14 year old given up on school

[otpot]

what do you do when your child has just given up?? Sanctions, grounding etc do not work. Our eldest has decided she is just useless at everything and is no longer trying. She now hates school and will not try- consequently falling further behind with work and assignments, exacerbating the problem. The school is not being particularly helpful despite frequent phone calls and emails. No one seems to have noticed that this A/B pupil is now getting C, E and U's. Other than school she is utterly delightful, funny and kind. How on earth can we get her back on track before it is too late?

Is she in year 9 or 10? If in year 9 I would possibly see if moving schools were an option before year 10 starts into a hopefully more supportive environment. Even if that's not a possibility I would request a meeting with her head of year straight away to discuss this and see what strategies they can suggest.

thanks, she is year 9 but to be honest, the discussions I have had with the head of learning are not wildly helpful. Along the lines of "at her age she should be organised enough not to be falling behind with work" (she is very disorganised which we all acknowledge, but cannot get around), or putting her on report and endless detentions which make her hate school even more and determined not to try at all to spite the head of year. All my writing in her journal regarding lack of homework has not been noticed as the proper form tutor left in the autumn and there has been a succession of stand ins since then. She is pretty well behaved so is falling below the radar and dropping like a stone. Changing schools - hmm not really an option in south east london. I have called deputy head who is very nice, but has not really taken on board my concerns.

Could there be any underlying SEN issues? Does she struggle with reading, spelling, numbers or writing? Has she suffered with stress in the classroom in the past and is switching off to cope? Does she have coordination problems? Or bullying? Is she sleeping well?

I'm not saying it is anything SEN related but SEN issues left undiagnosed often lead to refuser type behaviour and it is one (however small) possibility, worth thinking through.

Only popping in to say I sympathise massively as I am currently going through this with my 14 yo DS. it is an absolute nightmare, every single morning having these discussions yelling matches before I need to leave for work. MY DD went through a similar patch when she was 14 and did just wake up one morning and decide that she wanted to go (is fine now, was just a patch)

The difference being that our school (also SE London) is very supportive, offering advice etc (doesn't really help me get a 14 year old as tall as me out of bed in the morning and when he cries, my heart breaks. ) Part of my DSs problem is that he does not react well to the current climate of strict rules/regulations/decrees of the academy status that the school has recently embraced. Has your DD been bullied? does she feels as if she doesn't 'fit it?'

Practical possibilities - stop sanctioning - praise good behaviour/attendance. do some mathsy/english based board games and be enthusiastic when she gets things right - hopefully this will result in not thinking she is 'rubbish' at everything. Agree that a sustained effort for x amount of weeks will result in 'y' treat ( I am finding this difficult as DS2 (12) is delightful, not an ounce of trouble. DS1 acts up, hopefully reforms and then gets rewarded. hardly fair)

finally, if the school is ignoring you, phone the heads PA for an appointment. go to the top. You do need them on side on this, they cannot be allowed to give up on DD

thanks for all the encouragement!! DD is absolutely useless at maths and has given up (we are trying to work thro the KS3 workbook at home to try and identify particular problem areas). She was fantastic at English - top of the class and the teachers raved about her. She is now utterly despondent - her fabulous English teacher has left and a series of supply teachers have meant she has now drifted and dropped. She is now convinced she peaked early and is now falling behind everyone else. She has completely lost her mojo and is convinced she is not 'academic'. We have praised the good stuff but it is getting harder to do so as she is not trying at anything. She goes to school no problem (all her friends are there) but she is not applying herself in anyway. There was a period of feeling that she didn't fit in and low level rejection however she seems to have come through that and seems to be happy and sociable. Getting cross about it makes the whole household atmosphere dreadful and upsets DS, we are wondering is it a phase they all go thro and she will come out the other end? Do we come down hard and upset the whole household or do we take a more laid back approach? just wondering if anyone has been thro this and come out the other side with their sanity!
hmm.

Have you tried talking about what she might want to do after school? If she is switched off school maybe get look at what is on offer at FE colleges and discuss what she might want to do. If she can see what she wants to aim for, encourage her to draw up a plan to get there. If it is her plan (or at least she thinks it is), then it might help to get her focused.

In my experience, encouragement and support work better than confrontation, even if it means that she might achieve what you think she is capable of. The bottom line is you can't make her work, so in the end you will have to accept what she decides to do.

otpot - dont give up on her, it is never too late. I know many people who really struggled with the whole school thing but came good later. In the grand scheme of things it wont really matter.

Are there any out of school activities she could join? Anything which could help her to start enjoying things again? This could be music/sport/drama/cadets, anything which she can do well at for its own sake.

I think your comment that she has lost her mojo is telling.

thank you everyone for your encouragement and support = you have no idea how helpful these are!! Yes have tried to encourage her do something out of school - to have her own "thing" however and for a while it seemed to work, however now she has lost enthusiasm for that as well and cannot be bothered (I have had to really make her go - we have given up this term as to be honest, I don't feel happy spending alot of money on something she is not going to) All she wants to do is tootle on the computer. She gave me a long speech about how she has given up on school and its not worth bothering anyway and she will drop out as soon as she can. I have tried to talk about what she wants to do, but everything she has suggested needs qualifications and when we have looked at what she needs, she just says that oh well, she will do something else then - rather than be spurred on to try which is what I was hoping. I think we might have to give up on this academic year and hope that she grows up a bit over the summer to understand cause and effect. I really am floundering with this as I feel a complete failure as a mother!!

I feel for you and your DD, otpot.

We also live in SE London - why do you think changing schools is not an option? It's a pretty mobile area with people moving in and out, which ought to mean there are places for in-year admissions. All the temporary teachers sound a bit of a red flag to me, though of course there could be reasons other than people not wanting to work there (DD has been missing a teacher in one subject for most of the year as the HoD was off sick and they had to prioritise the exam years).

Also do you believe your DD is right about not being academic? There are vocational options available from Y9 at places like Lewisham College that could enable her to get qualifications for a job. They also have less of a 'school' environment, which can really help young people who have become disengaged from school.

I think sometimes we focus too much on our children having 'one shot' at GCSEs. Of course it's administratively easier for them to do their exams when they don't have to support themselves as well, but it's not impossible to make it up later in life and I often think university is wasted on the young.

I'm glad it sounds as if she is otherwise quite happy. I hope you find a path through this that works for everyone.

I think Creamteas's advice is spot on.

We have a local sixth form College with over 2000 kids which has courses to suit everyone. Do you have something similar near you? Perhaps you could visit or at least get a prospectus. This would show your daughter that there are lots of options available and that not being super academic is not a problem.

I would try not to get cross with her, ultimately it is her decision and it would be very hard to force her to go the extra mile. As long as she is doing what she is asked to do, ie homework then I would not worry too much for the time being. Disorganised and a little immature sums up a lot of the teenagers I know.

The fact that your 14year old is otherwise a delightful, funny and kind girl shows that you have done something right.

thank you all. I must admit I feel a little less hysterical now!! I am going to take a chill pill and quietly continue to encourage as much as possible.
many thanks for your wise words, and ideas about looking at other types of education.

Slightly off topic but I'd put a very occasional hand written tiny scrap of paper under her pillow or at the top of her t-shirt drawer with a few little positive words of support and encouragement signed by you with a big kiss. Put them where no one else will have a chance to see them so they are private and won't embarrass her. They don't need to be too cheesey just things like 'hang in there' or 'keep smiling'. Keep them infrequent one or two a week max would be enough but never mention them. Sometimes even at 14 some unxpected reassurance goes along way.

love it!!

Hi
I'd sympathise with her, without letting her continue to slide.
Talk it over with her, especially about how her being good at English is not dependent on having a good teacher but is a core (and very much in demand) talent she needs to nurture. There's a serious shortage of good commercial writers out here and we get paid a small fortune. She could be one. Being good at English is a pass into some of the best professions out there, from advertising to parliamentary speechwriting, campaigning, law, theatre and publishing.

Get her to set her own targets in core subjects and work out how to reach them, regardless of who is teaching her. As Creamtea said, get her to start taking interest in her future. Maybe visit some sixth form colleges or even some lovely university towns so she has something in mind to aim for to make it all worthwhile. Encourage her to look around at after school activities that develop her core skills. Once she realises it's up to her, not school, to make the best of what she can be and do, she'll get her drive back. It's horrible to be at a chaotic, demoralising school, but it doesn't have to hold her back.

Lots of bright people are disorganised. It's normal but she can overcome it enough to stop it making her grades slip. Can you help her get organised by encouraging her to set up reminders on her phone at 7.30 am to remind her what to bring in to school from home and at 3.30pm to remember what to bring back from school so she has what she needs for homework. She can even do a reminder each break time if she needs one, to help her remember if she has any lunchtime clubs or meetings. You could get her an organiser bag so everything has its place etc.

She sound slovely and so do you. Hope she gets her drive back soon.

thank you so much racingheart - some great ideas there for me to get going with. I think I was panicking so much I was losing the plot!!
brilliant thank you

This is a difficult age to be. Lots of kids are unhappy and confused about their purpose in life. They also get burned out in their journey through school. My very bright son was having problems at this age, and he ended up homeschooling for the first term of year 10. He studied a bit, travelled to visit family friends, and volunteered in several organisations. He went back (to a different school), was much happier and ended up with all A*s, despite missing 4 months of year 10.
The break from school gave him perspective, appreciation for school, and a sense that he was in charge of his own life. He went from being quite withdrawn and unhappy, to being lively and open again.

Hi,
I am new to mumsnet so apologies if this is not the way to start a new question!
My son is 13 years and is due to start Year 10 in September
He has never really been happy at his boys school but he and I have been reluctant to change as he has really good friends,does well academically and he has never been really unhappy with any aspect of the school.
He is now adamant he wants to change schools as he dislikes many things mainly teachers ( the way they teach ) some activities the school makes them do,singing,meditation and he hates that there are no girls !
He is a happy boy and has many friends but I know he has never been truly happy or settled at his school and with their style of teaching but I am scared to approach schools as I am worried he won't settle there either.Also I am pretty sure no private school will take someone in the midst of their GCSES starting.
Any advice?

i also totally sympathize my 15 year old stopped attending school in yr 10 having been the perfect pupil we swapped schools and within a matter of months she refused to go there too i find it heartbreaking and find myself feeling very angry with her to just feeling desperatley sad with and for her i feel i can no longer go through the same heartbreak every day and now feel our only way forward is to home educate but she is now at the end of year 10 how scary has anyone out there had any experience of home ed from year 10/11 really i would not concider this if the situation were not so desperate but .... it is

Very interesting and sad. I am just in the process of deregistering my bright, switched off 14 yr old DD from a school in SE London. She was fragile anyway but it has been massively added to by the churn in staff, and consequent loss of excellent teachers with whom she had strong relationships. We battled all year and it just got worse and worse. She has been asking all year to go to Interhigh and I said I'd consider it if we reached the end of the year with her still unhappy. Here we are and she is profoundly unhappy so I am taking the decision to go with her wish and we're now gearing up for IGCSEs at Interhigh and will work over the summer on setting up a programme of complementary activities. It feels like a fairly big risk but maybe less so than to watch her keep on sliding. Will watch this thread with interest.

nelsbells and burmac - what went wrong? Especially if they were both bright and thriving at one point. Was the school not supportive and encouraging? Was it too big? Lessons too disrupted or dull?
Good luck with HE. If you find local HE groups I'm sure they'll reassure you on how to approach yr 10 and beyond.

Too many disrupted lessons and uninspiring teachers - she has had plenty of inspiring teachers at various stages but this year has been bad. I found a note she wrote in her science book about being made to sit there copying out power points all the time, the class so bored they won't settle and take 15 minutes to write the learning objective, stream of kids arriving late etc etc. we had a stack of books arrive for the IGCSE courses yesterday and it's lovely watching her start to believe that we really are trying another approach

burmac, sound slike you're doing the rigth thing. I hear stories like this so often, it makes me seethe. What a waste of time, opportunities and resources.

well what a turnaround. I have suddenly got a rather more switched on child. I have been taking note of the suggestion made, lots of encouragement, talking about longer term goals. Also, I managed to make contact with a very receptive and supportive key member of staff so I do feel that a quiet 'eye' is going to be kept on things. (previous contact with head of year was not at all constructive). What seems to have really been key was one inspiring member of staff who has somehow hooked my daughter (and her friends) into really thinking about their potential and getting them excited about the future and their life choices. I am so hugely relieved and pleased that there seems to be some glimmer of hope out of this.

Burmac and Nelsbels, I am sorry to hear that you had to resort to pulling your DD and DS out of school but I will be really interested to see how it goes - I had not heard of interhigh before so will watch this with interest.

thanks again for all the support, I am not sure how long this enthusiasm will last but I am just hugely glad that it is not just one vertical drop from now on.

Otpot : It sounds as though you've enigineered an 'energy' surge. Take a pat on the back. x

Otpot, that's a wonderful result, and so good of you to take time to post it. I think it shows that children who hate school can be turned round, and quite quickly too, if they are properly supported and encouraged, and treated as though they are capable of seeing beyond their current dissatisfaction.