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Original poster

Science GCSE - how much maths involved?

31 replies

wordfactory · 01/02/2012 19:29

Sorry, me again.
It has been suggested to everyone in DD's set that they should do tripple science. DD likes science and has, thus far (she's year 8) performed well.

However, by far, of all her subjects, maths is her weakest.

So, would she still be okay to do tripple science? Or would she be better off doing double science and taking another option that she would get a good grade in? Another MFL, history, or geography most likely.

OP posts:
cottonmouth · 01/02/2012 19:48

There are simple calculations throughout the Physics topics. These involve substituting numbers into simple equations (which are given on the exam paper), and then solving. They can use calculators.

In Chemistry, they may have to do more complicated problem solving, but in a more limited way (ie not in virtually every topic as in Physics).

She will not be protected from calculations by doing just double science. The triple science calculations are not any harder than the double science ones.

Dustinthewind · 01/02/2012 19:50

Being able to read graphs, scattergrams, interpreting data and the like is one area of maths that appears a lot in GCSE.

Original poster
wordfactory · 01/02/2012 19:53

Oh I didn't realise that cottonmouth.
I had assumed, wrongly I guess, that double science was easier than tripple science.
Still, if DD can't get an A* due to maths, better to get an A or B in double and add in another option where she is likely to perform well, perhaps?

OP posts:
cottonmouth · 01/02/2012 20:07

I think you should only do triple science if you are going to get A*s, personally.

Fraktal · 01/02/2012 20:15

cotton I would disagree. The disadvantage of double is that the grade is averaged. If you take triple and perform stunningly well in bio and chem but can't do the maths for physics you get AAC, for example. If you'd done the same in double you could get BB instead. I'll take the 2 As even if there's a C attached!

cottonmouth · 01/02/2012 20:21

Double grades aren't necessarily identical. You can do differently in core and additional.

But I agree there isn't a one-size-fits-all answer. You have to try to figure out what the likely grades are, and also consider doing a third science vs another subject.

If your child is bright and ambitious, they will want to get 7 A/A* grades to give them maximum chances on UCAS. A string of Bs will not do them any favors.

I think anyone with a child in Y9 or below needs to wait and see what is going to happen with Science GCSEs. I don't think schools know yet the impact of the linear qualification. Will the 'double science' be certified separately at the end of Year 10 and Year 11? Will they have to opt into separate sciences at the start of the course and sit all exams at the end of Year 11? Will there be any scope for switching up from double or down from triple?

Do any science teachers have any insight on this?

BackforGood · 01/02/2012 20:31

ds enjoys science and is doing well in it. He really doesn't like maths and has to work at it. However, does it necessary take up an option ? At ds's school, the top set science do the triple science in the same number of lessons as the next set do the double science, so, whether you take the double or triple, you still have the same number of other options available for humanities or languages, you just come out with an extra GCSE. The school offers it to all the pupils they feel will be able to work at a slightly faster pace in Science over the 2 years.

Original poster
wordfactory · 01/02/2012 20:34

backforgood that I don't know.
I had assumed that if DD did triple she would do one less GCSE than if she did double, but I don't know that.

I need to ask at parents evening no?

OP posts:
BackforGood · 01/02/2012 20:36

Best to go straight to the 'horses mouth' I find - you don't get a lot of sense if you go via what a teenager a) takes in and b) remembers ! Grin

Obviously, might be entirely different at your dd's school, just thought I'd throw it out there as it could be something like that goes on.

Original poster
wordfactory · 01/02/2012 20:36

cotton DD is a good student, bright enough, and hard working. She is in top sets for everything except maths (second set) and would be expected to get good grades.

OP posts:
GrimmaTheNome · 01/02/2012 20:38

Does your DD have any ideas about what she wants to do after GCSEs? If she's weak at maths, probably not looking at taking science much further I'd guess? In which case a different subject might be better for her.

GrimmaTheNome · 01/02/2012 20:40

You should check with the school - depending how they set/stream and manage the timetabling of options, if she didn't do triple science might she find herself put in with lower sets for other subjects too? That might be doing her a disservice.

GrimmaTheNome · 01/02/2012 20:41

( I know those two posts sound a bit contradictory - but not really, both saying get more info! Grin)

cottonmouth · 01/02/2012 20:43

I think that is quite common, TPA.

The secondary schools in my area offer only triple science to the top sets, and double to the middle ones. There is no top double set, that might contain all the dual linguists, for example.

EllenJaneisnotmyname · 01/02/2012 22:01

My DS1 is in Y9 and wants to do triple science. Maths is his strongest subject, he's very able, but he's weaker at science, still top set but only just. The DC at level 6 and above have to take a SATs style test and only the top 25 will be allowed to take triple science, in the same lesson time as double science. The test is next week and those who pass will start the GCSE syllabus after half term. The school are saying that if your child could get A or A at the triple sciences, well and good, but that AA or AA etc at double science is a better result than Bs at triple, so will put children back down to double if they aren't heading for As or As.

EllenJaneisnotmyname · 01/02/2012 22:03

That was meant to be A / A at double, blooming bold function...

Original poster
wordfactory · 02/02/2012 07:52

grimma I doubt very much she will want to do sciences at A level. More likely English, MFL etc.

OP posts:
whathaveiforgottentoday · 02/02/2012 08:03

as a science teacher, I wouldn't worry about the maths holding her back. A grade C maths student can access the maths in science. However the fact that its doubtful she will do sciences at A level suggests the double science route would be better for her.

Kez100 · 02/02/2012 08:03

We've been told the same. Double is a lot of Science anyway, so unless you are heading for A A* then stick with Double or if you really are Science mad and can't pick other subjects from the triple science option blocks.

Original poster
wordfactory · 02/02/2012 09:09

whathave thanks for yout input.
DD isn't dire at maths, will probably pull off an A or B at GCSE.
But, no, I doubt she will follow a science bent at A level.

OP posts:
startail · 07/02/2012 10:57

Cotton, triple science only if you are going to get A*
That really shows how they have degraded the GCSE grades.Sad

mummytime · 07/02/2012 11:15

My ds is doing triple, but it doesn't take any option time. He will probably get A*, A, B. Y ou don't need above c grade Maths in Science Gcse, now a'level is another matter.

cottonmouth · 07/02/2012 17:27

Not really, startrail.

In my opinion (YMMV), triple science is a lot of science for one student. They should be doing other subjects - humanities, MFL, arts.

It is not worth risking A for. It is far better to have 2A for Science/Additional rather than AAB for triple. The extra science grade isn't contributing to their broad/balanced score (or Ebacc, if you like).

Top universities are doing their first screen at the number of A (or possibly As, but they are quite quiet on this). 7 A seems to be the magic number.

Some people have the idea that triple science is better for A-level, but it really doesn't make a lot of difference. The leap to A-level is big for all candidates. There is not enough of a difference on the type of learning in the extention modules - it tends to be just some factoids that can be learnt in the student's own time.

Again, IMV, if a student is to do 2 sciences at A-level plus maths, it is better for them to have as much exposure as possible to the subjects they will never do again - so keep them going to GCSE. It would be a shame for a future scientist to give up arts/humanities/languages at 13. It doesn't really make them a great scientist to not be part of the wider world.

bulby · 07/02/2012 17:37

She'll need to be able to rearrange equations, not just substitute in numbers. Also maths will be required with higher level chemistry, for example working out relative formulae or mole calculations. I've also noticed more maths sneaking into biology using information from graphs etc. But as already mentioned that'll be on double award as well as separates. It's also a little difficult to predict how much maths in the exams until there have been more in the new spec.

GrimwigTheHeadEater · 07/02/2012 18:10

Cottonmouth - DDs school seems to manage triple science, an MFL, a tech and still have options spare for humanities and arts. Its not an either/or.

Has the content of double science been beefed up - I know that a few years ago it was widely viewed as not up to scratch for transition to A level sciences.