Unreasonable Teacher.....

[Megmog2000]

Ive had a voicemail message from school today regarding DS2 who is 14 and in Year 9 regarding an incident during an english lesson. He is by no means an angel, but not a total waste of space. He is an intelligent lad when he puts his mind to it, but one subject (english) is his definate week area. He doesnt appear to enjoy the subject, but tries his best most of the time.

He has had the same teacher for the last couple of years, said teacher has never been particlarly complimentary about DS at parents evenings, to which I put down to DS not putting the effort in because he didnt enjoy it.

More recently, there have been several confrontations with this teacher, mainly as DS isnt doing his homework, classwork, messing about, which I suspect is because he has an issue with the teacher. Whilst I do not condone this behaviour and have spoken at length with DS about this, I can understand it to a certain extent.

Ive had many calls from his Year head, all relating to very minor and petty incidents during english lessons, something I would expect any decent teacher to handle as part of normal day to day teaching, I had a letter home about his "immature behaviour" (which incidentally was throwing a rubber at another child).

I had a voicemail message late this afternoon and need to call school tomorrow to find out a bit more, but I challenged DS about what happened in english today and he told me that his teacher said to him, in front of the whole class that "he was a failure, would end up in the bottom set with the SEN kids, would fail his exams and never make anything of himself". DS response was to mutter under his breath that the teacher was a bitch. He has said that the teacher didnt hear him but another child did and blabbed so DS finds himself in hot water.

Now, I only have one version of events, but on the surface of things, I am fuming that a teacher can even contemplate saying these things and humilate him infront of the entire class. This teacher appears to have had it in for DS for a long time and Im tired of it now. She was the only person at parents evening to only have negative comments without any sort of praise at all - not exactly condusive for a positive relationship.

So, the question I have - do I go into school, guns blazing and making a complaint about this teacher, or do I just accept that DS was in the wrong and let him accept the punishment (he was isolated from lessons since period 1 this morning).

My gut feeling is to make my feelings well and truely known, but I suspect the school will defent their staff. DS is due to move to the upper school in september so only has this next half term to go (he is away in paris on a school trip for one week, 3 days induction at the upper school and 2 days on other trips so not even a full half term!). I dont want to necessarily rock the boat either, my DD is in her first year there and has another 3 years to go!!

Thanks for reading - sorry for the waffle!!

[BehindLockNumberNine]

Whilst I can see that what the teacher said was not kind and not professional, I can see why she said it. You said yourself, your ds is a bright lad. But instead of applying himself he acts the clown causing teachers and HOY to phone you regularly. Your ds is 14. 14, not 4. In a few years time he will be an adult and expected to make a go of life himself. It is about time he grew up and pulled his socks up because once he is in employment he will have to work, regardless of a 'personality clash' with his boss/supervisor.

You need to side with the school. Your ds will thank you for it in years to come.

[Kez100]

Pleased this has been sorted sensibly.

[Goblinchild]

'Whilst I can see that what the teacher said was not kind and not professional, I can see why she said it.'

Really?
'"he was a failure, would end up in the bottom set with the SEN kids, would fail his exams and never make anything of himself".

You think that a valid warning to offer a disruptive and annoying child, and an accurate prediction of what the future holds for a child with additional needs?
A self-fulfilling prophecy, let's hope she never gets her revolting attitude near any responsibility for a child with SEN. Or if she does, let them have a parent who will challenge her on her stupidity and ignorance.

[Goblinchild]

Get you, smuggaroony!
I used to get two or three a week. Then the frequency tailed off slowly and with much effort and thought from all involved.
I now have to go and look up that Saki story about the girl who was so horribly good that she won medals for her goodness and allowed to walk in a special park that was only for the goodest of good children.
She was eaten by an escaped wolf, attracted by the clinking of her medals.
I love Saki.

[BehindLockNumberNine]

Yes Goblin, I think so. He needs a short sharp shock to see what he is doing with his life. If he does not take education seriously at age 14 and thinks throwing rubbers around is an acceptable past time then he should not be surprised if he finds himself floundering around without a decent set of results in years to come.

I am sooo sick of this softly softly approach to teaching where every child is valued and pussyfooted around because 'he does not like the teacher' or 'he just does not like the subject'. These are not primary school children and in life he is not going to gel with everyone but will still be expected to get on with it.

A bright child who is capable of so much more needs to be pushed to fulfill his potential and a short sharp shock and some cruel-to-be-kindness may just do the trick.

Like I said, I don't agree with all the teacher said but can empathise with a frustrated teacher who sees a bright child fall by the wayside.

[BehindLockNumberNine]

Goblin, I did not read what the teacher said as an attack on SEN kids, merely an indication of where OP's son would end up if he did not work - not making anything of his life when he is capable of more. I don't think the teacher was saying SEN kids don't make anything of their lives, she was illustrating to the OP's ds how lucky (in relative terms) he was to be able to do more if only he was willing to start work and stop mucking around.

[Goblinchild]

Then that's what she should have said, without reference to SEN children, or the implication that if you fail exams you will never make anything of yourself.

[BehindLockNumberNine]

Yes, I agree with you. As I said in my first post, I don't agree with ALL the teacher said. (sorry for shouting that word, have had wine and finger control to embolden a word has gone...)

I gather from the OP the head will have words with the teacher in question. And the teacher will be made to apologize. Which is good and how it should be.

And I hope that OP's ds pulls his socks up because if he is a bright lad then the world is his oyster and he should not spoil it by acting the prat in class, whether he likes his teacher or not.

[cinpin]

Well your son sounds very much liked mine trouble is when they get a bad name it sticks.

This went on for weeks with my son saying the teacher had it him for him I was very supportive of the school, then they gave him a mentor who sat in on the lesson who agreed my son was singled out and picked on. So dont think your son is in the wrong all the time.

[Jill72]

Believe me - teachers do not have the time or energy to go out of their way to 'have it in' for kids. Teaching can be a slow drip of low level disruptive behaviour from several kids in one class and even as experienced and effective teachers it can take it's toll. Teachers just want to teach. Many parents would be horrified if they saw how their kids behaved in school and kids ARE NOT going to tell you that when they get pulled up for it! I was head of year for 7 years and am guilty of making THE PHONE CALLS HOME. I can tell you that if the school is repeatedly on the phone then there are issues going on - I did not have time to follow up insignificant problems. I would be open minded and ready to listen to the teacher in the class first.

[Scholes34]

OP's son is in a fortunate position in that this has all come to a head before he starts in the upper school. He should ensure he uses the opportunity to start off on the right foot. I've emphasised to my children the need to get a good reputation with the teachers from the start. Misbehave on day one and no matter how hard you try, you'll find it extremely difficult to shake off the bad pupil image.

[onceamai]

I'm afraid I've had to deal with the other side of your son's behaviour. My DD has come home in tears on numerous occasions because of low level disruption during lessons for almost two years which have prevented those who wish to be educated from learning. Rubber bands have been thrown, paper has been thrown, water has been flicked - and it is very upsetting for the children on the receiving end. It has ruined her transfer to secondary school and destroyed my faith in state schools in the UK. There is a minority in her year who have ruined the educational experience of the majority and teachers have taken a far too softly softly approach. In my opinion the children concerned should be permanently excluded to send a message into their communities that anti-social and disrespectful behaviour will not be tolerated. My dd is lucky she is transferring to the independent sector next year. I am very sad for the hard working, pleasant, well behaved girls who have to stay there and also for some absolutely brilliant teachers who should not have to spend their time dealing with disgraceful and disrespectful behaviour. I don't want to be rude OP but I hope you have actually considered the impact of your son's behaviour on other children.

[Goblinchild]

l like l
l_l

Closest I can get to a 'like' button.
Low level disruption is a destroyer of many other children's learning.

[Goblinchild]

I shou;d have hit 'preview'

[cinpin]

Good luck for your daughter onceamai when she starts her new school. I however do not think that a child should be exluded for throwing a rubber.

Not all teachers are brilliant there is good and bad which is the same for independant schools.

[EvilTwins]

cinpin - "I however do not think that a child should be exluded for throwing a rubber."

You've missed the point here - if throwing the rubber was an isolated incident, then you're right, but it's not.

Low level disruption is the biggest issue in the school where I teach. It is also the most difficult to deal with - we have a fairly robust system of behaviour management, but kids will argue if you, as a teacher, impose sanctions for something they consider to be petty - like throwing a rubber, or too much talking. The biggest reason for imposing sanctions at school is "tooting" - talking out of turn. Thing is, every time I have to pull a child up because of that, I have to stop teaching.

[onceamai]

Then I'm afraid I say, three strikes at tooting and they are out of the classroom. It is low level, it is minor in itself but there is no way the disruption by two or three should be allowed to prevent the learning of 27. The funding needs to change so that there are more special units for the unteachable. It can't be fun for teachers and it certainly isn't fun for those who want to learn.

[ZhenXiang]

he was a failure, would end up in the bottom set with the SEN kids, would fail his exams and never make anything of himself

If the teacher truly did say that I would say you need to make a complaint about the teacher and a written apology made by the teacher to DS and yourself.

Your son's reaction to call her a name means that he should be disciplined by the school and yourself, but I can understand why he reacted in anger to such an unprofessional and derogatory comment. Teachers deal with low level behaviour every day and must remain the adults in the situation which means not stooping to public humiliation and put downs.

Aside from this I would say that you need to come down hard on your DS for not doing his homework, classwork and disrupting classes as it will not only affect his future grades and chances, but also affects the education of other children in his class.

[cardibach]

Glad you have resolved this sensibly, OP.
On the topic of the teacher's words, though, is it possible she said something like 'You are failing to achieve your potential, you have no SEN so have no reason to go into the bottom set, but if you don't work harder you will fail your exams and not make the most of your life'? I still don't really like the reference to SEN, mind you, it is unnecessary if it was made.
I know comments such as I have suggested from teachers are often represented by pupils as something similar to what your son reports.

[sunshinenanny]

Jill72 Teachers do sometimes develop an undeserved dislike of a child and can, whether intentional or not take that to the level of a form of bullying.

I'm sure the mentor who sat in on cinpin's ds lessons had no reason to lie when he confirmed the boy's complaint that he was being picked on. Many years ago a teacher suggested to a friend of mine that her primary age son was uncontrollable and should be statemented as special needs. her doctor disagreed and his next teacher commented on what a delightful child he was to teach. He's now a happy well balanced young man doing well at university.

A professional teacher does not tell any child they will amount to nothing or that SEN children are somehow inferior. As a nanny who has worked with special needs children this attitude is wrong.

Having said that I realise many teachers are excellent at thier job, but it's wrong to assume they can never be wrong. All professions have good and bad members and this can cause problems.

The poster is not saying her son is an angel, or that his recent behaviour was acceptable but the teacher does not appear to have handled matters very well.

[cinpin]

Thankyou sunshine nanny this proves my point so glad that your friends son went on to uni and is doing well, and it was a personality clash with the first teacher.

Cardibach if you read back you willsee that the teacher did say this and not in the way you have put it, and I hope the OP sons gets an apology from her. If you speak to children with respect you normally get it back.