Sensible or an over-reaction to move DD to private school?

[adeucalione]

DD is 12 and at the end of Y8 at an Ofsted-outstanding state school.

She seems to be doing well, in terms of effort an achievement, and has a nice group of friends, but I am getting increasingly irritated by an accumulation of what I suppose are quite minor things when taken separately.

For example - has had five different maths teachers this year, has watched DVDs in every science lesson for the past few weeks (succession of supply teachers), has to put up with disruption from those children who would rather not be there (swearing, name calling, spit balls etc). Today she came home and said that they had another supply teacher for art and one boy had a bit of a meltdown resulting in him throwing a chair at another boy.

The school only set for maths and MFL, so she will be in mixed ability classes until she leaves so there is no expectation that any of this will change.

In fairness, she suffered a bit of bullying last year and they dealt with it really well so there are also things that I am happy with.

I think she might end up with the same set of GCSEs if I move her to our local independent school but have a nicer time getting there iyswim? It's quite well regarded (top 50 I think) and we could afford it.

Has it gone downhill? I can't see why it has a good Ofsted. Have you made an appointment with the Head to discuss your (quite major) concerns? Have you discussed it with your DD? Have you visited the proposed school?

Coconutty - yes she is happy at her current school although this doesn't stop her grumbling about certain aspects of it! When I mentioned the prospect of moving schools she was initially alarmed at the thought of leaving her friendship group, but then said that she would like to at least look at the other school so that she could make a comparison (we haven't looked at it yet).

Exotic fruits - it had an inspection in 2011 so presumably this is what an outstanding school looks like, makes me wonder what other schools are like! I haven't made an appointment because I can't see the point - they have recently achieved outstanding status, and the school is popular and oversubscribed, so I feel that they will not take me seriously. Maybe I really am being too picky and this is the sort of crap pupils have to endure nowadays.

If you can afford it, move her. This is one of the main reasons why our children are in private schools.

They really don't have to endure it! Goodness knows how they got outstanding! If you are not going to see the Head and call them to account I would move her.

My parents went through exactly same thing with me and I did move (about the same age) to a small v.academic girls school. Literally best thing that ever happened to me!

Not saying it was a bed of roses from day one, (teenagers are teenagers after all) but the quality of teaching, smaller classes, higher standards & expectations made a huge difference to school experience. If she's bright she will thrive I think.

Also, if you can afford it, isn't education a better way to spend money than most things like foreign holidays etc etc? Not intended as a guilt trip! Just it's the conclusion my parents came to.

This is a good example of why you should never go by Ofsted-use it as a rough guide only and see the school on a normal working day and ask questions. Not setting, for all but a few subjects, would have ruled it out for me.
I have always phoned up if there is any disruption and got them to do something about it.

If you can afford it, and you and her like it, and she can get in, then move her.
I don't like the sound of the present school. Have you had an apology about the lack of Maths teacher?

But go and look with an open mind. Don't rely on labels like "Outstanding" or "top 50". What is the school like? How will your DD fit in.

Interesting thought. She needs to make this choice though. I'd also worry that a really excellent fee paying school shouldn't have many vacancies outside the main admission age - if they can just take her at the drop of a hat I'd ask careful questions- are they just pushing class numbers up to take her- if so what is stopping them just pushing them up and up (there isn't a restriction I don't think). If you are expecting a class of 20/25 and and she is the 26th- what is the risk it'll be 30 in a year or so (and loose some of the fee paying school advantage??)

Finance wise, move her now and you are committed to paying to 18. Be sure that is OK.

Take all the extras into account when planning- kits, trips etc too .

There is a recession-people are having to take DCs away from private schools-however much they like them-so there may well be spaces.

Thanks everyone, I think I'll make an appointment to have a look around the private school and then we can make an informed decision.

I don't know how her current school got 'outstanding' but I assume that their behaviour policy must be rigorous and enforced in order to get it. In their defence, much of the low level stuff will go unnoticed (by staff) and unreported by children afraid to be seen as a snitch. DD says that incidents such as the chair throwing are always dealt with, but only after 10mins of the lesson has been lost. I suppose that they have no control over their intake and can only deal with situations when they arise...oh now it sounds like I'm making excuses for them.

The only explanation for the maths situation is that they are struggling to recruit the right candidate, although I suppose that other classes/sets/year groups will be unaffected and doing really well for all I know.

Maybe I'll pluck up the courage to see the Head and tell him all of this.

Sorry but my DC go to an "Outstanding" state school, but its that good because: it deals with the small stuff quickly and firmly, it does set for most subjects (but gradually, eg. only Maths in year 7, mainly just Maths and Science in year 8).
It can be hard to recruit, we struggle here because the cost of living is so high, but there are ways around it (Overseas teachers, training your own, encouraging mobility between departments).

If you can afford it, and she likes it, definitely move her.

Our Ofsted outstanding school (state secondary) has the same problems with behaviour although kids are streamed which helps in some sets. My dds best friend has jsut finished year 7 here and the differences in what they are learning is marked.

Alarm bells for me would be no proper setting.
Disaster in English I would have thought!!!

And chairs being thrown .

Have alook round the private school with DD. See what she thinks. Don't worry if they have spaces, there is always movement, especially at the end of year 8, as year 9 is the entry year at many public schools.

And I wouldn't let the thought that her results will be the same anywhere sway you. That is so not the point.

The small stuff is important-not to be ignored.

In private schools you do tend to get a fair bit of movement, often families who can afford the fees move around because of jovbs, sometimes overseas. I work in a prep school but in the course of this year we have gained abotu 12 children 'in year' either because of being unhappy with the previous school or moving into the area for Dad's job.
As to year groups becoming large, sometimes it can really help having that extra child who then can push the numbers enough to get an extra class and therefore smaller class sizes, we are splitting one year group next year into 3 not 2 because we've had a few extra children join part-way through the year.

It's very unusual to have an Ofsted outstanding school that doesn't set core curriculum subjects.

If you can afford to, I'd move her. On another thread someone said they were paying not for results but for the attitude of fellow pupils and expectations of staff. So well put. She probably will do well in exams wherever she is, but it's not about that. It's about fostering her in a secure environment where learning is expected, respected and appreciated. Endless streams of supply teachers and chair throwing peers can't offer that, however bright she is.

No wonder you get an endless stream of supply teachers-they don't go back if chairs are thrown! If you want good, regular, supply teachers you have to have a well run school with a clear discipline policy.

I was at school years ago. Never experienced chair throwing. Dont altogether trust Ofsted reports.

I was at school years ago. Experienced plenty of chair throwing and plenty of behavior that made the teachers break down and cry in the classroom. For three years solid during exam work up.

I'm not sure what that has to do with the op, though, patter cakes?

If you have a DC at a school where chairs are thrown (apart from an odd incident) I would move the DC -if you can.

I would move your DC. It's a no brainer, agree with racingheart.

We moved our DS out of outstanding state school in Year 7 for very similar reasons - were increasingly unhappy with things like setting/behaviour so went to see local independent school and moved him days afterwards . I can honestly say it is the best thing we ever did, he has benefited hugely from small class sizes and just not getting lost amongst the angels and the devils. If your daughter is happy to move and you can afford it, I would seriously consider it.