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Secondary education

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Yr 7 father christmas maths?

23 replies

Ilythia · 25/11/2010 21:31

I am trying to decide whether I can do a lesson for Year 7 on the 'maths' of father christmas, ie, how many children he has to visit and how long he has, to work out times/distance etc as a christmas activity.

I cannot decide (and neither can the other teachers) whether I can do this with a year 7 class or whether I would be better trying it with Year 8, or maybe 10Grin

What age would this be an 'ok' activity without possibly causing some of the class and their parents to hate me forever?

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Goblinchild · 25/11/2010 21:34

We do Christmas maths problems with everyone, including Y6.
I don't understand the problem.

colditz · 25/11/2010 21:36

Depends on whether some of the parents withdraw their children from religious education, as they would then be within their rights to withdraw them from your planned maths lesson.

Ilythia · 25/11/2010 21:37

Because some chiuldren in my class are, how shall I put it....they would love to upset another pupil who does believe by telling them he isn't real.

Are there likely to be any believers?

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Ilythia · 25/11/2010 21:38

NO,no re withdrawals I dont think, but good point. It's not a faith school either.

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Goblinchild · 25/11/2010 21:38

Father Christmas is secular surely, a tradition rather than a component of a faith.
Some of the other legends of St Nicholas are even stranger. Grin

Goblinchild · 25/11/2010 21:40

The maths problems are unrelated to whether he exists or not, there'll be teasing in the playground whatever happens

LynetteScavo · 25/11/2010 21:40

It will be fine. All Y7's know FC has magic sparkle dust to help him on his way. Wink

And of course manyu will have follow him on the NASSA Santa tracker thingy.

But of course he only visits the western world, and a few odd children elsewhere, so I hope you have done your calculations of how many visits he has to make accurately.

Ilythia · 25/11/2010 21:48

there are 5.58 Billion people
in the world, and of them, only 1.89 Billion are Christians.

from here goes into weight of gifts, percentage of good/bad and distance between bedrooms (allowing for an average of 2 children per family) so should keep them going for awhile...

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colditz · 25/11/2010 21:59

no believers at 11 and 12. they have (or should have) too good a knowledge of physics to believe in flying reindeer. All that is firmly knocked out by the age of 10, IMHO. my 7 year old is narrowing his eyes on the subject this year ("Are you sure, Mum?")

mumeeee · 26/11/2010 23:12

There might be some belivers. DD3 believed until she was almost 12 and I know one of her friends still believd at 12 years old, But both of them did'nt take any notice of other pupils saying he wasn't real.

WilfShelf · 26/11/2010 23:20

Ahem. I can confirm that despite us being rampant atheists, Father Christmas manages to visit here.

He ain't no Christian anyhow...

onimolap · 26/11/2010 23:27

I think in secondary school it's ok. And if you call him Father Christmas you take him back to his secular roots too.

Would you be able to post the Father Christmas challenge on MN? It sounds like the kind of thing I'd like to encourage DS to have a go at.

GrimmaTheNome · 26/11/2010 23:34

If they are stupid gullible innocent enough to still believe in FC by secondary school, they surely won't let a bit of evidence shatter their delusions illusions. They'll just think he's even more magical.

LynetteScavo · 27/11/2010 07:38

coldizt, it's not about physics, it's about magic!

Ilythia · 27/11/2010 08:49

Stop messing with my lesson plans!

My friends 12 yo is a believer still but I am going to aim it as a 'this is why he is real and proves how magic he is, so shoudl be ok.

The link I posted to above links to a site with quotes from a presentation about this, I was going to nick the maths and play around a bit to make the sums up myself. WIll share it when I have if you like.

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LynetteScavo · 27/11/2010 09:04

Please do! Smile

ShanahansRevenge · 27/11/2010 09:10

Colditz is right...however the few who still believe will not have their belief shaken by a few non-believers...if you're believing at 11 then you won't simply stop...if you know the truth it takes more than a snidey comment to shatter the image of FC. Grin I am 38 and there is still a tiny grain of belief in me....

LynetteScavo · 27/11/2010 09:18

ShanahansRevenge, well said! Me too!

ShanahansRevenge · 27/11/2010 09:21
Grin
empirestateofmind · 27/11/2010 09:30

Yes please share- marking my place as always on the look out for new resources!

Ilythia · 27/11/2010 10:25

This is what I have so far, covers decimals, fractions, percentages, long division and multiplication and saying/writing large numbers. Am quite pleased actually!
Needs some tidying I know but am on rubbish netbook so it's not that easy.

Father christmas Maths

Exactly how magic is Father Christmas?

We are going to do an investigation into the mathematics of Father Christmas, and hopefully end up with some interesting statistics by the end of the lesson. The basic facts you will be supplied with are approximate and as follows;

There are 5.58 Billion people in the world
There are approximately 1.89 Billion are Christians.

If a quarter of these people are children under 15 (as Father Christmas doesn't deliver to adults), how many stockings does he have to deliver? 473 million children

We can estimate that each stocking weighs 0.5kg, and a lump of coal weighs 0.1kg.
If most children (say 80%) are nice and the rest are naughty, how much weight will Father Christmas have to carry at the start of his night?

80% of 473 Million is about 380 million presents, so 190 millionkg for stockings (convert to 190'000 tons)
Coal ? 95 million lumps, 0.1kg or 100g each becomes 10'000 tons of coal

If the average number of children in a family is 2, how many stops does he have to make?
236 million

What is the best path to use to get these presents as quickly as possible, without wasting time retracing his steps? It turns out that mathematicians have been trying to figure out this problem for about 100 years. The problem is so well-known that it even has a name: "The Travelling Salesman Problem".

It turns out that nobody has yet solved the "Travelling Salesman Problem", not even with the fastest computers on earth, because there are so many different arrangements to check. But Father Christmas is really clever , so we decided that he has established out the best possible path to take.

Now we have to work out how far the average distance was going to be from one household to the next. After all, some people live in apartment buildings. Other people live spread out on farms. And of course, Father Christmas needs to cross oceans as well.

(Can use average of 10m as it makes for easy maths, or make it harder depending on level)

Now we know how many stops he has to make, and the distance between each one, how far will he have to travel?

(If using 10m, 2.36 million kilometers, or about 1.4 million miles)

Introduce daylight saving with time a map of the world such as

www.custom-counter.com/resim.php?resim=http%3Asydaby.eget.net/swe/pics/time_zones.jpg&title=world%20time%20gmt%3A%20gullu

Work out how long he has to travel round the world from first dusk on Christmas eve to sunrise on Christmas day
(almost 40 hours)

Since speed is equal to distance divided by time, use the distance Father Christmas has to travel and divide it by the time he has in hours to gain his speed in an hour.
Devise a way to find his speed per minute and per second

(10 miles per second ? use example of local 10 mile distance to consolidate)

Now use the number of stops he has to make divided by the time he has in hours to find how many stop Father Christmas has to make every hour. Then do as above and find the number of stop he has to make every minute and second.

(depending on figures you used, about 1600 stops per second)

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empirestateofmind · 28/11/2010 03:37

that is great- many thanks Ilythia

I like the use of the Travelling Salesman Problem- I could do this part with my Y12 D1 group (though they would think I had lost the plot)!

Ilythia · 28/11/2010 10:42

You're welcome. I am goign to neaten it up later, but you could play with the numbers and make it considerably harder with conversions/decimals/percentages etc.
The travelling salesman problem is very interesting, I remember us looking at it when doing a level work, on further thought I don't think I will mention it with my Yr 7's though, unless I want a room of blank facesGrin

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