Setting in secondary schools

[NEScribe]

Hi,

just wondering if anyone happens to know whether setting in core subjects is still routine at start of state secondary school (Y7) or whether some schools stay with mixed ability for Y7 or indeed have a different type of banding?

thanks!

DS3's school seems to have a pretty good system.

In year 7 they are set for English and that same set stays together for Humnaities.
They are also set for Maths and the same sets are used for Science.
No setting for DT/Arts etc.

In year 8 there is some movement according to how you have performed throughout year 7.

My DSs' school sets by subject rather than streaming, from Xmas in Y7, which is just as well for my DS1, who is very good at maths, good at science but just average for English, history and RE etc. This means he is in the top set for maths, set 2 for science, 3 for history etc. Streaming children, even if there are Arts and Sciences streams is not going to work for those DC with 'spiky profiles.'

Streaming was the main thing that put me off one local school, where DC are streamed into P, Q, R or S, the same for every subject, so DC have all lessons with the same 30 or so children y7 to y9. My DS1 now has lessons with over half the DC in his year at school, lots of potential for making friends from a bigger pool of DC.

Hi TalkinPeace and NumberNine - so are you saying that your schools are the same as ours? They are set in one group - eg they will be in the top, middle or bottom group etc for all core subjects ....rather than they could be in top set for English, middle set for French and bottom set for maths etc?
That's really what I was trying to check - whether lots of schools are using our model where you would be in top, middle or bottom set for all your subjects as opposed to a higher set for something you are good at and a lower set for another subject where you struggle?
Also, hopefully I am not the only person who doesn't follow the difference between streaming and setting. School says it doesn't stream. Can someone explain the difference?
thanks again for all the replies.

Most schools I looked at set from Y7, but the school DS attends doesn't set untill Y8, when they set for English, Maths, and I think science. But then there are only "foundation" and "higher".

DD1's school SET rather than stream, though not in every subject.

By half term in yr7 they had set for English, Maths & PE.
Scoence was set from yr8.
The technologies were done in fairly random groups, slightly smaller than form groups. Everything else in form group.

So far (DD1 now yr10) no furhter subjects set, and none of the optional subjects. Those in top set science who opted NOT to take triple had to move down a set.

Suspect timetabling would be difficult to set further, as their options are not done in bands, nearly all got their choices without having to change.

NEScribe, I agree with cat64.

Setting is by ability in a particular subject. So you are in the right set for your ability in that subject.

A halfway house is grouping subjects for timetabling purposes, like setting humanities with English, science with maths etc.

Streaming is putting all the brighter kids in the top group for everything, average in the middle groups and lower ability in the bottom group. This doesn't allow for those DC who perhaps excel in maths or languages but are average at everything else. I'm sure it makes timetabling easier, but it seems a poor and lazy system to me. It does sound like your DD's school is streaming.

My DS's school sets in nearly every subject individually by Xmas Y7. Another local school has 4 streams.

An additional problem with streaming is that there tends to be much less movement between groups: it's almost as permanent as passing the 11+ and going to Grammar School.

In my school (where we set for most subjects) if an English teacher, say, has a child in their class who is obviously mis-placed, they'll have a chat with the Head of Department, have a chat with the teacher of the appropriate set up/down; and hey presto the child isn't mis-placed any more.

Streaming however is becoming more popular in schools because of the A*-C key measures and Ebacc. Schools justify this by saying what they need is all-round ability in a range of subjects, especially all core subjects.

My boys' school sets students for each subject. There is a core who are in "top sets for everything", but it's not as many as I would have expected: maybe about 10 students. This shows how important setting is as opposed to streaming, for individual appropriate teaching/learning/progress...

Ha, mumslife, I'm arguing against the EBacc for that very reason on another thread! My DS just can't get to grips with French and will fail the EBacc, but he's very good at maths and science. I don't want him 'persuaded' to do a GCSE that he will get a low grade at rather than one not in the EBacc he may excel at.

(It was me who called streaming a lazy system.)