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Secondary education

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GCSE options help.

36 replies

domesticgodessintraining · 01/12/2011 09:36

Hello, I wonder if someone could help me. My DD is in year 9 we are now at the stage where we have to start choosing options for year 10 and GCSEs. She will most likely be put forward for the GCSE double award in mathematics and triple science exam chemistry, biology and physics. DD would also like to take geography, history, ICT, Spanish and business studies. Do you think this will be too much for her? She is a bright girl and finds all her subjects easy, because of this she does have a tendency to be lazy and often leaves revision to the last minute. Do you think the options she?s looking at will be too much?

OP posts:
Charbon · 01/12/2011 13:55

Currently the other Humanities subjects don't count towards the Ebacc, although there is pressure to include these later down the line. At the moment it is confined to History or Geography.

Offering double Maths. to the top sets is fairly standard practice. Some schools allow those students to do the traditional Maths GCSE in Y10 and Advanced Maths in Y11.

OP, I'd strongly advise your DD to pick either History or Geography. Both might be too much alongside her very academic diet, but as long as she keeps Spanish and takes one Humanity subject, I think she will be fine. It might also be worth finding out whether she will have to do Core Science as well as Triple Science and therefore a lot of science lessons in a week! Not from the perspective of dropping Triple Science as an option I must stress, but more from the perspective of trying to balance her timetable with more arts/creative options so that she doesn't get too bogged down with academia - and gets a more rounded education.

Whether your school is providing for the EB or not, luckily it is a National standard and if your DD gets A*- C in the Ebacc subjects, she will have achieved the Ebacc standard by default.

As you will have seen from this thread, some schools are working hard on their capacity to provide EB subject options to students who will benefit and can manage that academic diet, some schools have decided not to do so, or lack the capacity to offer more students the option of taking Ebacc subjects. There is understandable resistance from teachers who teach non-Ebacc subjects, because it makes their positions vulnerable if there is a low take-up rate for their subjects.

However, whatever your political beliefs, the Ebacc is very similar to the former School Certificate, or Matriculation. It is neither avante-garde nor novel to offer a broadly academic diet to students with the aptitude and ability to study those subjects. Regardless of any propaganda you might hear about Universities and Employers valuing BTECs and GCSEs in Media studies and Performing Arts as being of equal merit to qualifications in academic subjects, in an Employer's market and against a backdrop of shrinking F/E funding, it is simply not true. In some jobs and at some universities, high-grade GCSEs in academic subjects will always be more valuable. The Russell Group has in fact produced a guide where it is clear that those universities do take into account GCSE subjects/results alongside other factors in determining to whom they will offer places. UCL for example, insist on a Language GCSE for any course.

Charbon · 01/12/2011 14:02

Hugos, the Ebacc covers only 5 subjects, so it is possible for a student to take Arts subjects as part of their free choices. Although I agree with you that the Arts should be included in the Ebacc, its introduction hasn't stopped a student taking Arts subjects at all. It's caused a resources and timetabling headache for some schools to ensure that students on the Ebacc programme will still be able to select music, drama etc., but it's achievable.

mollymole · 01/12/2011 14:04

You may also wish to consider the 'value' of the subjects.
History and Geography are considered to be substantially better than courses
such as Business studies, Media Studies, Performing Arts etc, and many of the top universities do not consider them at all when 'counting back' to GCSEs
when it comes to awarding places, and some universities insist on a language GCSE.

cricketballs · 01/12/2011 19:04

just wondering all those posters who are 'down grading' business studies if you have any idea of the course content? It is a demanding subject which, coincidently is the most popular course at degree level.

Even if you don't study business into that high a standard, it give a sound basis for what ever career you enter into as it is all about the world as we live in now, why decisions are made by businesses and the effects that they have on every day life

In terms of the Ebacc - there is no such qualification! It is just a yard stick that was suddenly put on the league tables to measure schools performances with. It is classed by the vast majority as unfair to schools to suddenly 'grade them on this' as MFL has not been on the NC at KS4 for a number of years and therefore has been an option subject. Not really the way to go for ECM.....

Northernlurker · 01/12/2011 20:49

Ok well atm dd is thinking:

Triple science
Double English
Maths
A language - to be decided between the two she does
History
Art
Textiles

and something else - could be another language but we're a bit worried about the workload, could be business studies, could be imedia (which I know won't be any use uni wise but I reckon the other subjects will take care of that and the course sounds both fun and useful)

She is very bright and puts herself under a lot of pressure. I want her to do well but I also want her to develop a wide range and not be stressed to the max. It's a shame her school don't offer Economics at GCSE as I did that and really enjoyed it.

RaspberryLemonPavlova · 01/12/2011 23:11

DS has already started his triple science, and will have double English and Maths

He has 4 choices, they suggest they consider the EB and advise a language.

So he wants to do

Music
1 language
and 2 from Geography/History/Geology

This will cover the EB but is what he wants to do anyway.

senua · 01/12/2011 23:34

"In terms of the Ebacc - there is no such qualification! It is just a yard stick that was suddenly put on the league tables to measure schools performances with. It is classed by the vast majority as unfair to schools to suddenly 'grade them on this' as MFL has not been on the NC at KS4 for a number of years and therefore has been an option subject."

I don't see it as unfair. As Charbon said, it "is very similar to the former School Certificate, or Matriculation. It is neither avante-garde nor novel to offer a broadly academic diet to students with the aptitude and ability to study those subjects".
Schools are complaining because they were caught out - they were busy skewing GCSE choices to get league table positions instead of offering their students a rounded education.

gramercy · 02/12/2011 11:26

The Ebacc is just a way of seeing that a student is well-rounded. I noticed that for entrance to a high-ranking grammar school sixth form, prospective students must have a spread of top GCSE passes - it was clearly stated that maths/further maths/maths with knobs on only would not suffice.

I can't see what's wrong with it, myself. If you are hoping to go on to university then surely you are holding yourself up to be academic, in which case you should not baulk at the Ebacc. If you are more vocationally inclined then that is fine - no-one is insisting that you take the qualifying subjects.

But I think it is fair to say that if you can't manage the Ebacc (with a few provisos - perhaps RE should be included) then you are not made of the stuff which top universities want.

sashh · 03/12/2011 08:52

All any university, employer, VI form are really concerned with is 5 A*-C GCSEs including English and Maths and science - for a lot of things they don't care about the science.

IMHO she has got all the subjects she needs for just about any career so the 'left over' should be things she enjoys, they are just making up the numbers.

The only organisation bothered about the sbac is the government, colleges don't care and at teacher's conferences you will see badges saying "I failed the ebac"

cricketballs · 03/12/2011 09:24

"I failed the ebac" Grin where can I get one as I also failed the Ebacc (couldn't wait to drop french as I hated it and would not work in the subject) somehow I got good A levels and a good degree.....

The reason that so many school were 'caught on the hop' when the Ebacc was suddenly introduced as a measuring figure is that schools were concentrating on the Every Child Matters agenda (which we were told we had to) and that most teachers agree with and MFL at KS4 is an optional subject, therefore if a student didn't want to study it then so be it, schools allowed students to study subjects they enjoyed

Charbon · 03/12/2011 16:25

God help students if teachers are telling them the Ebacc doesn't matter and that it's only of concern to the government, despite the published material from universities that having a language does matter - and some 6th forms saying they won't take applicants without it. Let's hope their parents are better informed and can see why teachers have an axe to grind about it.

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