Independent secondaries - why do they not seem to value top-of-second-tier all-rounders?

[MrsSteptoe]

Traipsing around all these wretched London independents and becoming very dispirited by the idea that if Y5 DS is bright, but not VERY bright - sits in about the top 20% of his class, on target to get all 5s in his SATS in Y6 - but doesn't have some outstanding special interest, they're not right for any of the schools. Maybe I'm just getting a bit depressed today, but they all seem to want these alpha high achieving kids, not my lovely boy who just wants to build Lego. I am teaching him piano (it's OK, I'm qualified to do it) and he did take karate, but he was so desperate to stop doing it - he knew he wasn't very good, and it was affecting his self-esteem. We've honestly got limited stuff available around here, and he needs to go to bed still quite early so homework needs to be fitted in so we are n't doing a huge number of extra curriculars... bother, I'm making myself cry. OK, bad day at the office, that's all. Maybe the schools are just a bit full of bullshit when they're selling themselves and my expectations of a 9YO are too high? Anyone with a bit of common sense out there (and a hanky)?

Well my DS disproves it as he's v bright & mathematical (will prob end Y6 on high level 6) but whilst he can pick out a tune on his guitar I wouldn't say he was inherently musical. Anyway, not dissing music in general, just finding it a bit unfair that musical children above all others get an extra crack at entry to selective schools.

If you could bear weekly boarding (or moving to the 'burbs) there are many many schools around the M25/within 60 mins of London that don't 'do' the whole Alpha thing, but DO 'do' the whole pastoral care/individual attention thing. If you name an area you can manage to commute to/from then am sure some Mners can point you in right direction. Good schools guide/ISC/league results all have limitations (eg one of the best schools near where I live comes low in the tables, but most people don't realise that it's not selective and has a hugely successful special needs unit which sways it's figures - the clever kids in the school still get to Oxbridge).

Which one is that Squiffy?

Will PM you

Thanks Squiffy.

your son sounds lovely. A good independent school will find his talents and bring it out. That's what ours did for dd1 who was very hard working but had no particular outstanding talent. They really seem to treasure her. Mind you this is a non-selective independent outside of London.

MrsSteptoe - was in your shoes 3 years ago and 1 year ago with DS1 and DS2, and really hated going to the open days. They're basically designed to make you think that you'll be incredibly lucky to get a place there, and like you I ended up really doubting that my DS would be up to it (ditto some tutors actually - was told by one well-known one that my DS1 would really struggle to get in anywhere on the basis of her mock exam, he got offered 4 schools including a pretty selective one). By the way, try to ignore all that "we have 600 applicants for 100 places" business - those 600 applicants may have applied to 5 or more schools each so they're not just offering 100 places!

Have finally realized what a load of PR guff these schools are full of. You need to trust your instincts, try to see the schools NOT at a big open day and really gauge where you and your son feel most comfortable. From my experience, however much schools rabbit on about wanting children who are rounded and do lots of extra curricular stuff, for "straight places" (ie non scholarships) they are purely looking at the 11+ exam results and take the kids who did best in order to try to get an intake that will get the best gcse results for the school 5 years later (I honestly think the interview is just to make parents feel better about the whole thing.) For scholarships, they're looking for very high achievers in academics, sports, music etc. So basically there's no point forcing your child to get up to a grade 3 in piano or something - it's totally pointless unless they're about a grade 6 in atleast one instrument and might be in line for a scholarship (so most of us can relax and cancel those piano lessons, and our kids can enjoy their lego in peace!!)

My DS2 is a bit like yours but less academic, and he's just started at a lovely boys' school slightly out of london (train ride) and he's absolutely loving it so far. There's a lot to be said for a nurturing environment, and the teaching seems to be very similar to my DS1's more academic school - it's just a different intake, which is reflected in the league tables. If you want to PM me with where you live, I might be able to make suggestions if you're near to us.

So please don't worry - your DS sounds lovely and he also sounds more than bright enough for a lot of independent schools - good luck finding the right place.

Oops, just re-read your post and realized you may be a piano teacher - no offence intended! (Actually I play the piano!)

I second "StillSquiffy" re boarding schools many are significantly less selective a nice mix and offer a very broad education. Your only problem is that boarding is significantly more expensive and many don't take at yr 7.

I feel so much better for reading all of your comments - so many sensible comments and wise advice, and what a lovely group of children are described here too!
It would be lovely to look at schools in a less pressured environment than the city, but for various reasons we aren't really in a position to move, so reverse commuting out to Surrey or whatever would make DS's day a bit long... so I think we'll have to stick to the London independents and hope we do get an offer from someone! I'm realising that taking the stress out of this "interests" thing, for me, is all about recognising that he's not meant to be expert at 9 (as one poster says above). Doh. Fortunately, I think my son's brighter than I am.

Headteacher isn't very helpful - not intentionally, but he's the head of a inner city state primary and just doesn't pretend to know about the independents as very few kids go on to independents from the school. All the competitiveness and talk is about how to get into the better faith secondaries (which because of my faith status is unlikely to be an option for us) so school-gate mums' network stuff is a bit limited.
Ooh, it's late... tomorrow's another day!

And as a footnote - we can commute out from Victoria, though I'm not keen to land him with really excessive travel - boarding's out, as we can't meet the fees! But if anyone's got any knowledge of any school beyond the typical central London schools and Whitgift in Croydon, which we're looking at, do feel free to mention - I've pored over the GSG till I'm blue in the face, but , nothing is a substitute for personal knowledge of a school!

Why don't you visit some schools and then you can perhaps get a better feel for whether you want to travel.

St Dunstans Catford? You can catch the train from Victoria (least you used to able to) its almost next to the station friends have children there and they really like it a very happy atmostphere and apparently a broader intake. Colfes in Lee I understand is fairly near to a station we know families there they seem happy.

I think what they are looking for in kids who play instruments/do sports/have a random hobby is the type of kid who will join in and be prepared to be part of the collective experience of school (life?) rather than the kids who always do the bare minimum at school and may think that wondering round the streets in a bone fide teenage pasttime.

Nonomum, I think you have expressed it perfectly!

I also agree with NonnoMum re instruments. If your child plays an unusual instrument then they can be of as much interest to schools as a really good violin or piano player.

Schools are always looking for violas, bassoons and lower brass like tubas. My DS sounds very like yours (especially the Lego!) and was on the waiting list for a top school for over two years; I'm sure that the fact he plays an 'endangered' instrument gave him the edge over other boys on the list, and that won him the place.

OP where are you in London? There are some brilliant independent schools round here (SW London?Surrey borders) who love exactly the kind of child you are describing and get the best from them. Reeds, City of London Freemans, Claremont etc.

Both my DSs are at Trinity in Croydon. Neither have any musical ability or exceptional sports skills or any sort of special interest. they both got in by passing the exam and "winning" at interview.