11+

[11PlusParent]

Don't know how much interest there is in the 11+, but I'm working on an idea how a parent can prepare their child for the 11+ without the need to recruit expensive private tuition.
We went through the process two years ago and couldn't afford help, we knew without some good advice it would be a little tricky.
In all honesty I found it a fairly horrible experience in terms of parents not openly discussing how they were approaching it, but is understanderble as competition is tough.
We just wanted a healthy balanced approach that set a sustainable pace for our daughter to develop her own study routine.
Please get in touch if anyone has any feedback, thanks

There are a few websites already which specialise in supporting parents through 11+. When the question about preparation are asked here, the advice is always a) visit one such website and b) use (specified) revision guides.

I am surprised you went through 11+ as recently as two years ago and hadn't noticed those websites. Perhaps that's the place to start your market research?

Know what you mean and think it can cause issues when some children get in and others don't. Our DS was lucky enough to pass all three he took and got offers from two out of three. However, have noticed a distinct 'chilling' in relations with some parents since he got a place and their children didn't....

And there have been some very disappointed children who didn't get into grammar schools and haven't really coped well with the outcome .

Yes, we were quite open about what we did and didn't do and have been hopefully helpful and available to the current Year 5 parents in helping them with advice and decision making (but only if they've solicited help).

But it does all become rather cloak and dagger and where we live can't help but feel that some parents, because of the whole competitive nature of the 11+ exams, actually get sucked into the whole thing when their DCs aren't really very likely to pass- and that creates bad humour, disappointment and resentment all round.

Well, I am very impressed if your daughter is self-motivating to study for the 11+. DS was very keen to apply to grammar schools but nearly as motivated about doing the study.... He had a very laid-back approach (verging on the lazy to be quite honest!) to practising but it was obviously good enough...

We started with the NVR and VR - because they were new to him - and then expanded as and when, adding maths and English stuff, when we felt he had a handle on the first two disciplines. We didn't have a timetable as such. Just progressed gradually over the course of six months. Didn't really do more than about 10 - 20 minutes of an evening and not more than about 30 minutes at the weekend. We started on the 9-10 Bond books and then quickly progressed upwards and were doing 11-12 age-group in all disciplines during the summer hols before Yr 6. Also, in the few weeks leading up to the 11+ exams we expanded repertoire to include more varied stuff found online.

It is worth pointing out that DS doesn't like literacy at all and we had some doubts as to whether he would meet the required standard. He obviously performed less well in the 11+ that was purely maths/English (because although he had passed he obviously wasn't close enough to be offered a place even from the waiting list) than he did in the ones which included either a NVR/VR element too.

Hope that helps and good luck. So glad this is all behind us and we have a few more years before we have to worry about DD!

Thanks meditrina, yes had spotted the relevant sites, but it concerned me how much cramming seemed to be done for the exam and the pressure on intensive testing.
When we started looking we had it completely in mind that any help we gave was in supporting her education in a more sustainable fashion. But also I wanted to keep her interested, make it more active, and not be a slave to 11+ workbooks.
With three kids the last thing I wanted was nagging them into their secondary years to do their homework, so if there was something I could do during 11+ prep to build in better study skills I considered it would give me more time for me in my forties!

Hi gazzalw, funny that how they really want to do it, yet sometimes becomes a battle. The other thing I had in mind when supporting DD was what were the learning curves for her brothers. In essence are there any behaviours or routines I could be doing now to support their education towards the 11+ if they decide they want to do it in when its their time to make it a more fluid process. I'm sure this is something you're aware of for next time around.

Thanks for feedback :)

Well I guess the thing to do is to get them doing practice papers and to see them as fun rather than learning/work.

Or to do them as a competitive thing with siblings/parents to show them quite how clever they are ;-). I sometimes think a bit of healthy competition works, particularly for boys.... I think that is what motivated DS really - quite a few of his classmates did the 11+ exams too and he was keen to outdo them!

I have to say that I too was horrified a the levels of cramming that some parents undertake for the 11+ exams, particularly for Tiffin. DS didn't do the Tiffin exam but the only other of his classmates who did pass the other three, did Tiffin too (with a tutor) and didn't get anywhere near a high enough mark to get a place even from the waiting list. And he is a very bright boy....

I think having only just concluded this process for DS, haven't even started to consider our approach for DD, although she was much more receptive to doing the VR/NVR than her brother when he was practising!

11PlusParent,

If I had my time again, I know I would do things very differently.......

I think that the way things are moving, the days of the VR/NVR only type test are numbered and the tests are moving back towards focusing on curriculum based subjects - English and Maths. That's not to say that reasoning won't form part of the tests at all, but it does seem that other elements (certainly in SW London grammars) are becoming of more importance.

Based on that, I would encourage anyone with young children to just stay much more on top of school work from a much earlier age. No I'm not talking about hothousing children from birth - before someone says it - but more about ensuring reading, spelling, basic maths, grammar etc are all at the level they are supposed to be at the relevant age. Don't necessarily be happy with being told that your children are doing fine and leave it at that.

I know that someone will come on and say that childhood should be just that, and not spent doing extra work, and I do agree wholeheartedly. However, if your child attends a pretty standard state primary school, then the lack of homework (we average 20 minutes a week) means that school life doesn't impact particularly on leisure time. There is still plenty of time to do extra curricular stuff, dig mud castles, play on the Wii but also to do a little more reading, timestables etc than you would necessarily do. I'm all for the drip drip approach, and think it would be soooooo much easier for everyone concerned just to have awareness at an earlier age of what is required at 11 plus, so there is less need for cramming later. And if your child ends up not realistically being academic enough for selective schools, then the work you will have done won't be wasted and your child will hopefully barely have noticed that they were doing anything anyway!

IMO, if your DC needs a lot of coaching to get into a school, then maybe it isn't the right school for her/him.

But, as most children trying for the tests seem to have some kind of coaching, if yours are not familiar with the types of tests used, then you put them at a disadvantage.

For DD1, who is now at a superselective grammar we found practise tests on a website called Elevenplusexams

There are some free papers, and many that you can pay to download, as well as paper books you can buy. My DD found some books from an organisation called Learning Together to be the most useful, as they break down the kind of problems that you can expect to come across, so you can work up from the simplest of a "type" up to the most difficult. But we didn't test everything available, of course!

We concentrated mostly on VR and NVR, as these were the tests needed for our first choice school. We did very little on maths, as I thought she was probably doing enough at school (she was in a group working on the Y7 syllabus). But for our second and lower choice schools, she needed maths, and she did not perform anywhere near as well for maths as for the other two. However, it is my belief that this is because her strengths are in other areas, and not that we should have done more "coaching".

I can't remember precisely, but I know she did about one practise test each day for the summer holidays before the tests, and about one or two a week for the term before that, and the part of the autumn term before she sat the tests. She was very motivated to do it, as she really wanted to get into the school.

(Then we went out to dinner to reward her for all her hard work, long before we knew whether it had paid off!)

From what I've seen, you should expect to continue to put in a similar amount of effort after entry as for the tests.

My only DC who didn't turn down a super-selective place says there are many who continue with subject tutors. Yet, despite knowing content before lessons, the tutored don't always make the top sets. This practice is no different from my other DCs at public school and local four-quartile comp which is the most over-subscribed of schools mine attend.

So I would only take on as much you're prepared to continue for seven years. The best is of course to be able to leave alone. If they can get in anywhere without any more than the instructions on the test invite, they'll be fine. If they don't, they'll also probably be fine provided you're happy with the school environment, academically and pastorally, they're in. The trouble with tutoring is what are you going to do when they get into university? Not to mention that they'll always know others are not tutored while they are. I appreciate the great pressure with getting an essential GCSE grade, but this is the 11+.

Agree with that. Grammrs are not the be-all and end-all - if your dc wants to go, because they really want to get their teeth into some demanding work, then it may well be right for them, but not all kids - even bright ones - are equally academically interested.

I think rather than last-minute coaching, you should start early - a child who reads early and has access to lots of books will need little work when older in English and can pursue thir interests in any ther topics they enjoy.

I think excellence is a habit as much as anything - if you're used to being top you'll work hard to achieve that - if you're not, your expectations and hence achievements will be lower. Soo help them when they're 4 or 5 and you won't have much to do when they're 10 or 11. That's my theory, anyway.

Thanks everyone, its really interesting to hear your views, it sounds you've all taken a very sensible approach to the 11+. And it's interesting, but not surprising that you would rather have a little and often approach to homework from day one, to avoid cramming for the big day.

As a parent I'm finding it much easier to support the 3 R's if school sets regular homework, not because I'm a pushy parent, but just because the routine at home makes it easier to settle down and get the work done for themself. Otherwise too long a gap between work set means we have to re-establish a positive approach time over, often resulting in tantrums and tears.

It's funny though, even though my daughter got through and she's doing well at quite a relaxed grammar, I still don't know whether I agree with the principle of them?

I can't help feeling that in the case of grammar school areas it really stretches the teachability of primary classes between the lowest performing and highest achieving, and that really bothers me because everyone loses out, not to mention the difficulty for teachers to manage fairly.

Anyway hope you have all had a lovely day :)