Help! How to boost confidence in bottom set?

[Libertymae]

My very sensitive, hard-on-herself DD is about to be put in sets for maths (Y7). She's an able child at a very academic school, but doesn't like maths much as she finds it difficult.

She is convinced she'll be in the bottom set (doom! gloom! horror!) and I also think this is highly likely. However, unlike her I happen to think this is a good thing as I think it will help her fully understand what is being taught.

How can I help her see the positives if/when this happens? Any ideas gratefully received!

I'd emphasis to her that she'd be more likely to flourish in this set. She'd more than likely be taught the basics all over again and build up from there.

Thank you, Gimmesomemore, that's a very good point and one I can use.

It is unlikely she'll be in the bottom.
I tell my Set 5ers, if they work hard, the only way is up. Sets are reviewed every term. I also tell them 'we're doing Set 1 work today, just a bit slower to make sure we all get it' (which is true). They seem to like this notion.

one of DDs oldest friends is in set 2 of 5 because although she could academically cope in set 1 she socially finds it really tough being in with the off the scale crew
in set 2 she is a big fish in a smaller pond and excels

also, in a good school, sets are fluid in year 7 and 8 : they rejig at least once a term as late developers kick in and those who copied everything at primary get sussed out

She sounds just like my DSD (13) - who's a reasonably bright girl who's just started a v academic school and has maths as her weakest subject. She's been put in a set 5 out of 5, which wasn't unexpected. But she seems to be thriving there - she says she's one of the best in the class - a new experience for her in maths!. I would tell your DD that the setting is just to put people in groups that go at the same pace - she may find it a knock to her confidence at first if she ends up in bottom set, but once she's there she'll be much happier than if she's constantly struggling to keep up. Most schools also allow movement between sets if she does feel she's been placed wrongly.

Worth reminding her too that it's a selective school (presumably?) so only bright people are there to start with.

Thank you all.

I think she will be near the bottom, threepiecesuite! So many of the kids do Kumon maths etc and, like purpleroses says, she is indeed in a selective school and one where many of the children are pushed very hard academically at home.

Each to their own, IMHO, but it's not my or my DH's way to do this (in fact, we can't as already we're both out of our depth when it comes to the maths!) We want to support her to do her best, obvs, but mostly want her happy and confident.

Ds2 is low in confidence. I have just bought key stage 3 (yr7) books to support him in different subjects. We will do a little each week/day depending on time and inclination. I hope I can then help him where he is stuck.

MY DS1 was on the bottom table at primary for maths, and in the bottome set for maths at his selective school in Y8 and 9.
When he started GCSE courses he started trying harder and practising a lot at home.AS he started to improve he found he enjoyed it more which made him try even harder.He ended up with A in maths at GCSE.At A level he took maths and, against all school advice , further maths
.At A2 he ended up with an A * in maths and A in FM and is now doing an engineering degree at a RG uni.

Bottom set for maths in a selective school is not a bad place to be. They normally have a better staff student ratio and will be prepped for the higher tier paper (if this still exists). Most selective schools get 99-100% a-c at GCSE, so your dd is still on track for a good exam pass.

coco that's an amazing result. Good for him!

Remind her that 'bottom set' in a selective school is still very able. Point out that the purpose of setting is to pace the work so that people can grasp it. She is still doing similar work to other sets - just more slowly and thoroughly, as that is the best way for her to absorb it. They'll all sit the same GCSEs, it's just that, for her, the effective method of learning is slower and more methodical. How you get there matters less (in this case) than that you get there in the end.

I'll never forget struggling at something when I was at uni and moaning to a friend about how slow I was. She said, 'So what? It's not a race. You're learning it and getting there. Same results in the end as someone who picks it up quickly.' It was one of the most useful things anyone has ever said and I never forgot it.

Hi OP. Been in similar situation with my DC's. What I tell them is that everyone will sit the same GCSE exam in the end - the sets are just a way of making sure that everyone gets through the work in the way that suits them best. Then I keep my fingers crossed that the teacher will be OK at worst, inspiring at best

Exactly the same thing happened to my Y8 DD, and I can honestly say it's the best thing that could have happened. She's in a very selective school and found it hard keeping up with the really able mathematicians last year. Now she's in a small group and she's enjoying maths for the first time ever. She knows she's not the worst in the class, it goes at her pace, and I'm sure she'll come out with a better result for it. She's actually hoping that they don't move her up a set next year!

Watching with interest.
My year 6 dd finding math very confusing especially everytime when her teacher revisit different methods for doing the same job. So she has very low confidence in maths as every time when she had understood one method than the teacher would revisit another method again so she got all confused again. Just wonder if maths in secondary school will be any different. How far into year 7 will the new school access the new new kids?

Sorry I mean re assess

My dd was in the bottom set for maths at a selective school. The sets got smaller as they got lower, and they were all told that they they were all doing the same work, and could all get As, but the lower sets needed more individual attention to get there- hence the smaller sets. I will never forget her face when she did get an A! Once the initial excitement of whose in which set is over, it will stop being an issue, I promise you.

Coco, that's an amazing result! I need to share that story with my DD. And thanks to the others for your advice too. It's so nice to be able to share and get advice from people who have been there!

I am actually beginning to think she's struggling a bit with school overall at the moment, and that's why she is getting her knickers in a twist about the sets.

She totally coasted at (small, state) primary school, and got by without doing very much at all. Secondary school is different ballgame, and she is surrounded by v bright kids who are worked equally hard at home as at school so it's all a bit of a culture shock.

I'm feeling like a bit of a crap mum today, TBH. I let her get on with all homework by herself, don't give her extra to do as I don't want her to feel overloaded. But am now wondering if I'm actually doing her a total disservice and should be much more involved and much pushier like so many of the other parents? We've always gone with the 'Just do your best' ethos, but now I'm wondering if I should be looking at maths tutors and Kumon like the other kids, to give her a fairer chance. Her school is still state, so we could afford it.
Thoughts please.

Hi Liberty,

My DC have never had tutoring (both at state comp) but I do encourage them to let me help with homework. By this, I don't mean that I do it for them, but that I am there to ask questions, bounce ideas off, proof read and gently point in the right direction if necessary. The conversations we have seem to help them to produce higher quality work than they might if left completely to their own devices (particularly in the case of younger DC, who will otherwise do what has been asked as briefly as possible!!) . They usually have a good grasp of the work they produce working in this way, and do well. If I notice any problems as they are working, I encourage them to ask their teachers for a bit of clarification rather than making sure they get it 'right'. Tutoring is the norm for many families in my area too, so I completely understand the pressure you will feel to do likewise. Good luck to you and your DD - I'm sure things will settle soon for her at school as she gets to grips with the new culture.

Very sensible advice, thank you.

Enjoyed reading this thread. Thank you, people. DS has sat for several selective independents and although I know that we should trust the exam/interview process, I am a bit fearful that he'll just scrape in and then flounder. If he gets a place (and there's no guarantee that he will) I do hope I can keep him focused on the notion that he's in a selective school to start with, rather than focusing on just his position within the small cohort that made it into the Year 7 of whatever school he ends up in.

Still, that would be quite a nice problem to have, and we've got to get a place first. That's another thread...

Liberty, in reply to your post about wondering whether you should be pushier... I think you know your child best and whether that would sap the life blood from her or help her thrive.

Dc are both at selective school. DS1 thrives there - loves the pressure, loves hard work. DS2 struggles more. Rather than add to his burden I let him watch a lot of trashy TV, have friends over, go into town, and play his electric guitar until the house fuses. That way he feels refreshed. If after school more a grind too he'd give up the will to live. He won't be a straight A* student, and the school will have to live with that. But he and I are happier with him going for As and Bs and having a great life outside of school.