Who can afford private schools in the UK?

[wjchoihk]

Hi. I am not sure if this is an appropriate question to ask here. But I have always wondered how rich you should be to send children to private schools in UK. Fees are anywhere from 3000 up to 10000 per term. Even allowing for wide gaps in income, thinking of 'avearge' UK wage of 26,000 pound, math simply don't add up for a normal life with such high fees. I also know only 7% of children go private though.

How much of private parents live on "inherited" wealth and how much on simply superior current earnings? I have my kids at SW London privates but I wouldn't be able to afford this without current int'l expat package. Some parents at my kids' schools LOOK and ARE very very rich but most of them LOOK quite down to earth. But I can't ask....

I was saying that private does not automatically = small class sizes and a shedload of extra curricular activities. My school was a private grammar. If there had been a state grammar available I'd have gone to that. There seems to be a view from those who are anti private education that 'private' schools are a homogenous mass. There is huge variation. There are public schools with their own golf courses and outfits from previous centuries and there are schools that actually have aged facilities that wouldn't measure up well against many state secondaries.

Thank you stealth.

I think I do find the unfair comparison annoying. A trivial example, a private school near us has a massive walk in fridge to keep lunch boxes in. People actually say things like "that's the difference, you see, the state schools don't have anything like that."

Of course they don't. But if they had access to your massive fees they would! agggggggghhhhhh!

"There seems to be a view from those who are anti private education that 'private' schools are a homogenous mass. There is huge variation

People on both sides of the debate have been saying that repeatedly. Interestingly, people on then"private" side of the debate seem very keen I'd highlighting the diversity of private schools, while refusing to accept any difference at all between state schools..........

The biggest difference in the private primaries I know is the lack of TAs. Most of the teachers have 10 years+ experience and they do the teaching.

Is someone saying that Seeker has kids at a grammar....

And Seeker - no one chooses a school based on their fridge size!

I am chuckling at the thought that a walk in fridge would be educational deciding factor

The fridge example rings very true to me! And yes, though people don't choose based on fridges, it gives the impression of thought and caring and even safety, which is of course just the impression you'd want to give - and is, I imagine, taken by many parents as reflective of all those things being part of the school's wider ethos.

Nit - indeed. One can just imagine the tone of her voice!

I absolutely accept that state schools aren't all the same. For example the one I know that has a 5A*-C at GCSE pass rate of under 25% couldn't be more different from the one that has a pass rate of 65%. And there are tiny rural state primaries that have brilliant staff to pupil ratios and ones where your DC would be one of 33+. That's the point for me! It's easy to send your DC to the local school when it happens to be a good one.

I don't think private schools are a a homogenous mass at all. Some are very successful and some are dire, obviously!

Sheesh, I need refuge in my Marlow thread...

Oh God Totally you not still chewing this over are you. Remember they're paying prep fees out of their net income. When you first made this point you said prep fees £9000 then you raised it to £10 000 now your saying £13 000. Net income £40 000 if both parents are earning £20 000 is about £2700 pcm if fees are £13000 PA monthly cost £1083. Please can you demonstrate how an average family do it on £1671 in the south east. Where according to stats average mortgage is 26% of their take home pay so thats £702 then theres life insurance and house insurance on top of that so lets say £800 that leaves £871 our council tax (band d for three beds) is £121 so that £750 our water bill is about £50 now £700,other utilities you've got to be talking a minimum of £80 pcm- £620 then theres the phone bill and internet what shall we say £40 pcm including mob I don't know my DH pays it so now £580 pcm. Thats what you've got left spend buy clothes petrol/public transport car insurance road tax etc tell me Totally it cant be done!

But there's a big variation apart from good and bad. There are hundreds of private day schools that have as little in common with eg Eton as most state secondaries.

Narked - not necessarily typical at all. DC's school, as a random example, has (in pre-prep) one teacher and (more or less, they are a bit "pooled") 1 TA per class of 16 (max, typically closer to 12). In prep they have a significant learning support team and ~20% receive at least some one to one support. There is probably (even) more variation in private schools than there is in state schools, given that some are well endowed longstanding profitable businesses with no debt and waiting lists galore, and others are struggling small businesses with little or no capital, and that the variation in fees is far larger than any variations in funding per pupil in the state sector. Even in the state sector though - the primaries round us are all CofE schools with significant local support and endowments (gifts of playing fields, etc) and have facilities and options for development that I am sure a lot of primary schools would kill for.

As has been repeatedly said, there is no such thing as "typical" in either sector.

I dont think all state schools are the same. The grammars are the creme de la creme for some parents who furiously tutor their children (claim not to of course!) and give them every past paper going to ensure that they are prepared and to get them that extra leg up in the university application process.

Of course to them that is not bucking the system. Personally I think we should bring grammars back everywhere. Also build up colleges where people can learn a trade. You wouldnt call an investment banker in a panic if you had water pouring through your ceiling - you would call a plumber! Make the trades attractive, stop pushing mickey mouse degrees so that everyone can get something!

In the 70's 5% of people went to uni. None from my school sadly including me! Now it is over 50%. Its daft...

"A good state sixth form will offer loads of extra curricular,"
higgle have you any idea of the range and quality of extra curricular activities some independent schools offer? and no its not all about swimming pools and fives courts. This is not a pissing match I just don't think you've any idea what the difference is between those top independent schools e.g. Eton and top state schools.

Happy This may be true (although of course some of us may have friends or colleagues who either went to this sort of school or have kids there now) - but then, you actually have no idea what the top state schools are like. :)

Careful now...

I agree Happy. One of those comments again by people who have never set foot in a top independent...

Is it defense of the dark arts?

"Of course they don't. But if they had access to your massive fees they would! agggggggghhhhhh!"
Im not disputing this I made this point up thread when your charging £34 000 a year your going to provide jaw dropping facilities and fab extra curricular activities and of course small classroom sizes.
Seeker if its any consolationIm not sure my Ds's school has a walk in fridge (well maybe in the kitchen but you can't store meals for 60 in a conventional fridge) neither has any other school he's been too. Nor for matter do I see the need for one or am I missing something here. Its certainly not on my must have list when Im looking at a school.

"but then, you actually have no idea what the top state schools are like."
Sorry Russian you're wrong DS1 is at one!!!

"higgle have you any idea of the range and quality of extra curricular activities some independent schools offer? and no its not all about swimming pools and fives courts. This is not a pissing match I just don't think you've any idea what the difference is between those top independent schools e.g. Eton and top state schools."

Happy- of course the's a vast difference. Because there is a vast difference in the money available........!!!!!!!!!!'

I'm sure there's lovely stuff at some private schools, that's never been my issue. I'm sure their dramatic productions, for example, are much much more polished and better funded and perhaps even better acted than the one dd1 will be in after half term. The fact that lots of things about them are nicer or even better is not something I'm arguing against.

However, if I then get told that, say, most state schools don't really do drama, competitive sport, pastoral care, debating, choir, etc, that's more annoying. We may not do them as prettily or even as well, but I hate the misperceptions often seen here that you won't get anything like that at all in a state school.