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Secondary education

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Original poster

Double / Triple Science GCSE

71 replies

teacherwith2kids · 31/05/2013 15:16

DS's (otherwise excellent, very high performing) state comprehensive school does not offer triple science GCSE - even the most able children do double science. This is not seen as a barrier to children within the school who wish to continue with Science, as obviously the AS / A-level teachers are used to it, and in fact the numbers taking Science A-levels are very high.

It's my one issue with the school, asnd as part of rasing it with the 'powers that be' [DS is currently in Year 7, so there may be a chance to influence things if I start campaigning now!) I am interested to know how common it is for non-selective state schools to offer triple science?

Ideally, I would love someone to come along and say 'ah, the data you need is in this data table here'. However, in the absence of that, oh beloved MNetters, would you be able to tell me:

  • Type of school (I am not interested in grammar or private schools at the moment. I know that our local residual grammars DO offer triple science, but I know already that DS's school rejects that as a comparison, so I am looking for comparable schools to use in my argument - 'true' comps or secondary moderns)
  • Age range (11-16 or 11-18)
  • Whether or not they offer triple science as a 'normal' subject choice within the everyday timetable (the school cites lack of time in the timetable as the primary reason behind not offering triple science)

Many thanks in advance! As I say, it's my one grumble about the school, which is otherwise serrving my very able but quirky DS's needs brilliantly, so it's something of a 'luxury grumble'!

OP posts:
Erebus · 31/05/2013 21:57

Have put some stuff on the other thread, but:

Our 'outstanding' comp offers double and triple but in the same options block, so triple is only available as 'accelerated' i.e taking 2 option's worth of timetabling. Which I'm not happy about.

My 'greatest fear', and one supported by actual tutors I have spoken to, is that your double science taker has, rather obviously, only done 2/3 of the amount of the curriculum of their chosen science, compared to the triple takers. This aspect seems universally ignored, esp by those whose DC were only offered double but were well capable of triple, had it been an option, as opposed to those among us who will never know if our DC fall in that gap between double and triple, ability wise (but weren't fed 'the knowledge') or were only ever capable of good double scores, nothing more.

The tutors tell me that they can spot double versus triple takers in the first term of A level, and some DC whose schools didn't offer triple often showed the fastest bridging ability, i.e. those who would have sailed through triple.. were it offered at GCSE.

Lancelottie · 31/05/2013 22:12

If it's any comfort, DS took double science but scored 100% in his January AS exam for Physics.

He did think he was struggling with the AS syllabus at first but clearly not too badly. Possibly the fact that he knew he had some catching up to do was a spur to getting on with it?

bigTillyMint · 31/05/2013 22:14

Wow Lancelottie, 100%ShockFlowers

Lancelottie · 31/05/2013 22:20

I know... he's the world's biggest worrier and possibly overdid the revision for that one!

As he says, the results for the next exams can only be a let down after that...

IKnowWhat · 31/05/2013 22:35

St Andrews Uni does not accept duel award science in lieu of GCSE Biology. However, that is the only Medical school i can find that seems to care. Many Medical schools specifically state that they DO accept Duel Science, for example Barts, Birmingham and even Oxford.

HERE is Oxfords admission requirements for Medicine It clearly states that Duel Award Science is Ok.

I wouldn't worry if my child was only able to take Duel Award Science. What actually matters is chosing the right A levels and getting good grades at AS and A2

junebeetle · 31/05/2013 22:44

but St Andrews only care about GCSE Biology if Biology is not offered at either AS or A level, which would be pretty unusual for a medical applicant. Basically, once you have an AS or A2 level in a science, nobody is going to care whether or not you did double or separate sciences at GCSE.

LynetteScavo · 31/05/2013 22:51

DSs comprehensive in an non selective town offers triple science, and I would be very cross if they didn't.

They don't, however, insist on a language at GCSE. Hmm

Original poster
teacherwith2kids · 31/05/2013 22:52

If DS goes on to do Science A-levels, he is likely to be at the same school, and they are used to 'bridging' the gap after double science, and nobody will care about his GCSE sciences if he successfully completes A-levels in them.

My concern was over the 'general impression on an application form for a non-science area' of an otherwise able student with only double science - for example an application to read economics (DS's current obsession), or for a highly- competitive business of some type. I wondered whether offering an 'explanation' on a UCAS or application form would be seen as somewhat feeble - but it sounds from this and the other related thread that this is perfectly possible. His strongest subjects at the moment appear to be Maths, Geography and MFL, so goodness knows where that leaves us!

OP posts:
Original poster
teacherwith2kids · 31/05/2013 22:53

Lynette, at the moment it looks as if DS is more likely to do 2 languages than he would be to choose 3 sciences - but I deplore the failure to provide the option!

OP posts:
LynetteScavo · 31/05/2013 22:57

"His strongest subjects at the moment appear to be Maths, Geography and MFL, so goodness knows where that leaves us!"

Well rounded, I would say.

IKnowWhat · 31/05/2013 23:02

Chemistry A level is much much more important than Biology A level for medicine applicants. Info HERE.

IKnowWhat · 31/05/2013 23:06

teacherwith2kids. I am impressed you are thinking about UCAS applications so early Grin. I really would not worry about the Duel Science as long as he gets good grades in his GCSEs, AS's and A2s it is of no importance.

Original poster
teacherwith2kids · 31/05/2013 23:09

IKnow, I know, talk about planning ahead. But I am just in the process of starting to badger the school about triple science, as if anything is to happen in time for him - or indeed his younger sister who is currently in Year 5 - to benefit from it, I need to start NOW!

OP posts:
SanityClause · 31/05/2013 23:14

DD1 is at a super selective grammar,where triple science is available, but not positively encouraged, unless it is a real passion for the student.

They encourage the girls to do the subjects they are really interested in.

They regularly send girls to do medicine, at university (also maths, geography, and various languages Wink).

junebeetle · 31/05/2013 23:56

Yes Chemistry A level is more important (needed at A2 for many places), but you rule out an awful lot of medical schools if you don't have biology to at least AS level. It is rare for would be medics not to offer it at higher than GCSE.

TheOriginalSteamingNit · 01/06/2013 00:00

Comprehensive in none selective area: think the two top sets do triple as a matter of course.

IKnowWhat · 01/06/2013 00:07

As long as you have A level Chemistry and either maths or physics you are still eligible to apply to 13 out of 33 uk Medical schools without any biology.
However, I am sure most potential medical students would naturally have an interest in biology and would choose to take Biology to at least AS Level.

titchy · 01/06/2013 12:53

11-16 outstanding mediocre comprehensive. Triple offered to all who are at least 6b in maths and science. Usually around 30 take it. It takes up one option block rather than being crammed into the space of double.

Original poster
teacherwith2kids · 01/06/2013 13:18

Titchy, it's interesting that 6b is the cut-off. DS has already exceeded that benchmark for maths, and it is his target for Science by the end of Year 7, though he is not the most able in his tutor group let alone his year. It would imply that the school really isn't stretching its more able pupils in science...

OP posts:
WorrySighWorrySigh · 01/06/2013 13:24

11-16 dreadful school, recently cackademied, offers triple science as one option. Approximately 60/140 did triple science. The extra science option is not available to all.

Something I would strongly suggest now that we have bitter experience is making sure that those doing GCSE with an eye to A level are being taught in a way which will make the transition to the A level course easier.

notfluffy · 01/06/2013 15:02

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

titchy · 01/06/2013 15:06

Sorry should hve added, they nee to be 6b by end year 8 as they start GCSEs in year 9..... But they could be pushier yes.

adeucalione · 01/06/2013 15:14

Some stats from the public accounts committee here OP, seems 70% of schools were offering triple science in 2011.

adeucalione · 01/06/2013 15:17

Sorry, 2010. That's up from 30% in 2005, with 20% of children choosing triple science at GCSE level.

Original poster
teacherwith2kids · 01/06/2013 15:25

Stats!!! Adeu, I love you!

OP posts: