A2 Further Maths - no of hours teaching per week?

[JustGettingByMum]

DS is taking A2 FM, he has come home from school on Friday and told us that because of time tabling clashes, they are only being offered 2 hours FM pw. All the other subjects are 5 hrs pw

Firstly, I think it sounds impossible to cover the whole syllabus (3 topics) in this time. What do you think? Maybe it is doable?

Secondly, I want to contact the school on Monday to discuss this further.
If your dc is/was doing FM, would you be kind and ask them how many hours teaching they get, and how many are in the class?
Even better if you are a maths teacher and can advise!

For DS 1- 8 students, 4 hrs teaching pw

For DS 2 - 4 students, 2 hrs teaching pw

Thanks for your help x

DD2 did Maths and Further maths for A level and had 5 hours per week for both of them over the two years. If anything she could have managed with less Maths time rather than less Further Maths hours, she was able to pick up the Maths stuff quite easily but needed more time on the later Further Maths modules. If the two are taught together in a smaller amount of time by schools its the Maths content that is whizzed through rather than the FM.

Some of the A2 Further Maths modules such as Mechanics 3 looked horrible to me - not the sort of thing you should try and teach yourself. DD2 is a good mathematician who is about to start her second year studying Maths at university and she would have found it difficult to have so few teaching hours for Further Maths.

@ mordion
""If you can't do it in 2 hours you won't be able to do it in 5.""
""It seems like you don't want the encouragement of knowing that 2 hours a week is just fine""

Where is the encouragement??????

Why is it that you think an additional 12 hours per month teaching time will not affect DS ability to deal effectively with the syllabus. Do you really rate teachers so poorly!

No, I've done further maths A level. I'm far from the only person on this thread saying it's fine to do it with that amount of timetable time (obviously there needs to be personal study too - doing questions, really). IME maths teachers are brilliant at teaching but they can't get blood out of a stone (hence the fact that everyone doesn't do great at GCSE). Most people doing A level do very well, this is because maths teachers are great and the kids know what they are doing (self selecting sample). It's a really good combination. But there is a reason why many universities only consider FM a 4th A level.

Why do you think your DS won't be able to manage, if his school - who should be the experts - think it's fine?

Its a myth that lots of universities only accept Further Maths as a 4th A level - I think its only medical schools that specify this. There was a long thread about it awhile ago.

The universities that ds is applying to regard it as a 3rd A level, and indeed say they will lower their offer from A*AA to AAA on the basis of FM.

DS1 sat FM A level (last summer June 2011) and did so from the same school on the basis of 4 hours pw. My concern is how this years students can achieve the same results on the basis of 2 hours pw. All 4 students are studying 4 A2s and so the time available for self study is reduced. Teaching yourself the syllabus will obviously be more time intensive than having someone teach you.

My son did further Maths and had five hours a week with only two in the class. He did the "single Maths A level in Y12 and FM in Y13. He also could declare his grade on his UCAS form for a Maths degree!

Ok have taken a metaphorical chill pill.

The results are:
Knowabit & NobleGiraffe & FaxthatPam - full option timetabled for FM
Mrs HP & Waffling On - 4 hours
AMothersPalce & Bruffin & SecretSquirrels - 5 hours/sessions
MNistoo.. - 4 hours pw (inc twilight sessions where nec)

(on an aside, 1 of the 2 sessions DS will get is an after school twilight lesson, so not even able to find 2 hours during the school week)

Webwiz & Milliways - 1 option block for both subjects
PrettyDaisies - 1.5 hrs pw
Kenny & Noble - did on their own a long time ago
MordionIf-you-can't-do-it-in-2-hours-you-won't-be-able-to-do-it-in- 5Agenos.- 2 hours pw

So those with students currently or recently taking FM

9 responses of 4+ sessions pw
3 responses of

My DS is at a top university (UCL) and he took three A-levels - Maths, Further Maths and Physics. They very much considered FM on the same level as the other two.

Is there such a thing as a fourth A-level? Which English universities stipulate four in their offers? Aren't apparent rejections of FM because they actively want good grades in the other subjects?

JustGettingByMum
Apologies I had it wrong. DS's lessons are 50 minutes not 1 hour.
DS is at a none selective 6th form college. They are not allowed to do FM without Maths. Those doing Maths and FM are taught together with 10 lessons a week. They have different Maths teachers for some of the lessons. At the moment he is doing mechanics in FM and core 1 (whatever that is), in Maths.
When we visited the college they told he would do Maths in Year 12 and FM in year 13 but it doesn't seem to be working out that way.
He is also doing three sciences so has 5 x blocks of 5 sessions lesson time a week.

Sorry if I've been confusing but DD2 was a full option block timetabled for FM ie 5 hours per week for Maths and 5 for Further Maths - so you have slightly more than 75% in your survey. DD2 also got lower university offers on the basis of having FM.

I've found this very interesting. Many years ago when I did maths we were taught 5hrs for maths and 5 hrs for further maths. I was quite surprised by the amount of teaching that my daughter is having (the lack of!).
She actually has 5hrs and 50 minutes per week of maths. This compares with 4 hrs and 40 minutes for physics! No wonder she is spending hours at the weekend doing maths.
She is at a selective school.

Thanks for the updates!
Secret - I can keep you in the 4+ sessions pw
Webwiz - I "knew" your DD was fab at maths, but am relieved she had more sessions than I thought. welcome to the 4+ group
PrettyDaisies -

So revised figures are:
10 @ 4+ ~ 83%
2 @

Just for your records my DS was at the local state 6th form - quite a good one and very good for maths. He got lower offers as doing FM, and has found it v useful at uni doing History & Economics.

Good luck with the email, would be very interested to hear their response.

at ds's school it is treated as a normal option with 5 hrs 20 min per week.Although i think there are 1 or 2 pupils doing at home

at my ds & dd's college they get 4.5 hours for each AS and the same for A'levels - that includes FM