bills and letters to wrong addresses (more than once). It would be helpful for them (think of the cost) if they gave the boys letters to bring home or sent several bits all in one envelope. It seems daft to send them out one by one over the space of a couple of days.

dancingdreamer - I think it will be a boys' school for many years to come and it is sensible that the Head has set aside 10 years for the school to become co-ed. My son will have left the school during this period. I still feel a little sad that 500 years of tradition have come to an end in such an abrupt way but, as I think I have said, I trust Mr Fear to act in the best interests of the school - despite feeling a bit narked by it periodically one week on!

Interesting. This kind of thing has happened in many cities.
I think it is often true that the girls school does later decline for the reasons mentioned by other posters....some girls want to move to co ed to 6th form, raising the standards of the co ed and reducing them in the girls school.....then parents choose the school with better results from lower down.

This is not always the pattern, especially in boarding schools which are a special case. In day schools though, there is a trend of decline in numbers in girls schools anyway, as more and more people prefer co ed. There will always be a place for girls schools, but it is more of a niche market these days. This trend is speeded up by boys schools going co ed. the decline of girls schools can take many many years though.

Where I live, the boys school went fully co ed almost 20 years ago. The girls school in the town (which had no formal links or reciprocal arrangements) has been in slow decline for many many years in terms of numbers. There are many reasons for this, but one was the fact that some of the girls who would have gone there, went to the co ed school instead. This year, possible closure of the girls school was announced. It has been saved, but only by going co ed itself. There simply wasn't the demand for a girls only school.

Places that have highly successful girls day schools tend to have boys schools close by. Or they are richly endowed, so can attract the very bright with generous bursaries, to keep grades up, which isa big selling point for other parents. It is almost always the boys schools that go co ed (more flexible as not in girls school organisations) perhaps because even fewer parents are committed to boys only ed than girls only ed. The girls school then bravely says they are continuing to provide single sex ed, as that is their selling point and girls do better in single sex ed......but given a few years, start to struggle and then (generalising here) often become the school for girls who cannot get into the co ed, or who for other reasons don't want to be in a mixed environment.

It is a shame for the Girls School in Nottingham, because whilst what I mention above is not inevitable, the boys school going co ed will certainly make the future of the girls school more difficult. On a very basic note, the parents of girls now have more choices than before and some will opt for the new option which was not there before. If the girls school does not have the funds to offer bursaries to make them more attractive than the competition, their position in the long term is not enviable.

There's a couple of girls school's in Nottingham, this is the only boys school. The bursaries available at the boy's school are not helpful. They only offer them to boys entering year 7 and the 6th form, not for families who may need help in the other years. If a boy doesn't need one in year 7 and the families circumstances change in year 8 then there's nothing as far as I am aware.

I think if you approach them though LadyMary they consider the case, particularly if the boy might have to leave without assistance, its just that they don't offer them as a matter of routine in the other years.

Junior classes over 24? Really? Gosh, that's not great for an independent school.

Yes, most schools have 'hardship' funds for those already in the school who then experience financial difficulties. Some schools will offer lower fees for a period (usually until a natural break, such as end of GCSEs) or make an agreement to be paid over a longer period. Most schools will work pretty hard to enable a child to stay, but they prefer to be told early on if there is a problem. Late or non payment, followed by a request for help won't be met as favourably as asking for help before a serious problem arises.
This is not the same as having a bursary and isn't available to everyone, only those who after means testing are shown to have difficulties due to a change in circumstances. Some schools are very open about having these pots of money, others less so, as I guess they don't want too many applicants!

However, in terms of accessing a general bursary or scholarship, they are usually only available at usual entry points or at 6th form level. Some schools still have generous bursaries available,mid they have big endowments to fund them, but many schools seem to offer less and less. Scholarships seem to be often in name only, for prestige, or only amount to £1000 which won't tip the balance for most who can't afford full fees.

Hollygirt is now co-ed too though.

It's strange all these schools are going co-ed; we were frustrated at the lack of academic, co-ed, independent, senior, day school in Notts/Derby area when we were looking for DD. It will be interesting to see if one has emerged in 5 years time.

Marialusia will they not be putting themselves in direct competition with Trent College? I know they run a comprehensive bus route to the school throughout Nottinghamshire. I know very little about Trent College maybe it's not in the same league as NHS?? Other than its an independent co-ed & takes both day & borders.

Sorry, Trent not our cup of tea. Not very strong academically and odd boarding school remnants like Saturday school from Y9. If we wanted that sort of thing Foremarke/Repton would have been a better option for us.

I'm afraid the writing has been on the wall for the NHS ever since it lost sight of it's "grammar school with brass knobs" roots and started spending fortunes on the kind of up-market facilities you see at schools favoured by the genuinely wealthy rather than the comfortable middle classes.

Couple that with the loss of the LEA scholarship boys back in the late 70s and you have the perfect storm of fees outstripping family incomes and a shortage of very clever boys.

That's a good insight NickL We were expecting a grammar school with knobs on for our son and are pleased with the facilities but the fees are looking hefty for the future.

Does anyone know why they are not taking girls in year 7 until 2016?

They have a 10 year plan and are starting by integrating into the infant school and the 6th form. I don't think they could manage an influx of girls quite so quickly into a key year like Y7. They need longer to have the facilities and prepare the boys...

Apparently girls may be admitted in to Y7 from Sept 2015 if there is enough interest. Don't seem to be too many interested from NGHS although there will be some.

I'd heard that too!