Secondary appeal

[SWStressed]

Child not offered school on CAF but former girls school turning mixed in sept with no track record with boys. Bright and very sporty child. Know you are not meant to critisise the school you were allocated but in this instance think could raise very valid criticisms, any advice from you panel members?

Thank you kensingtonia.

SchoolsNightmare, hang on in there, the acceptances have to be received about now and then at last the waiting lists will start moving, though I imagine it may be after Easter before they start re-offering places. A lot of people who go private do still apply to state schools as insurance, are you in West London?, in my experience quite a few people apply to schools and then move abroad or relocate in the months before starting. I have heard of people being offered places up to September - though obviously that is still a nightmare.

With regard to the appeal, you do not really need to show why the LA's eventual offer is no good but you have to try and build a really convincing case of why DC should go to a particular school or schools. Double check that the admissions authority have not messed up with distance or the other admissions criteria - it does happen occasionally.

SchoolsNightmare - Agree with kensingtonia.

The one thing I would add is that you mustn't let the LA ambush you with a last minute offer. There was a case reported on MN last year where a parent who had not received an offer found that the LA started the hearing by claiming that they were about to offer a place at school X. The panel took that as gospel and rejected the appeal but no such offer was ever made and it rapidly became clear that the LA had never had any intention of making the offer.

If the LA try to introduce an offer at the appeal which you haven't heard about before you should ask the chair to either adjourn the appeal to give you time to consider the offer and adjust your case as required in light of this new information, or alternatively to proceed as if the offer had not been made.

Can I just say, it is not the case in all LEAs to mention your allocated school or CAF forms. I appealed in Kent last year and it was made clear to me by the LEA that the appeal panel were independent and would have no knowledge of what was on my CAF, whether I had accepted or rejected the allocated school. Nor was it brought up at appeal by the Lea or questioned by the panel.

SchoolsNightmare - if you missed out by a fraction I would say you have a pretty reasonable chance on the waiting list. I wouldn't expect to hear just yet.

If it comes to an appeal, try not to worry too much. All the panelists I have met are nice but you have to build a really convincing case as there will be many appeals and many of them will come down to distance. You may be asked by the panel why you didn't mention the medical condition on the application - but a lot of people don't tbh - especially if you are close enough to have been allocated a place in other years. What you have to show though is why it can only be managed by going to that school and not to another one. You might want to start approaching your consultant and GP now with supporting evidence and if they are willing to support you in saying that DC must go to that particular school, all the better. Generally a letter just stating the medical condition won't be enough.

Ingles2 - I think it depends where you live. I have definitely seen copies of the CAF and correspondence to the parents offering another school as part of the papers given by the admissions authority. I think it is useful background. I don't think it is prejudicial - at least where I live - because as a panel you are looking at them in relation to the school appealed for.

I want parents to come away thinking that they have had a chance to put their case across fairly and I have given the admissions authority a hard time if warranted. I haven't come across the underhand tactics that prh47bridge describes and I sincerely hope LEAs like that are in a minority. I would definitely suggest an adjournement while they put their offer in writing in that scenario!

A question for the wise ones. The appeal form from the LA is headed "I wish to appeal against the decision not to offer my child a place at X school because....". The deadline is 28 March (on the form; 30 March on the website; good to see they are so on top of their admin ha ha) and 4 May for supporting docs.

Do I have to give my reasons at this stage? I thought I just had to notify them I was appealing. Then I have a bit longer to write my case - its a steep learning curve & I am away next week so short of time. Do the appeals panel see this form as well as what I submit to the hearing? Will it look bad if I've added extra reasons? Help me out MNers, is there a good sentence to put at the end of the appeal form saying something like "I'll add more later"?

I have some straightforward questions for the appeal school (an academy) e.g. what GCSEs they offer (not clear from prospectus or website). When I phoned last week, they wouldn't answer any questions, they just referred me to the LA (lovely, also said they would only reveal the reason why we were refused a place in the hearing which I think is b**cks). I'll email the questions so I have a record. Is it reasonable to expect they will answer by the 28 March deadline?

Also, noticed in allocated school's prospectus "We expect all students to attend school every day". Good to see they are setting their bar so high

The deadline is for the LEA's convenience in setting up and managing the appeal panels. They can't refuse to hear your appeal just because you submit your appeal (or supporting documents) late. The panel will see everything you submit. Probably the best thing is to give the outline of your appeal on the initial form - this need not be anything more than a list of bullet points, eg limited choice of GCSEs/lack of provision for x and y/not equipped to meet child's particular need for z etc etc - and then say that you will expand on this in a later statement and/or your comments to the panel. Don't, though, submit documents very late - or produce a wodge of new documents on the day - because the panel may have to adjourn to consider them, and a delay doesn't help you.

If the school is an academy then presumably it is its own admissions authority and will be arranging its own appeals (although some academies buy in the services of the LEA to do this). In any event, the school should be providing you (within reason) with any information you need to prepare your appeal.

The letter telling you that you had not got a place should have told you the reason for that. This is crucial and you must press the school/LEA, as how else can you check that the decision has been correctly made, eg distance from home to school has been measured correctly and/or your child has been placed in the right admissions category?

Do not accept their lack of help on either of these points. You could drop it into conversation that if they obstruct you in preparing your appeal and refuse reasonable requests for information you will be using that as further grounds for appeal and/or formal complaint. If, for example, they won't confirm why you were refused a place, then (in your shoes) I would be saying to the panel something on the lines of "as the school/LEA won't confirm that my child's application was dealt with in accordance with the admissions code and the school's admissions criteria, I have to assume that some mistake was made that deprived my child of a place and this is a cover-up". That on its own isn't going to win an appeal, but it puts the onus on the LEA to convince the panel that the application was properly and fairly considered and may lead the panel towards giving you the benefit of any doubt.

PanelChair thanks for that. Bullet points are much easier at this stage and all the letters from doctors etc will be rounded up in time. The letter did not give a reason for refusal though I am certain it is on distance. The person I spoke to sounded like she didn't know anything, was just put on the phone to say "go to the LA". This school gets many appeals each year so I am sure they know what they must do..... But I will press them, in writing, and keep records of it all.

No panel should take any notice in making decisions about the number of schools they expressed a preference for. Panels know that any pupil, who is either reception or year 7 will be allocated a school (as that is what is legally required by the code), even if it is miles away. So any appellant that comes to an appeal saying they did not get a school that they preferred and they must have one, will not get any sympathy or preference by the panel.

admission Loud and clear

Question for panel members: I am appealing to Oversubsribed catholic school and just wonder :How does panel members take if only one parent turns up for an appeal (second parent is not catholic), do they hold it against them and query it or one parent is sufficient for an appeal?

Thank you

The LEA in my area also seems to have confused about the deadlines, which is why I went back to the appeals code to check it out. In summary:

• if they give you a deadline for lodging yr appeal that is less than 20 school days after the notification letter they are wrong - I'd e-mail them after you submit yr appeal to confirm receipt, and to confirm that they treat yr appeal as "on time" and be very clear about the Appeals Code deadline .

-it's a good idea to meet the deadline for lodging the appeal, otherwise they are entitled to hear your appeals after the other appeals

• you do have to state reasons for appealing when you lodge yr appeal, but this can a simple statement of yr reasons - a statement of yr reasons is not the same as providing evidence for those reasons.

• You are entitled to submit further info/evidence after lodging yr appeal, but should aim to do so by the deadline provided. Do not be put off if the LEA says that you must provide a full case or full evidence at the point that you lodge yr appeal -this is baloney (and inconsistent with the Appeals Code, although this appears to have little effect on my LEA) - however, they are in their rights to set a reasonable deadline for submitting "further info" so make sure you meet that

Hope this helps.

isky - No, it will not be held against you if only one parent turns up for the appeal and it would not be questioned. It is quite normal for only one parent to turn up.

Dear prh47bridge ,admission, PanelChair and others

Thank you for all advice you have given via this forum. I feel more confident with my appeal and fingers crossed.

Please feel free to add anything else I haven't covered.

isky I second that - I have had more useful support and info (and less rumour) from MN that from LEA, primary school & parents combined. So thank you (and will let you know if our appeal was successful in May)

? Fair Admission by Catholic School?

www.lgo.org.uk/news/2012/mar/london-oratory-school-criticised-admission-appeal/

From this report it is clear that the school, the clerk to the appeal and the appeal panel all fell down on the job. This doesn't mean that there was anything wrong with the way admissions were administered but clearly there were several things wrong with the way this appeal was conducted. The response of the head to the LGO investigation was also poor. I hope they will comply with the recommendations. Thankfully most faith schools do better than this.

Dear Turniphead1,
I fully agree that non RC children are not admitted to RC schools.

I , myself catholic who spends every sunday in church (past 10 years) with kids have to appeal cause baptism was delayed due to personal circumstances would HATE to learn that non RC children gain entrance in such a schools.
Thats my opinion anyway.

Turniphead1 - If you are unhappy with the way an appeal panel conducts your appeal you are entitled to refer the matter to the Local Government Ombudsman. However, if it was an infant class size case your only chance of winning was if you could show that a mistake had been made.

isky - Non-RC children are admitted to RC schools. Indeed, some only allocate a proportion of their places on faith grounds in order to improve the chances of non-RC applicants. But equally there are some RC schools where you are unlikely to gain admission unless you meet the faith criteria.