Grading both effort and achievement - what are your thoughts?

[loveyouradvice]

I heard about this from my sis, whose son at private secondary now gets marks for both effort and achievement - really useful and illuminating, especially as they spotted he was only scoring Bs on effort in his less popular subjects. I raised this with Habs Girls when I went round (DD now y5 state primary) and they said they couldnt see any point in doing this at a girls school as girls would always score top marks for effort.... What are your thoughts and experiences? Personally, thought would be great for my daughter who can tend to cruise at times.....

I think it's ridiculous.

My dcs get this and we all laugh at either 1 for effort and C for achievement ie you're trying your hardest but tough shit you're a bit rubbish

or: 3 for effort and A for achievement ie you don't need to try that hard and frankly there's no point because you can't do any better.

Stupid.

Yes, we had that at school in the 80s. I think it's great, although most of the kids cottoned on fairly quickly that it was the "achievement" part of the grade which really mattered!

My DC's private school has a 3 way split - Effort, Participation, and Achievement.

They are also prioritised (rightly so, IMO) in that order.

I like the participation one because it encourages the naturally shy ones to get more involved in class discussions etc, and stops the obnoxious show-offs more confident kids from taking over.

Habs Girls are talking out of their backsides.

Re the second part of your post - that's the callousness of youth for you! Bit like my private school educated friend telling me (aged about 12) that she didn't understand how I could expect the teachers at my (state) school to teach me properly when I wasn't paying for it .

As a teacher, you don't actually know how hard a child is trying. You can guess, but there will be times when you get it wrong. It is very nineties if you dont mind me saying!

We have this at my dd's school but I am unconvinced about the value or accuracy of effort grades. Maybe DD should have gone to Habs as she genuinely always does try hard and finds some of the effort grades infuriating and demoralising. That said the ultimate grade in her eyes is an A4 -- she's only managed an A3 so far! I'd rather have grades that are based on actual marks.

DS's school grades by effort only - drives me mad, and actually causes great upset.
DS writes slowly. I have asked for some help with his writing as I am sure he uses a very laborious letter formantion technique. Despite being v high achieving (after insisting that his teacher tell me his Yr 5 SATS scores) he was given a row of Bs for effort on Maths, his favourite subject. he was devastated and lost confidence. I asked why he got Bs for effort 'because he writes so slowly' aaargh. I agree this is down to the teacher, but 'effort' seems to be so subjectively judged.

P.S - which is not meant to say that effort isn't important - I think that recognising children's effortand application irrespective of achievement, is important. But maybe as linked to realistic improvement, rather than against an absolute standard of achievement.

Still think it's rubbish.

And subjective, and unknowable.

And unstandardised, one teacher graded according to effort, one according to effort involved in file presentation over the term!

My Dc get graded 1-4 on achievement and A-D on approach at their school (private prep but not an "up its own backside" one ). So we will get a grade in about 8 different subjects such as 2B etc (or 1/2A/B - sheesh - hedge your bets why don't you!) This starts in Y3.

I like it. As well as working out how well they are doing in pure academic terms (which is objective and measured, as they have an assessment week before half term and a parents evening straight after half term) we also get a view as to with what degree of ease or otherwise the results are achieved. I also want to know if they are trying as hard as they can (mostly child 1) or arsing around and getting away with it (child 2). Interestingly the teachers were much more approving of the one who was applying itself as the view was that children who "learn" to apply themselves and work steadily are setting themselves up well for the future.

We had this when I was at secondary school (state sector). I was quite academically able, so usually got As for achievement, and A-Bs for effort. Fair enough. But I remember to this day the teacher who gave me A for achievement (I got 100% in the end of term test) and an E for effort. It still makes me mad! How could I have done any better?!!!

Obviously being a mature adult, I can look back and see that it reflects more on her teaching ability than on me... But it still rankles!

In general, I think its a rubbish idea, how can you judge how much work goes on behind the scenes? If there are behaviour issues in class, they should be addressed straight away, not 'marked' at the end of term.

Effort is so subjective. My DS was telling me at his prep some children know how to look like they were working; they sat in the library studying as requested but in reality the Beano was under a text book others like him weren't prepared to deceive to that level. As time goes by those that are happy to pull the wool over the teachers eyes get more praise and singled out for prizes etc. even though their marks were no better than those who didn't do this. Eventually there became three unofficial groups team A who appeared hard working although they weren't necessarily the brightest or had the best marks but always got fantsatic effort marks and were always chosen to show parents round, won all the prizes, picked for teams and other occasions etc. Team B often very bright but not prepared to "crawl" around the teachers thye got OK effort marks and were rarely chosen for anything and team C again often really bright rubbish effort marks as they were rebels and never chosen for anything regardless of their ability and also blamed for any trouble.
Ultimately I suspect that this reflects many adults working experience so perhaps its good preparation for later on.

My children have always been graded for effort.

I don't think their schools are bad because of this as they all get excellent achievement and added value.

I can't believe anyone would not want to recognise effort.

I actually don't mind at all the fact that my children have only ever, and only will be, graded for achievement.

However, I also take a close interest in the achievement targets set by their schools and most of the time they are rather different to my own personal achievement targets for the children. I therefore do quite a lot of mental readjustment of the grades given by school to try to understand where the children are versus our own family standards!

I also think parents, rather than teachers, often have a more informed view of the amount of effort a child is putting into school work...

"I also think parents, rather than teachers, often have a more informed view of the amount of effort a child is putting into school work..."

Only if they are either psychic or in the classroom watching their child.

Well, soupdragon, as the stepparent of one child who never needs to spend more than a few minutes on homework and another one who spends hours on homework (and who both get great and comparable results at school) I beg to differ!

At the school I teach in, interim grades (once per term, so 6 per year) show target grade (end of year for KS3, end of KS for KS4 and KS5), current attainment, predicted grade (for KS4 and KS5) and effort mark. The reviews are cumulative as well, so in term 4, for example, a parent would receive a print out wiht the target grade, the current and predicted grades for terms 1-4 plus the effort grades for terms 1-4. It makes tracking progress very transparent.

As a head of year, I find the effort grades very informative - and use them more than the attainment grades when discussing progress with students.

I have no idea why a school wouldn't do effort grades.

Well, Bonsoir, you know how much effort they are putting into homework. What they do in the classroom is a different matter.

My DD in state secondary gets a report card with expected grade, actual grade, a mark for achievement and a mark for effort. It is really helpful. I expect her to get A for effort in everything and look at the attainment grades to see what she needs help with.

Soupdragon - they aren't required to put any effort in in the classroom though - they only need to listen and take notes and answer the occasional question!

Habs Girls ...said they couldnt see any point in doing this at a girls school as girls would always score top marks for effort..

um, isn't that because they are a selective school, and charge a lot, so all kinds of factors come into it that don't apply at the average school? I find it strange to imply that ALL girls always try their best, bollocks, really.

Thank goodness my children don't go to the same school as yours then, Bonsoir. They have to do more than listen in class - how dull and uninspiring that would be.

My dd is at a selective school, and there are loads of really bright girls there. The school is very aware that this can mean a lot of them coast- the effort grades are taken very seriously indeed -it's the attainment grades that are taken for granted!

Excellent post seeker.

They did this at my DD's school. It was very good for DD3 as while she could not get high grades for achievement she always got high grades for effort.