Ideas for bright girl secondary in London

[MarriedDadOneSonOneDaughter]

Having sorted out the lad, my attention turns to the lass. Currently at state primary year 3. Rated year 5/6 for Maths and year 7(!) for English. Somewhat of a perfectionist and sensitive to mistakes/failure. Very social and into performing arts and quite sporty.

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[basildonbond]

Ok then if you live north of the river then you can scrub anything south of the river off your list so Alleyn's, Emanuel, WHS, PHS etc are out of the picture

If your ds is at St Paul's there's absolutely no way you could even contemplate sending your dd to somewhere like Sacred Heart unless you want to give her the impression that you simply don't value girls' education in the same way as boys' so personally I'd scrub off all the state schools too (not saying that state schools can't give your dc a perfectly good education but frankly if you're paying £20k a year for your son you'd need to have a bloody good reason not to treat your daughter with parity)

So that leaves SPGS, G&L, Latymer Upper, LEH, poss NLCS depending on what the journey would be like - all good schools, all v academic and if your daughter works hard she'll get fantastic results at any of them. Depending on how academic your dd is you may need to have a back-up 'safety' school and if she's perfectionist she may be happier being top in a slightly less selective school than bring mid-bottom of a highly selective school

But tbh you're over-thinking this - you don't want your dd to end up being the focus of such intensity ...

[WorkingItOutAsIGo]

Ah sorry I muddled you up with another father on another thread I was on and thought your DS was going to Harrow.

So scrub my comments on boarding.

Your DD sounds like a shoe-in for SPGS but you may want to be careful about whether it's the right school for her. There is a lot to be said for having your dc in the same school group and location too. There are quite a number of girls from North London who travel on the school bus which is quite jolly. There is some intangible niceness of being part of a joint school community too.

[LauraBridges]

I trhink it would pretty awful if the boys is at St Paul's and his sister for some kind of sexist reason is put into a much worse school and indefensible just to save school fees or because she is likely to marry and not need to earn a living. She should certainly try for St Paul's.I know someone with two daughters there and they love it (as my daughter loved NLCS). It is a different issue if she won't get in of course.

[MarriedDadOneSonOneDaughter]

Answers so far - NLCS and Haberdashers - I will put them on my short list (thanks LB)

There are a number of posts mentioning many schools but not actually saying anything about the school their daughter actually goes to (unless you have 5 daughters with 1 each at SPGS, G&L, Latymer Upper, LEH - if so, my bad, and wow!). Where are your daughters and what are the good/bad experiences?

[NearTheWindymill]

Unless you attend church at least once a fortnight and polish the silver don't even think about the church schools unless you are going to move within a quarter of a mile of them.

I don't understand how you would consider Emanuel and SPGS on the same page tbh.

My dd attended one of the schools and we moved her to one that is far too far away for you to even contemplate.

[LauraBridges]

My daughters - one was at Habs and the other at NLCS all through school. They both had a go at 11+ for fun to get into the school of the other and despite the schools being more similar than different neither got in. They are pleased they were at different schools not in the shadow of each other. They are both London lawyers now, both graduated already so not currently there. They both loved their schools. NLCS had a slightly more Hampstead/ Central London parent body about it and Habs a few more parents who lived out into the Herts countryside. NCLS gets slightly better exam results but both get lots of girls into Oxbridge.

Habs is a bit more into the country more fields, has a lake but NLCS has enough grounds and is in a lovely house where Handel used to stay owned by the Duke of Chandos. If you have a son at St Paul's then St paul's Girls would be more logical and second choice NLCS as not as far out as Habs. Probably best to try for all 4 and 1 or 2 back ups of easier to get into schools.

[WorkingItOutAsIGo]

Sorry am completely ignoring your condition that we must have a DD at a school to comment on it because
a) I can because this is t'interweb
b) I know plenty of girls at lots of schools and know plenty about them so can save you time (though I see you have plenty of it!)
c) I am saving you from selection bias - every parent will tell you their school is best - because we can't be objective because we are investing in our DDs being there. To avoid buyer's remorse we have to believe it's best.

You also need to be aware as I am sure you are that there is no perfect school and the experience a girl will have at any school is not completely forecastable - elements like who she makes friends with and how she develops and experiences the school can't be completely controlled for. All these schools are basically wonderful and most girls will feel well-suited to most of them.

[basildonbond]

What workingitoutasigo said ...

[horsemadmom]

Agree with LB. I've got 2 DDs at NLCS and they both love it. The pastoral care is exceptional.
We found the sibling thing threw up some weird 11+ results. Schools DD2 should have walked into didn't even give her interviews- I guess they were clever enough to know it was a waste of time (incl Habs). This doesn't apply to you, OP. In the StP Boys area, you should look at SPGS, LEH, G&L and NHEH. Have a look at the NLCS coach routes on the website. Unlike Habs Girls, it is possible to take the tube if your DD stays late- shuttle costs £1 from school if they don't want to walk to the station.
Do keep in mind that the pool of girls who do the exam are self selecting from the start. Few enter a less than clever DD. They will all be top of their primary school. After that it comes down to the cleverest of clever.

[alejandro]

"if you really can stomach a state school"

that was a really lovely comment

[VestaCurry]

Hmmm yes, stomaching a state school really isn't so bad when the school in question is on a par with the best private schools in terms of results and your children are flourishing there there.

[WorkingItOutAsIGo]

But I will play your game. One DD at SPGS - I wasn't sure about the school choice as had heard so many things I didnt like but in fact its been more than wonderful for her and it turns out to have been the perfect school for her. She came from a small, non-selective primary school with no tradition of sending girls to SPGS. She has made a wonderful group of supportive, down to earth friends. It turns out she is really academic in the purest sense of the world - she loves learning for its own sake, adores her lessons, is lucky to have many inspirational and dedicated teachers, and acaemically has won prizes at a national level in more than one subject - without ever seeming terribly stressed or pressured but rather just enjoying the opportunities that come her way. Some of the lessons and activities I hear about them doing are the most innovative and creative ideas I have ever heard of in education. She is off to do a national competition in a third subject shortly - I mention this not to brag but just to comment on how broad and non-pigeon holing the education is as these are three very different subjects.

And yet, despite all of that going on, what she actually comes home and talks about is not her work but her sport, her music and her parties - it seems a very well-balanced, productive and healthy life for her.There are times she seems to have an awful lot of homework and might get a little stressed and then plenty of times when she sits and watches Friends or Glee or Sherlock or Dr Who or whatever her current craze is, so on balance I am not concerned. No immediate sense of anorexia or self-harm amongst her friends am relieved to say.I would like to see more focus on serving the community - there is charitable activity but there could be more. And when there is it can be a bit glamorous - the recent charity fashion show was judged by Stella Macartney and Poppy Delevingne!

[MarriedDadOneSonOneDaughter]

WorkingItOutAsIGo - Thanks, SPGS will make my shortlist for open days. Your daughter sounds great and I would wish the same for mine. You are exactly right with selection bias. However, hearing bad rumours about schools laid to rest by parent that actually have experience there is very useful. I have been told that self-esteem, appearances and eating disorders or other such issues are rife amongst teenage girls and it fills me with dread. I suspect it is as much more connected to home life, parenting, luck with teachers, role models and friends than it might be to any particular school.

horsemadmum - "NHEH"? Tried searching to find out which school that is. Probably kick myself when someone here spells it out for me.....

vestacurry and alejandro - I don't agree with the idea of striking state schools off my list, just because her brother has a place at a private school. Specifically, Dame Alice Owen's and Latymer are great schools (grammar co-ed N. London) and my gut feeling is they provide exceptional education and prospects. I think there are great grammars in west/SW London too. We could move to be near them if we thought they were worth it. If it turns out that a state school has a better environment for her or that she doesn't cut it academically for selective schools I won't shy from that decision. I don't think private is always better for all children. There might be a correlation (perhaps a high correlation co-efficient on this forum!), but it isn't a rule in my view. All that said, if somewhere like SPGS seems best for her, that's fine too. I'm blind to the politics, I only care about her interests.

[TangerineSushi]

I would think about Highgate if you want co-ed. It's not the most academic school on your list but is academic enough that even the brightest kids there are catered for, if that makes any sense- good results, plenty going to Oxbridge. It has a very supportive and strong pastoral system, girls are fully integrated in the school and it's good across the board inc extra-curricular. Great sports facilities in particular for a London school.

It depends what you want, really. NLC, St Pauls and City are more academic but not co-ed.

[blouseenthusiast]

I have two boys at Latymer Edmonton and they are v happy there, but I know you asked about daughters! The music is exceptional and academically it v good. My impression is that the girls in the boys' classes are thriving academically.

[blouseenthusiast]

DS1 is also a terrible perfectionist and that does mean he can spend far too long on homework projects, but I think that would happen at any academic school. My impression with Latymer Edmonton is that it perhaps tends a bit more to the science / maths side than the arts side, but that is an impression not based on vast amounts of evidence...

[blouseenthusiast]

Also, it is genuinely a very diverse school and that was important to us.

[MarriedDadOneSonOneDaughter]

Ching! Another to add to my shortlist (altough it was almost certainly going to be on it anyway). Thanks.

[LauraBridges]

Girls do better at all girls' schools and boys apparently in mixed ones so it woudl probably be better if this girl's brother is at St paul's that she goes to a similar girls' school.

I also second the fact schools like NLCS are not rife with eating disorders. My daughter and her friends chomped their way through loads of sweets never mind big meals and far from being obsessed with work both my girls as teenagers spend 10 hours a day from 9am on Sundays even outside at a riding stables covered in mud.

[BeattieBow]

I have a daughter at one of the north london state schools on the list.

I wholeheartedy recommend it, but can't see that you're going to look at it if you are also thinking of NLCS/HABS/St Paul's and the like, because it's like comparing apples and pears imo.

Even the top London state schools are absolutely nothing like the top London independent schools, and you have to decide what it is you want from a school.

Personally, I didn't want private for my daughter and didn't want her to travel. For me, (and her) it is so important to have local friends, a local community and a mix of backgrounds at her school. Whatever anyone says, there is not a mix at the London independent schools. My daughter is thriving there - apart from the musical bit, she sounds very like your dd. A perfectionist and will push herself, sometimes too much, and I would worry that she would put herself under too much stress if she went to somewhere like Henrietta Barnet. In any case, local won for us and was the right decision.

I have a son at a London day school too by the way.

[LauraBridges]

I have a friend whose daughter was at the state school Henrietta B and loved it. She went to Cambridge and recently graduated, Did fine. (Father obese, working class made good, very clever, wears gold chain round neck, not that that's relevant but it is what is coming to mind as I type... bad me...)

[BeattieBow]

Laura Bridges, there are lots of working class people at those state schools! even (gasp) the ones in the list. some even go to Cambridge.

[basildonbond]

Don't rise to it Beattiebow ... If LauraBridges isn't Xenia under another name then she's her identical twin

[Blu]

"Girls do better at all girls' schools and boys apparently in mixed ones"

Now disproved - when properly analysed.

[TacitusMouse]

I actually went to two of those schools on that list in the last 5-10 years so have personal experience. If you want to pm I can answer any specific questions you have